v10 plug change using impact
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
v10 plug change using impact
Hey,
I just thought I'd post my results for the plug change.
I'm not finished yet, I'm done 6 of 10. It took about 3 hrs.
I drove home from the stealership with new plugs.
After receiving a quote for $1100 to do the swap, I decided to do it myself.
So I figured the hell with it, if they are gonna break, they are gonna break.
So I used my makita impact driver. 5 came out no problem, 1 broke. HOT engine. The one that broke was the coldest
Overall, if nothing else I avoided the sickening process of slooowly turning them out by hand.
I had one hiccup, my napa plug removal tool pushed the porcelain in too far which caused about 1/8" of the electrode to break off and a small piece of the porcelain to break off maybe the size of a grain of rice.
I put the compressed air nozzle inside the combustion chamber for approx 20-30 seconds. Then started it for about 20-30 seconds without the new plug in.
I did see some stuff fly around when it was running, not sure if it was everything.
After all 6 were reinstalled, i let it run for 5 minutes and it sounds smooth and quiet.
So somebody tell me that the debris has passed out the exhaust. Please?
I just thought I'd post my results for the plug change.
I'm not finished yet, I'm done 6 of 10. It took about 3 hrs.
I drove home from the stealership with new plugs.
After receiving a quote for $1100 to do the swap, I decided to do it myself.
So I figured the hell with it, if they are gonna break, they are gonna break.
So I used my makita impact driver. 5 came out no problem, 1 broke. HOT engine. The one that broke was the coldest
Overall, if nothing else I avoided the sickening process of slooowly turning them out by hand.
I had one hiccup, my napa plug removal tool pushed the porcelain in too far which caused about 1/8" of the electrode to break off and a small piece of the porcelain to break off maybe the size of a grain of rice.
I put the compressed air nozzle inside the combustion chamber for approx 20-30 seconds. Then started it for about 20-30 seconds without the new plug in.
I did see some stuff fly around when it was running, not sure if it was everything.
After all 6 were reinstalled, i let it run for 5 minutes and it sounds smooth and quiet.
So somebody tell me that the debris has passed out the exhaust. Please?
Fleet Owner
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 27,307
Likes: 549
From: Spanaway
Vacuum would of been better. Also a bore scope would of helped
to find the chips/junk and then remove with the vacuum.
To answer your question is a guess
I always worry when some thing get into a cylinder.
Sean
to find the chips/junk and then remove with the vacuum.
To answer your question is a guess
I always worry when some thing get into a cylinder.
Sean
Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 25,479
Likes: 742
From: Isanti, MN
Not sure that running the engine to eject the electrode was a smart thing to do. Here's a 6.7L diesel engine that had a cracked valve; the fragments from the valve destroyed the cylinder. The fix was $15K for a new engine, but covered under warranty for this guy.
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
I was watching this guy, and did a little research.
Ford 5.4 Liter 3 Valve Spark Plug Removal - YouTube
From what I can tell, the impact method is the best.
I have 120k miles on it and one of 6 broke so far.
2 Hours to do 10 plugs? If that's true I'm impressed, you could start a spark plug changing service. I was quoted $1100 minus $250 for plugs.
If I do the math, that makes $425/hr
Ford 5.4 Liter 3 Valve Spark Plug Removal - YouTube
From what I can tell, the impact method is the best.
I have 120k miles on it and one of 6 broke so far.
2 Hours to do 10 plugs? If that's true I'm impressed, you could start a spark plug changing service. I was quoted $1100 minus $250 for plugs.
If I do the math, that makes $425/hr
Lead Driver
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,757
Likes: 5
From: Corvallis, OR
Impact is the best method... if you want to break plugs. The best method is a high end penetrating oil squirted in the night before, then gone through one heat cycle and remove plugs with slow even pressure with a hand tool. Plug bodies are brittle, impact is the last thing you want to use.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
Here's an update,
I did 2 more after dinner tonight.
I used the impact on for one plug on the cold engine and removed it intact,
And I used the ford tsb (hand tools and penetrating oil) for the rear most passenger side plug and broke it.
So using the impact, I have 6 successes 1 failure
Using the ford tab, I'm 0 for 1
We'll see how the last 2 go tomorrow
And an update to the piece of metal that fell in. I am now positive that the grounding strap just broke and deformed. Meaning I don't believe any metal fell in. Just a teeny piece of porcelain. When I pulled the broken one tonight, It looked exactly the same as the other broken one.
