Were you going to just gut it or put a straight pipe on in its place? That junction behind the cat is just a slip connection, but I can imagine that it would be tough to get it to separate. If you want to straight pipe it, I would just cut it and be done, but if your intent is to gut the cat and then re-install it, you should be able to get it apart with some effort. An air hammer usually works well in my experience. Heating the pipe up with a torch may help as well. There is a peg on one piece of the pipe and a notch in the other so bear that in mind when you are ready to re-assemble everything.

 

Yea I was goning to gut it, I hit it so hard with a rubber mallot that it bent cat. I saw the pin. I was having such a tough time I thought the pin was welded in pipe.

 

What are the chances you could just gut it without taking loose from the muffler?

 

why would a plugged up cat meet these symptoms though?

"will haul donkeys in the second stage of third, and in fourth"

iv never heard of a plugged up cat only effecting low end,but all the sudden "haul donkeys" once the convert locks up ("second stage of third") and notice,he's putting OD right there in the same sentence as "hauling donkeys".
this doesn't seem like a plugged up exhaust to me.but, im throwing that out there,you guys know the engines.seems backwards is all,if anything.giving the diesel's grunt is down low,you'd think if the exhaust was plugged,he'd be saying it's taking off ok,but once lockup and into overdrive,the truck is falling on it's face.

by the description,it's sluggish in lower gears,but once lockup happens she going nice.so nice it's described as "hauling donkeys".
what happens with the converter is,before the vanes simply brake off,destroying the converter they can bend.
what happens when the vanes bend,is the stall is increased,on an already higher than it should be factory stall converter for these diesels.
now,he adds weight,and the stall is increased yet even more.
all this leads to a major lack of performance,and can explain why he has no power until the trans and engine are fully locked via the clutches in the converter (lockup. "second part of 3rd" and OD.)

now what happens when this is not addressed?
the converter eventually fully fails and the insides actually come apart.
all the metal can spread through the trans and take it out with it.
this is all actually too common with the stock E40D converter,and odds are what the issue can be.
now what happens right now if performance is increased beyond factory to try an compensate for a failing converter?
it's going to fail and brake sooner of course with the added stress.

is it possible the actual low end of engine performance is suffering,but all the sudden "hauls donkeys" after lockup,and even pulling harder in OD than at the low end? i suppose.but what seems most likely? a lack of engine power down low,or a worn out converter that is no longer placing the engines power to the ground before lockup?

and im not saying i actually know either way.
just throwing this info out there for ya guys to help diagnose the issue.

do you guys have an adjustable TPS or anything of the sort that can effect the shifts/converter locking state at all?
because notice he does have another issue as well; shifting late into 2nd and 3rd.

if trans temps seems extra higher than normal before lockup,this really could help diagnose a failing converter as well.if these vanes are bent,causing the converter to slip more,this will produce more heat.

 

I agree with your explanation above, but I know for a fact that the things can really act funny when the engine doesn't product the power the PCM expects.

Before I swapped motors, I am about 90% sure that when I would hammer on mine, it would lock the TC before it shifted to 3rd about half the time. The thing is that the engine and transmission are all controlled electronically so the PCM is really "driving the bus" (no pun intended). It is possible that the OP's TC is slipping or otherwise on its last leg, but my personal experience has been that the engine being down on power makes the truck drive very similar to what he has described. My truck felt fairly gutless low in the RPM range (I am guessing because it was not fueling efficiently) but when you got the RPM's up it felt like it would go pretty good (hauling donkeys may be a bit of a stretch in my case but it would do a lot better). After all the measure of true power (HP) is a function of torque and speed ((Torque x RPM) / 5252). If the truck is down on power at 1,000 RPM, it will feel better at 2,000 RPM than at 1,000 just because the speed is higher.

With about 140k less miles on this engine and a set of injectors that spray better than I am guessing my old ones did, this same transmission shifts as well as and E4OD I have driven and doesn't hesitate like it used to when shifting, no more TC lock before the 2-3 shift, etc. I am praying that this transmission is in decent shape, as I was told it was a year old when I bought the truck a year ago, but it sure does shift different now. Smoother than before, TC lockup is not as harsh, and as I said, shifts when it seems it should whereas it used to hold onto second until well north of 3,000 RPMs even under moderate acceleration.

So in short, I agree with you in theory, but my personal experience has been that the decline in power from the engine can make it seem to really have the power up top and be lacking until you stand on the skinny pedal.

One thing I am sure we can both agree on is that gutting the cat will help either way, so it is time well spent regardless of whether it "fixes" this exact issue or not.

 

One thing is for sure, it shifts smooth at low rpm, and will pull a mountain in third and fourth. When I stomp it in first and second it just gets louder. Heeee haaww!

 

You're right on the plugged cat explanation, I forgot about hauling butt in upper rpms..

