351 vs. 460
Logistics Pro
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,635
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From: Lansdale, PA
Who cares about gas mileage when the 351 can't pull an empty paper bag off the porch. Haha
Rule of thumb that I've lived by.... 351, power of a 302, fuel mileage of a 460.
In a half ton I can see going with a 351. Other then the option of mass air and 4r70w I'd never own one with a 302. An f250 is junk with a 351. Sorry guys that have them, but I'm right and you're wrong.
460 is the way to go if you tow stuff. If you don't, and will use the truck as a car, buy what you find first.
I don't baby my trucks, they get used like Henry Ford would have envisioned.
I have had plenty of 351s and couldn't keep any of them. Sold them all with a smile. My 460 trucks.... Sad day to see them leave.
My opinion, I welcome yours
Rule of thumb that I've lived by.... 351, power of a 302, fuel mileage of a 460.
In a half ton I can see going with a 351. Other then the option of mass air and 4r70w I'd never own one with a 302. An f250 is junk with a 351. Sorry guys that have them, but I'm right and you're wrong.
460 is the way to go if you tow stuff. If you don't, and will use the truck as a car, buy what you find first.
I don't baby my trucks, they get used like Henry Ford would have envisioned.
I have had plenty of 351s and couldn't keep any of them. Sold them all with a smile. My 460 trucks.... Sad day to see them leave.
My opinion, I welcome yours
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 3,328
Likes: 292
From: Laramie, WY
I have a 150 with a 5.8. Its a 96' SCSB, 4x4, auto. Its been a great truck. No they don't have the power of a 302. I've driven both, the 351 has a very noticeable increase in torque. The 302 trucks I've driven are lame ducks. No the 5.8 does not get the mileage of a 460, especially if you compare same year trucks. An 85' 351 may get the same mileage as a 95 460, but a 96' 351 will save significant fuel over a 96' 460.
I don't ever tow over 5k lbs. though. And by no means do I regularly tow anything anymore. These days its just a couple snowmobiles. But I used to tow a good sized boat regularly in the lowlands of MN, worked great.
I don't think I would go for a 250 with a 351 though. If you're going to go with a HD truck you may as well go with an HD motor. Just depends what you'll use it for. Working it hard, go HD. Lighter duties, 1/2 ton with 351 is a pretty nice compromise.
I don't ever tow over 5k lbs. though. And by no means do I regularly tow anything anymore. These days its just a couple snowmobiles. But I used to tow a good sized boat regularly in the lowlands of MN, worked great.
I don't think I would go for a 250 with a 351 though. If you're going to go with a HD truck you may as well go with an HD motor. Just depends what you'll use it for. Working it hard, go HD. Lighter duties, 1/2 ton with 351 is a pretty nice compromise.
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 247
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From: Greenville, NC
I have a light duty 88 F250 4x4 with a 351 and a C6 transmission. It's towed everything I have needed to tow with no problem (up to 8k lbs, but normally a boat.) It accelerates nicely when unloaded, and didn't have any trouble keeping up with traffic on I-95 with a 5k load from NC to FL. Gets better mileage than my friends 2wd F250 with a 460 and a 4 speed, too.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,197
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From: Central Wisconsin
Although I respect Untamnd's opinion, I will disagree with it. I find that the 351w is an excellent truck motor, but can obviously be outdone by a motor with 109 more cubic inches. The 351w also has an excellent aftermarket support since it was used so long in so many vehicles. I also have an f250 with a 351w though...so I'm kind of partial. The 351w will pull everything the truck is rated for, but it might snort a little doing it. the 460 will do it a little bit easier, but it might as well pour gas on the ground while it does it. Before I started modifying my truck like I did, I was getting mid teens with it. my dad had an old 85 with a 351w HO that he was getting 17 with. and that had a carb on it. he drives with a real light foot though and can get 50mpg out of my new focus, as where I can only get 44. but its all about what your going to do with it. if you need power, get a 460, if you need a truck that gets ok gas mileage with most of that power, get the 351w. If you want to kick yourself everyday, buy a chevy.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,635
Likes: 3
From: Lansdale, PA
I'm on the extreme end of the scale. My opinion is from the perspective of a true heavy duty work truck. I have two 300+hp powerstrokes and one maybe a little more.