The strap broke when the porcelain pushed on it. Once it was out of the truck I broke off the porcelain piece and was able to reform the metal ground strap back to the original shape.
Regardless, I am going to try to rig up a shop vac to see if I can fish out the sliver of porcelain.
I have to say I'm sold on the impact method. I have to clarify this is a 1/4" impact driver, designed to drive deck screws. Not a shop air tool I bet it puts out less than 80 ft/lb
I did 2 more after dinner tonight.
I used the impact on for one plug on the cold engine and removed it intact,
And I used the ford tsb (hand tools and penetrating oil) for the rear most passenger side plug and broke it.
So using the impact, I have 6 successes 1 failure
Using the ford tab, I'm 0 for 1
We'll see how the last 2 go tomorrow
And an update to the piece of metal that fell in. I am now positive that the grounding strap just broke and deformed. Meaning I don't believe any metal fell in. Just a teeny piece of porcelain. When I pulled the broken one tonight, It looked exactly the same as the other broken one.
The strap broke when the porcelain pushed on it. Once it was out of the truck I broke off the porcelain piece and was able to reform the metal ground strap back to the original shape.
Regardless, I am going to try to rig up a shop vac to see if I can fish out the sliver of porcelain.
I have to say I'm sold on the impact method. I have to clarify this is a 1/4" impact driver, designed to drive deck screws. Not a shop air tool I bet it puts out less than 80 ft/lb
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,155
Likes: 31
From: Idaho
Impact
I have been changing plugs for 20 years. Never Have I broke one. Slow and easy is the way to work on engines.
If I had parts inside cylinder I would pull the head to get to the part. I do recommend NOT running the engine until you have all the parts.
If you do run engine with the part in it you will most likely scare the wall of the cylinder. At that point you will be be looking at a rebuilt engine.
Take your time to think about the processs and you will get done faster with less errors. Errors cost Time and Money.
If I had parts inside cylinder I would pull the head to get to the part. I do recommend NOT running the engine until you have all the parts.
If you do run engine with the part in it you will most likely scare the wall of the cylinder. At that point you will be be looking at a rebuilt engine.
Take your time to think about the processs and you will get done faster with less errors. Errors cost Time and Money.
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Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
Likes: 0
From: Calgary Alberta Canada
20 yrs for me too.
Never broke a spark plug till yesterday.
If you don't know there is a bit of an "issue" removing the plugs from the early 3v triton motors.
I-Team: $2,000 spark plugs, what some call design flaw, Ford calls routine
FROM THE ARTICLE
Why do you think they quoted me $1100?
There is not a chance I am removing the head for a sliver of porcelain.
Never broke a spark plug till yesterday.
If you don't know there is a bit of an "issue" removing the plugs from the early 3v triton motors.
I-Team: $2,000 spark plugs, what some call design flaw, Ford calls routine
FROM THE ARTICLE
The culprit lies in a design Ford used in eight models between 2004 and 2008. Mechanics at Ford dealerships and independent auto shops say the plugs are prone to breaking even when the most expert mechanic does the work, with the risk of shards landing in the engine cylinder, requiring engine removal on rare occasions.
There is not a chance I am removing the head for a sliver of porcelain.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
The point of this thread was to tell anyone who was interested about my experiences while doing the spark plug change.
I got the dealer quote. The cheapest was $1100 So that ruled out having a dealer do it.
I've rebuilt engines, installed lift kits, redone axle bearings and seals, brakes, replaced clutches, transfer cases, even kingpins.
I am by no means the greatest mechanic around, but I am reasonably good with wrenches.
Lie most people who do this job, I researched The procedure for several weeks beforehand.
I read countless threads from people who had done the job. I got the removal tool, I made sure I had the nickel anti seize, I bought the new motorcraft plugs sp515's I think.
I researched the different methods. Then I had to decide on how I was going to go about removing them.
After all the reading I did, I could not find one person who had a bad experience with the impact, again this is a low power impact. Not the kind to remove lug nuts. Not once could I find that anyone did damage to the threads. Never.
I read in several places that many shops only use an impact now. When you think About it, it makes perfect sense. The way an impact works is exactly the way you would want for wedged in carbon.
Like I said, you can add me to the list of people who have had success with this method. I am writing to get the information out there.
I got the dealer quote. The cheapest was $1100 So that ruled out having a dealer do it.
I've rebuilt engines, installed lift kits, redone axle bearings and seals, brakes, replaced clutches, transfer cases, even kingpins.
