wth is causing this...
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,754
Likes: 122
From: Maryland
wth is causing this...
Hey guys,
I have a 2009 FX4 w/5.4 and 60k on the odometer.
On Friday I was backing up my driveway after a short 4 mile drive and the truck's rpms dropped to 500 and the engine started knocking like crazy and shaking a lot. I could 'goose' the throttle to clear it up, but then the rpms dropped down again and it started up.
I did not get any check engine lights.
I shut the truck off and the next morning it started and ran fine. Today I am sitting at the dealer (as I type this) and they cannot duplicate it. Naturally, with no codes they seem to have no interest in a further diag.
I only use motor craft oil filters and motor craft 5w20 synthetic blend oil when I change the oil.
Any tips? I don't want to leave to have this happen again and start a viscous cycle of back and forth with no resolution.
help...
I have a 2009 FX4 w/5.4 and 60k on the odometer.
On Friday I was backing up my driveway after a short 4 mile drive and the truck's rpms dropped to 500 and the engine started knocking like crazy and shaking a lot. I could 'goose' the throttle to clear it up, but then the rpms dropped down again and it started up.
I did not get any check engine lights.
I shut the truck off and the next morning it started and ran fine. Today I am sitting at the dealer (as I type this) and they cannot duplicate it. Naturally, with no codes they seem to have no interest in a further diag.
I only use motor craft oil filters and motor craft 5w20 synthetic blend oil when I change the oil.
Any tips? I don't want to leave to have this happen again and start a viscous cycle of back and forth with no resolution.
help...
Cargo Master
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,061
Likes: 39
From: Laramie, WY
Too many possible causes for something like that. Intermittent failures are hard to diagnose.
Some possible causes:
Fuel pump
Fuel pressure regulator
Intake manifold pressure sensor
Throttle valve
Ignition system
That is just a quick list, there could be even more possibilities.
Good luck
Some possible causes:
Fuel pump
Fuel pressure regulator
Intake manifold pressure sensor
Throttle valve
Ignition system
That is just a quick list, there could be even more possibilities.
Good luck
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,504
Likes: 652
From: Sioux Falls Area
subscribing.
if you figure it out, let us all know.
my 2010 5.4 w/21k did the same thing early last week.
Exactly the same as you describe. No codes, so apparently, no problems.
has not done it since, either.
odd
if you figure it out, let us all know.
my 2010 5.4 w/21k did the same thing early last week.
Exactly the same as you describe. No codes, so apparently, no problems.
has not done it since, either.
odd
Cargo Master
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,061
Likes: 39
From: Laramie, WY
I have stood in their shoes before and since there weren't any codes set and they can't make it act up again, about the only thing they can do is search for what was found on other trucks having the same problem.
Cargo Master
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,061
Likes: 39
From: Laramie, WY
I deal with much larger and more expensive engines these days. We have continuous recording of engine parameters and they are stored for ever. For example, I can look back weeks, months, or years and trend the operating parameters at the time of a problem. SO when someone says something like the engine stumbled yesterday afternoon, I can look that time up and see what wasn't working correctly.
I don't know how far back they can see.
I don't know how far back they can see.
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,754
Likes: 122
From: Maryland
My BIL is a Ford mech (works on super duty trucks and up) and he said about the same thing: no codes makes it hard unless they can replicate it. I got the "only use Ford oil filters speech" too, but I do so no big deal.
I will post up if it happens again and if I get a code the next time. The past 3 times have not produced codes.
I will post up if it happens again and if I get a code the next time. The past 3 times have not produced codes.
Mountain Pass
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 223
Likes: 2
I am not sure if the 5.4 changed that much from 1998 to 2009 but I know my 98 5.4 was doing pretty much the same thing. After a couple days got to where it would not even idle without me giving it gas. Did some research and it was the idle air control valve. They were around 200-300 bucks at the time I think so I just took it off and cleaned it really well. Put it back on and drove it for months and never gave me another problem. This may not be your problem since your truck is newer but might be worth a shot since it is free if you have some carb cleaner, think that is what I used. Truck was about 10 years old and 140k miles when I had that problem.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,061
Likes: 39
From: Laramie, WY
I am not sure if the 5.4 changed that much from 1998 to 2009 but I know my 98 5.4 was doing pretty much the same thing. After a couple days got to where it would not even idle without me giving it gas. Did some research and it was the idle air control valve. They were around 200-300 bucks at the time I think so I just took it off and cleaned it really well. Put it back on and drove it for months and never gave me another problem. This may not be your problem since your truck is newer but might be worth a shot since it is free if you have some carb cleaner, think that is what I used. Truck was about 10 years old and 140k miles when I had that problem.