I've had 460s modified in most every combination possible and still have the efi work.
My daily driver is a close to stock (flowmaster after cat then dump, MSD ignition, tweaked timing) 1990 f150 351 e4od and 57800 miles.... And it dissapoints me nearly every day.
And I don't even ask it to do anything difficult. My two f250s were just as bad.
Anyway. I have stainless longtubes and dual high flow cats and magnaflow muffler and 3" mandrel bent tailpipe, along with new upper, lower intake combo, 300-6/460 air box snorkel, alum radiator, elec fans, roller cam, mass air, ported 194valve heads, RR, and front and rear posi units. just need time to install it all.
Hopefully after all that work... I'll be happy.
I've had 460s modified in most every combination possible and still have the efi work.
My daily driver is a close to stock (flowmaster after cat then dump, MSD ignition, tweaked timing) 1990 f150 351 e4od and 57800 miles.... And it dissapoints me nearly every day.
And I don't even ask it to do anything difficult. My two f250s were just as bad.
Anyway. I have stainless longtubes and dual high flow cats and magnaflow muffler and 3" mandrel bent tailpipe, along with new upper, lower intake combo, 300-6/460 air box snorkel, alum radiator, elec fans, roller cam, mass air, ported 194valve heads, RR, and front and rear posi units. just need time to install it all.
Hopefully after all that work... I'll be happy.
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 215
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From: oo-tah
I'd be fine with a half ton, just like the look of the 250s and having a hell of a time finding a nice truck. And I don't need to buy a chevy to kick myself, I bought a jeep for that!
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 2003
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From: southwest michigan
hmm. I'm going to have to disagree with the 351 having power compared to the 302... I've driven enough of both to know that that's just not the case. Especially if your hauling anything.
I currently own a 2000 302 AWD mountaineer and a 1996 351 4x4 f150 (RCSB) and the truck actually gets better mileage than the mounty. Granted the mounty is AWD.
What I like about moving from the 302 to the 351 is that taking off becomes so easy. Your not driving a rocket, but as your getting up to speed, it feels almost effortless. I think the same can be said for the 460, your not going to be taking home trophies from the 1/4 mile, but it just goes like your trucks weight isn't holding it back at all.
#1 factor on what motor you should get... driving style. I know how I drive, so I'll always get the largest engine option for whatever vehicle I'm looking at. I know a guy that has an older f250 with a 302 for pulling a travel trailer, and he's fine with it.
I currently own a 2000 302 AWD mountaineer and a 1996 351 4x4 f150 (RCSB) and the truck actually gets better mileage than the mounty. Granted the mounty is AWD.
What I like about moving from the 302 to the 351 is that taking off becomes so easy. Your not driving a rocket, but as your getting up to speed, it feels almost effortless. I think the same can be said for the 460, your not going to be taking home trophies from the 1/4 mile, but it just goes like your trucks weight isn't holding it back at all.
#1 factor on what motor you should get... driving style. I know how I drive, so I'll always get the largest engine option for whatever vehicle I'm looking at. I know a guy that has an older f250 with a 302 for pulling a travel trailer, and he's fine with it.
New User
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
I'm on the extreme end of the scale. My opinion is from the perspective of a true heavy duty work truck. I have two 300+hp powerstrokes and one maybe a little more.
I've had 460s modified in most every combination possible and still have the efi work.
My daily driver is a close to stock (flowmaster after cat then dump, MSD ignition, tweaked timing) 1990 f150 351 e4od and 57800 miles.... And it dissapoints me nearly every day.
And I don't even ask it to do anything difficult. My two f250s were just as bad.
Anyway. I have stainless longtubes and dual high flow cats and magnaflow muffler and 3" mandrel bent tailpipe, along with new upper, lower intake combo, 300-6/460 air box snorkel, alum radiator, elec fans, roller cam, mass air, ported 194valve heads, RR, and front and rear posi units. just need time to install it all.