I am by no means the greatest mechanic around, but I am reasonably good with wrenches.
Lie most people who do this job, I researched The procedure for several weeks beforehand.
I read countless threads from people who had done the job. I got the removal tool, I made sure I had the nickel anti seize, I bought the new motorcraft plugs sp515's I think.
I researched the different methods. Then I had to decide on how I was going to go about removing them.
After all the reading I did, I could not find one person who had a bad experience with the impact, again this is a low power impact. Not the kind to remove lug nuts. Not once could I find that anyone did damage to the threads. Never.
I read in several places that many shops only use an impact now. When you think About it, it makes perfect sense. The way an impact works is exactly the way you would want for wedged in carbon.
Like I said, you can add me to the list of people who have had success with this method. I am writing to get the information out there.
Hotshot
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 13,484
Likes: 42
From: Stevens Point, WI
To be honest I have had the best luck using an impact for stuff that normally breaks when using hand tools. Like exhaust studs/bolts.
I would not be surprised that a impact would work good for spark plugs however, if the plug breaks free and then starts to gall the threads you won't know it till your holding the spark plug in your hands with the head threads on the plug yet.
I am curious if in the newer trucks 2010-2012 if ford has switched from the stone age taper plugs to the washer style plugs? That would end all the spark plug problems right there!
I would not be surprised that a impact would work good for spark plugs however, if the plug breaks free and then starts to gall the threads you won't know it till your holding the spark plug in your hands with the head threads on the plug yet.
I am curious if in the newer trucks 2010-2012 if ford has switched from the stone age taper plugs to the washer style plugs? That would end all the spark plug problems right there!
Hotshot
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 13,484
Likes: 42
From: Stevens Point, WI
That motor looks super super similar to a two stoke type motor as far as head stud hole locations, water jackets, and over all layout.
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
Ok, Last update.
I am done all 10. At 120k miles I was pushing my luck.
Out of the 10, I was able to use the impact for 8. The other 2 were by hand.
I had a total of 3 breaks. 1 with the impact, 2 with the socket set.
So these are the stats.
---impact.= 7 successful extractions
1 Failure
---Socket set = 0 successful extractions
2 failures.
The Broken ones were the 2 Farthest back on each side.
(I couldn't reach with the impact)
And the front driver side.
Overall I would personally use the impact again. I had no issues. I understand that this may freak out some people, and I understand. But for me it seems like it is far far less likely to cause plug breakage. YMMV
I would rate the spark plug changing job as a 6 out of 10
It was a pain in the butt but not too difficult.
The removal tool works fantastic.
I spent approx 6 hrs total from start to finish. The hype surrounding the job is definitly worse than the job itself.
I am done all 10. At 120k miles I was pushing my luck.
Out of the 10, I was able to use the impact for 8. The other 2 were by hand.
I had a total of 3 breaks. 1 with the impact, 2 with the socket set.
So these are the stats.
---impact.= 7 successful extractions
1 Failure
---Socket set = 0 successful extractions
2 failures.
The Broken ones were the 2 Farthest back on each side.
(I couldn't reach with the impact) And the front driver side.
Overall I would personally use the impact again. I had no issues. I understand that this may freak out some people, and I understand. But for me it seems like it is far far less likely to cause plug breakage. YMMV
I would rate the spark plug changing job as a 6 out of 10
It was a pain in the butt but not too difficult.
The removal tool works fantastic.
I spent approx 6 hrs total from start to finish. The hype surrounding the job is definitly worse than the job itself.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 287
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
I probably spent 2 of the hours extracting the broken ones. The worst one was the rear Drivers side. The plug was broken, I could tell and the threads were completely unscrewed, but the plug was still stuck in there.
I think the electrode was attached on the bottom and the top. This prevented me from pulling it out. I soaked the whole thing with a high quality penetrating oil and let it sit for 30 minutes. Eventually I was able to reach in the hole with a set of needle nose and work it out. But I wasted at least an hour on that one alone.
I hear you about the 2v motors. I did my 2v 5.4 in about 2.5 hrs.
I think the electrode was attached on the bottom and the top. This prevented me from pulling it out. I soaked the whole thing with a high quality penetrating oil and let it sit for 30 minutes. Eventually I was able to reach in the hole with a set of needle nose and work it out. But I wasted at least an hour on that one alone.
I hear you about the 2v motors. I did my 2v 5.4 in about 2.5 hrs.