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Moderator
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,504
Likes: 652
From: Sioux Falls Area
with throttle by wire, i'm not sure if there even is a IAC anymore. have to do some checking on that, i suppose.
if his was doing anything like mine, it is a severe miss.
there was also a heavy clatter from the front of the engine, which sounded to me like a cam phaser what was bottoming out.
i suppose if the cam phasers were all goofed up and not getting the proper signal or oil flow, what i felt may have been a heavy "lope" due to the cam or cams being severely retarded at idle.... just hard to tell. it sounded very unhappy when it happened to mine. we take our trucks to the caddy/mercedes dealer for oil changes. can't remember what type of filter they use, but it is castrol oil. assuming a castrol filter is used, which is made by wix, the filter really shouldn't be a problem either. but who knows. one thing for sure, though, is where we go for oil changes is not open for discussion ... i've tried.
hopefully it was a one time deal, but time will tell.
if his was doing anything like mine, it is a severe miss.
there was also a heavy clatter from the front of the engine, which sounded to me like a cam phaser what was bottoming out.
i suppose if the cam phasers were all goofed up and not getting the proper signal or oil flow, what i felt may have been a heavy "lope" due to the cam or cams being severely retarded at idle.... just hard to tell. it sounded very unhappy when it happened to mine. we take our trucks to the caddy/mercedes dealer for oil changes. can't remember what type of filter they use, but it is castrol oil. assuming a castrol filter is used, which is made by wix, the filter really shouldn't be a problem either. but who knows. one thing for sure, though, is where we go for oil changes is not open for discussion ... i've tried.
hopefully it was a one time deal, but time will tell.
Moderator
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 6,504
Likes: 652
From: Sioux Falls Area
thought i'd give an update.
yesterday my check engine light came on. engine ran fine, but i took it in to the dealership (still under warranty) to find out what's up.
my CEL came on because my air box came loose. it thew two lean codes related to unmetered air due to the air box deal.
but i asked them about the rough idle and he said that there were two old codes in there for the camshaft position sensor. so it appears that the rough idle may have been related to either the cam phasers not responding they way there were supposed to, or a cam sensor that was not reading correctly.
if it happens again, i'll take it in straight away in hopes of them catching what is going on in real time.
but anyway, i'd take the truck in and see if there are old codes stored in the memory, my guess there will be, even if the CEL never came on. they can read pending codes as well, that is, problems that are problems but have not yet happened often enough to set the CEL. those pending or stored codes may give you an indication as to what was going on.
good luck.
hopefully it was just a one-time deal for me, as my 3/36 is up next month (based on the in service date).
yesterday my check engine light came on. engine ran fine, but i took it in to the dealership (still under warranty) to find out what's up.
my CEL came on because my air box came loose. it thew two lean codes related to unmetered air due to the air box deal.
but i asked them about the rough idle and he said that there were two old codes in there for the camshaft position sensor. so it appears that the rough idle may have been related to either the cam phasers not responding they way there were supposed to, or a cam sensor that was not reading correctly.
if it happens again, i'll take it in straight away in hopes of them catching what is going on in real time.
but anyway, i'd take the truck in and see if there are old codes stored in the memory, my guess there will be, even if the CEL never came on. they can read pending codes as well, that is, problems that are problems but have not yet happened often enough to set the CEL. those pending or stored codes may give you an indication as to what was going on.
good luck.
hopefully it was just a one-time deal for me, as my 3/36 is up next month (based on the in service date).
Thread Starter
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,754
Likes: 122
From: Maryland
Thanks for the update.
They did find codes relating to my battery being low, but nothing else.
I am going to replace the battery, but I am doubtful it was the cause of my problems.
They did find codes relating to my battery being low, but nothing else.
I am going to replace the battery, but I am doubtful it was the cause of my problems.
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