 

gutting the cat will help performance i agree.
however the downside is,what if the converter is shot and just hasn't come apart yet?
the increased power from the less restrictive exhaust could make the weak,oem stock,failure prone,and if not the,one of the most weakest links to the E40D finally scream uncle followed by very unpleasant noises and possibly a toasted trans.

the thing here is,that it's going great once locked up,and even feels powerful (more so) in OD than it does in taking off before locking up.
we know OD isn't really a performance gear.if let's say the cat is plugged,what would OD feel like with a plugged cat? "hauling donkey time" or sluggish?

now with more info on what it's doing by this last comment,its pretty much screaming failing converter.
she's revving due to an extremely high stall/bent converter vanes (most likely) rather than launching the vehicle ahead.
id HATE to be wrong,and have someone pay $ to replace a perfectly good converter (as good as oem can be anyway) and have the symptom persist.
on the other hand,id rather that,than have the converter fail (actually have the vanes bend so far they now break) and possibly lead to trans replacement which could lead to literately thousands as we know.
this is why im saying i don't know.but these symptoms and the failure rate of these converters,like i say (possibly debatable) with the weakest link of the E40D being not the trans at all,but the converter........it's all pointing in that direction.
again though,remember i don't know these engines,and certainly don't want to get in anyone's way suggesting they may know why the engine itself is only getting louder on take off instead of launching ahead like it should be,meanwhile having more performance in top end economy gear than it does in 1-2-first part of third.

 

Able,

How high does the tachometer indicate before the truck starts to move? When the TC locks up after the 2-3 shift how far does the tachometer fall? A healthy E4OD shouldn't need to see the RPMs go up much before it starts to propel the truck.

Maybe your TC is slipping, I don't know without being there, I just tend to take the KISS method when starting to trouble shoot things and the remarks you made in your other post seemed to indicate that the truck was low on power all through the band not just on the low end.

I mean no disrespect to F250HDXLT either, I just usually start with the simple things first and the graduate to the more complicated and costly things.

 

non taken.

i had read that thread as well,along with the title of it,a few other things there,but when he compared his diesel truck to his past 06 f150,and him stating he'd probably able to out tow it with that truck,it pretty much summed up things for me that it was something pretty seriously wrong with his converter.

then his description there,like as here,no issues once lockup and even provided a nice fuel economy number which all helped point me in the direction of a trans converter issue rather than an engine performance issue.generally,as a rule of thumb,if a diesel engine is compared to an f150 performance wise,yet is getting the economy of the diesel still (this along with decent performance once locked up) this all means as a rule,the engine is fine,but the converter is no longer working properly under lockup speeds.the reason for his good fuel economy still,is because once the converter reaches lockup,it's as if it's a manual transmissions clutch.the clutches on his converter are still good and a direct connection to the engine and trans in this state is still ideal.once it's been established the engine has decent power,fuel economy even,it pretty much narrows things down that proper torque multiplication under lockup just isn't happening inside the converter.be it a failed stator,bent vanes,what have you.

it could be an issue with the engine,and again im not saying its not.but it would take something pretty serious performance wise to effect under lockup speed performance only, for him to state his '06 f150 was more powerful while in the open converter state of a good diesel converter with a 7.3l PSD sitting in front of it i feel.

 

Cat was clean but I hammered it out anyways. I think converter is problem. I didnt wash cat out I jst got out the best I could

 

Well said sir! You may very well be correct. I suppose one thing you could do to test the theory short of pulling the trans to replace the converter would be to do the TC lockup mod. Basically what that will do is allow you to lock the TC when ever you want to. All you're really doing is taking the TC control wire to ground through a switch, instead of letting the PCM take it to ground when it decides it is time. I would be careful letting it do the 1-2 shift with the TC locked as it can be pretty violent, but It would confirm or rule out your suspicions that the TC is the issue.

If you're interested in doing it, here is a thread on the how to.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...questions.html
I am playing with the idea of doing this on my truck just because I tend to be a control freak (I know I should just swap it to a ZF5 right!?) but putting this to use as a tool for diagnosis would be worth the time invested IMO.

 

I will check to see what rpms I get shifts, and movement.

 

Ok if I dont lay on pedal it shifts into second at 1500 very smooth. Runs 2100 at 65 mph. My glow plugs have not worked since I bought the truck. if it gets colder than 50 ive had to plug it in. I replaced glow plug relay. (no help). Well it got in low 30s last night and I fired truck up first try (WOW what a surprise!) It is shifting smooth also. It has to be electrical. Something is making contact that wasnt before. Im hooking up gooseneck today to see how that goes. By the way if your alternator acts up these trucks will act awfull. Could be computer acting crazy. Removing batteries does help. I just thoight about it my brake fluid is leaking and might be wetting connnectors. I will checj into that.

 

Have you had the cruise control recall done? They splice in wires at the master cylinder. FIRES have started at that connection you are talking about, with the truck off, so get that done FIRST if you haven't