Hopefully after all that work... I'll be happy.
I've had 460s modified in most every combination possible and still have the efi work.
My daily driver is a close to stock (flowmaster after cat then dump, MSD ignition, tweaked timing) 1990 f150 351 e4od and 57800 miles.... And it dissapoints me nearly every day.
And I don't even ask it to do anything difficult. My two f250s were just as bad.
Anyway. I have stainless longtubes and dual high flow cats and magnaflow muffler and 3" mandrel bent tailpipe, along with new upper, lower intake combo, 300-6/460 air box snorkel, alum radiator, elec fans, roller cam, mass air, ported 194valve heads, RR, and front and rear posi units. just need time to install it all.
Hopefully after all that work... I'll be happy.
this x2
Logistics Pro
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,635
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From: Lansdale, PA
I currently have 3 explorer v8 and my previous daily driver "light" work vehicle was a v8 mountaineer. I'd take the ho 5liter 4r70w awd combo ANY DAY compared to my sclb 351 e4od. In power and towing. My mountaineer only had catback and springs in rear, and it towed my 4000lb mustang so much better then this f150.
I'm tempted to pull all the efi out of one explorer and swap it into the f150 along with the 4r70. I really like the trans and the eec5 has tuner support.
(I know the oil pump drive is different size, I got that covered)
I'm tempted to pull all the efi out of one explorer and swap it into the f150 along with the 4r70. I really like the trans and the eec5 has tuner support.
(I know the oil pump drive is different size, I got that covered)
Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,101
Likes: 2
From: Poway, CA
FWIW, the main reason I bought my previous F250 with a 351 was because I really just wanted a half ton 5 speed that wasn't the M5OD, especially since I had owned a half ton before that with that tranny and had blown it up. Since that was never a factory option, I stepped to a F250. F250s with the 351 are cheaper, but still gave me everything I needed out of a truck (Home Depot runs and the occasional UHaul trailer).
Mike
Mike
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,868
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From: Rhode Island
Then something is wrong with your 351.
A 1990 351 is 210HP @ 3800 RPM, 315 ft-lb @ 2800 RPM.
A 1999 302 is 215HP @ 4200 RPM, 288 ft-lb @ 3300 RPM.
You will not notice 5HP, and the higher torque of the 351 should make it feel far more powerful.
A 1990 351 is 210HP @ 3800 RPM, 315 ft-lb @ 2800 RPM.
A 1999 302 is 215HP @ 4200 RPM, 288 ft-lb @ 3300 RPM.
You will not notice 5HP, and the higher torque of the 351 should make it feel far more powerful.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,635
Likes: 3
From: Lansdale, PA
E4od is a power hog and it's shift strategy sucks.
I can hook onto the same trailer with same load, and the mountaineer just plain ol out performs. My f250 with 351 and 410 gears does about the same. F250 holds the load better, but gets terrible mpg compared to mountaineer with same load.
I can hook onto the same trailer with same load, and the mountaineer just plain ol out performs. My f250 with 351 and 410 gears does about the same. F250 holds the load better, but gets terrible mpg compared to mountaineer with same load.
New User
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12
Likes: 1
I have had numerous ford trucks with 302's , 351's, and 460's. IMO the 351W in a half ton would be ok for hauling in the bed or occasionally pulling a small trailer. I have had one light duty 250 with a 302 and three 250's with the 351 and several diesels and 460's. The 302 3/4 would out perform the 351W trucks and got better mileage. The 351 would get about 1 1/2 to 2 more mpg than the 460 trucks. . . WHEN EMPTY. When working the trucks with medium to heavy loads the 460 got better MPG than the 351's, and at MUCH higher speeds. I am absolutely a Ford guy after owning 91 vehicles to date with the vast majority being Fords and most of them trucks. However, I hate the admit it but I feel the 351W trucks are dogs for work. A sport type 1/2 ton short bed with a 351w may be a different story. Once again this is just my opinion based on my experience.