Carburetor Help, please :)
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 22,415
Likes: 92
From: Denver Metro Area, CO
OK, I made a new photobucket album for you, the old links will no longer work.
The new location is:
For logmode Photos by ctubutis | Photobucket
The top level contains:
- The two pinout schematics from the last one
- KOEO Procedures & Results
- KOER Procedures & Results
This album contains three sub-folders:
- DF
- HB
- KF
Those are clickable, I can't find any other way for you to be able to see that those subfolders exist.
Each has the respective Pinpoint Tests from the 1986 factory shop manual as per the error codes you reported.
The first thing I would do is re-run the KOER tests but do the WOT/brake pedal/steering wheel/etc. when prompted to by the computer. At a minimum, that should eliminated the 72 & 73 errors.
You are telling us of only one code in KOEO - that being 22 - and that is the first thing listed by the KOER test.
That is where you need to focus - the DF stuff. For the KOEO error, it has you starting at DF 1; the KOER stuff begins at DF 7.
DF 0 is the first page, and it tells you of other possible problems that the computer may or may not know about but that can cause DF errors.
I don't know what a MAP tester is, Bill (85lebaront2) may know. But you say you replaced that device presumably with a known-good one, that should eliminate a lot of diagnosis (or at least make it different).
Do you have a hand-operated vacuum pump and vacuum gauge? If not, go get this stuff. You cannot own a 25 yo truck and not have tools to diagnose and repair it.
Any time you make a change to the truck, re-rerun the tests.
The book says to go service the other codes if everything MAP-related tests out as OK, that's what the HB and KF stuff is. Error 42 in KOER, for the 4.9, goto HB20; Error 58 in KOER, for the 4.9, goto KF12.
You asked about the error 58 and why did it show up when oldfuelinjection.com (or whomever) says it shouldn't be in KOER.
Well, these online places do their best but the fact is this stuff is just way too complicated... you cannot condense into a single sentence 10 years worth of the evolution of computerized engine management across their entire product line.
The book sometimes shows different procedures for cars vs trucks, and for different engines.
Those online places generally will have none of that, everything gets condensed and lumped together, with the result being they are sometimes wrong.
The factory books rock and show up on ebay and such periodically. Go look up KOER Error 58 on a 4.9, it is nothing at all like what the online stuff says.
</o</o
The new location is:
For logmode Photos by ctubutis | Photobucket
The top level contains:
- The two pinout schematics from the last one
- KOEO Procedures & Results
- KOER Procedures & Results
This album contains three sub-folders:
- DF
- HB
- KF
Those are clickable, I can't find any other way for you to be able to see that those subfolders exist.
Each has the respective Pinpoint Tests from the 1986 factory shop manual as per the error codes you reported.
<o
These are the code that I read during the KOER<o
22 MAP/BP sensor out of self test range.<o
42 No HEGO switching detected always rich (right side).<o
Next one down (58) does not have an X under KOER on the code list, but it came from the KOER test. Why would it do this<o
58 VAT indicated -40�F / circuit open.<o
72 Insufficient MAF/MAP change during Dynamic Response Test (user error).<o
<o73 TPS senor did not exceed 25% rotation during Dynamic Response Test (user error).<o
If this was you were would you start and do what?<o</o</o</o</o</o</o</o</o
These are the code that I read during the KOER<o
22 MAP/BP sensor out of self test range.<o
42 No HEGO switching detected always rich (right side).<o
Next one down (58) does not have an X under KOER on the code list, but it came from the KOER test. Why would it do this<o
58 VAT indicated -40�F / circuit open.<o
72 Insufficient MAF/MAP change during Dynamic Response Test (user error).<o
<o
73 TPS senor did not exceed 25% rotation during Dynamic Response Test (user error).<oIf this was you were would you start and do what?<o
</o</o</o</o</o</o</o</oThe first thing I would do is re-run the KOER tests but do the WOT/brake pedal/steering wheel/etc. when prompted to by the computer. At a minimum, that should eliminated the 72 & 73 errors.
You are telling us of only one code in KOEO - that being 22 - and that is the first thing listed by the KOER test.
That is where you need to focus - the DF stuff. For the KOEO error, it has you starting at DF 1; the KOER stuff begins at DF 7.
DF 0 is the first page, and it tells you of other possible problems that the computer may or may not know about but that can cause DF errors.
I don't know what a MAP tester is, Bill (85lebaront2) may know. But you say you replaced that device presumably with a known-good one, that should eliminate a lot of diagnosis (or at least make it different).
Do you have a hand-operated vacuum pump and vacuum gauge? If not, go get this stuff. You cannot own a 25 yo truck and not have tools to diagnose and repair it.
Any time you make a change to the truck, re-rerun the tests.
The book says to go service the other codes if everything MAP-related tests out as OK, that's what the HB and KF stuff is. Error 42 in KOER, for the 4.9, goto HB20; Error 58 in KOER, for the 4.9, goto KF12.
You asked about the error 58 and why did it show up when oldfuelinjection.com (or whomever) says it shouldn't be in KOER.
Well, these online places do their best but the fact is this stuff is just way too complicated... you cannot condense into a single sentence 10 years worth of the evolution of computerized engine management across their entire product line.
The book sometimes shows different procedures for cars vs trucks, and for different engines.
Those online places generally will have none of that, everything gets condensed and lumped together, with the result being they are sometimes wrong.
The factory books rock and show up on ebay and such periodically. Go look up KOER Error 58 on a 4.9, it is nothing at all like what the online stuff says.
</o</o
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New User
Joined: Nov 2012
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help on ford f150 4.9l 1986
Hi, thank you for all that you have done for me, I would really appreciate if you could help me with my following questions.
1. There is a look like solenoid valve that is attached to the PCV valve hose. The PCV has a two port and one goes to this valve, then to the CANP line. Is the ecc controlling this and if so, why is it not on the eec wiring schematic? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...mode/pin-1.jpg)(pin out 1). and what is it called?
<O
2. Would you look at this and see if it is correct? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...Procedures.jpg)( KOEO Procedures).
Happy Thanks Givings<O
1. There is a look like solenoid valve that is attached to the PCV valve hose. The PCV has a two port and one goes to this valve, then to the CANP line. Is the ecc controlling this and if so, why is it not on the eec wiring schematic? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...mode/pin-1.jpg)(pin out 1). and what is it called?
<O
2. Would you look at this and see if it is correct? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...Procedures.jpg)( KOEO Procedures).
Happy Thanks Givings<O
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 8,786
Likes: 28
From: Northern California
Hi, thank you for all that you have done for me, I would really appreciate if you could help me with my following questions.
1. There is a look like solenoid valve that is attached to the PCV valve hose. The PCV has a two port and one goes to this valve, then to the CANP line. Is the ecc controlling this and if so, why is it not on the eec wiring schematic? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...mode/pin-1.jpg)(pin out 1). and what is it called?
<O
2. Would you look at this and see if it is correct? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...Procedures.jpg)( KOEO Procedures).
Happy Thanks Givings<O
1. There is a look like solenoid valve that is attached to the PCV valve hose. The PCV has a two port and one goes to this valve, then to the CANP line. Is the ecc controlling this and if so, why is it not on the eec wiring schematic? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...mode/pin-1.jpg)(pin out 1). and what is it called?
<O
2. Would you look at this and see if it is correct? (http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/...Procedures.jpg)( KOEO Procedures).
Happy Thanks Givings<O
It connects the Charcoal Canister to the PCV system to burn stored up evaporative emissions from the gasoline tanks and carburetor bowl. When the truck is parked, gasoline evaporates and is stored in the Charcoal canister located on the right front framerail. The Gasoline tanks and the carb bowl vent lines has a direct line to the Charcoal Canister.
There is another line that goes from the Charcoal Canister to the Canister Purge solenoid, and from there to the PCV valve. (The line can be tee'd off the carb bowl to charcoal canister line)
When the truck is started, and running, the EEC will purge the Charcoal Canister of it's stored fumes. Usually after engine is warm.
The connector for it is listed as canister purge (CANP) in the diagram.
The Canister purge solenoid is a two port valve, with a electrical connector on the bottom, somewhat similar in looks to the feedback solenoid except the top portion (IE where the two hose ports are located).
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 22,415
Likes: 92
From: Denver Metro Area, CO
logmode, listen to 81-F-150-EXPLORER (in all caps and not his real name cuz that's how he refers to me sometimes 
) as he's been doing this stuff professionally for a long time, I'm just a backyard hick and, in fact, learn a lot from him. 
) as he's been doing this stuff professionally for a long time, I'm just a backyard hick and, in fact, learn a lot from him.
Thread Starter
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New User
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 15
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Hi
Thank you for that nice explanation of a canister purge, now I know what it is and does, although this system has two one port solenoid valves instead of one two port solenoid valve.
I am going through eec harness vac lines. I cannot find the time delay power relay. Do you know where it is? Thank you.
Thank you for that nice explanation of a canister purge, now I know what it is and does, although this system has two one port solenoid valves instead of one two port solenoid valve.
I am going through eec harness vac lines. I cannot find the time delay power relay. Do you know where it is? Thank you.
Thread Starter
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New User
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 15
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back again
Hi
Second wind, try again, here goes!
The Truck still sitting and battery is still cranking without a charge, amazing. But now more, ignition is fouled. This truck has a TFI, a three part ignition, pick-up, amp, and computer control. And I am just guessing here but that pick-up is probably controlling more than the ignition. Well any ways, I want to remove the TFI and disconnect the pick-up from the computer, and put an independent ignition in. Could someone tell me what year truck had an independent ignition module, 300 straight six, closest to 1986, that I could pop in? Also would I have to change the distributor? Oh ya I know the Carb. feed back may not work properly without a pick-up. I don’t care I will deal with it.
Thx log
Second wind, try again, here goes!
The Truck still sitting and battery is still cranking without a charge, amazing. But now more, ignition is fouled. This truck has a TFI, a three part ignition, pick-up, amp, and computer control. And I am just guessing here but that pick-up is probably controlling more than the ignition. Well any ways, I want to remove the TFI and disconnect the pick-up from the computer, and put an independent ignition in. Could someone tell me what year truck had an independent ignition module, 300 straight six, closest to 1986, that I could pop in? Also would I have to change the distributor? Oh ya I know the Carb. feed back may not work properly without a pick-up. I don’t care I will deal with it.
Thx log
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