Natural gas
Hotshot
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 10,101
Likes: 40
From: Pa
People who have lived in pennsylvania for years say when they were kids they used to light streams on fire just from the methane that was coming out of the ground, probably from the coal mines that have been burning underground for generations, the natural gas that is going to be extracted out of Pennsylvania is going to benefit everyone in the area and is going to be great for this country, period.
The creeks and rivers in places near the coal mines used to run black when the mines were really going. Now those once black streams are clear again. If they can extract natural gas here in PA and not screw up the water table and pollute the surrounding enviroment I'm all for it. Legislation has to be passed and enforced to help insure that.
I think it would be nice to have my truck run off of gasoline and CNG to extend my range. There was a fellow here on FTE a while ago from across the pond that has an Ex that runs on gasoline and LP.
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 154
Likes: 2
From: Fort Erie, ON
It's possible to get 50 diesel mpg with a diesel-CNG dual fuel system and this depends upon both the vehicle and the CNG system. You would have to be substituting a lot of diesel with CNG and this requires very good control of the CNG supplied to the engine. On the CNGchat forum, I've read that some people are substituting easily 50% of their diesel fuel with CNG. To put this into perspective, Westport HD runs their ISX-G engine on 95% natural gas, with the 5% diesel fuel being used to light the fuel mixture. Incidentally, since CNG is sold by the GGE, it would only have to cost less than 88% of the cost of diesel to be cheaper. See NGV Calcs.
$6000-$8000 is a bit much for the underhood components of a diesel-CNG system. The CNG EcoDiesel System costs less than $3000. Are you sure that the price you found online wasn't for an INSTALLED system?
$6000-$8000 is a bit much for the underhood components of a diesel-CNG system. The CNG EcoDiesel System costs less than $3000. Are you sure that the price you found online wasn't for an INSTALLED system?
Tuned
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 365
Likes: 1
From: Massanutten,VA
Quote from GreenCar.com summer of 08
The only light-duty NGV sold by an original equipment manufacturer here is the Honda GX. All others are retrofitted installations for select vehicles that use GM's 6.0-liter engine and Ford's 4.6, 5.4, and 6.8-liter engines.
The cost to convert to CNG can range from about $12,500 to $22,500 depending on the vehicle, engine, size of CNG tanks needed, and who does the converting. The greatest expense is for the CNG tanks, and the more capacity and number of tanks, the more expensive the conversion. While this may be daunting for many consumers, fleet users - like taxi companies and delivery services - can often justify the expense because of the fuel savings amortized over many miles. The FuelMaker 'Q' refueling appliance costs just under $10,000 plus installation and the Phill is priced at about $4500 plus installation.
Looks like I'll be using regular gas for some time to come
The only light-duty NGV sold by an original equipment manufacturer here is the Honda GX. All others are retrofitted installations for select vehicles that use GM's 6.0-liter engine and Ford's 4.6, 5.4, and 6.8-liter engines.
The cost to convert to CNG can range from about $12,500 to $22,500 depending on the vehicle, engine, size of CNG tanks needed, and who does the converting. The greatest expense is for the CNG tanks, and the more capacity and number of tanks, the more expensive the conversion. While this may be daunting for many consumers, fleet users - like taxi companies and delivery services - can often justify the expense because of the fuel savings amortized over many miles. The FuelMaker 'Q' refueling appliance costs just under $10,000 plus installation and the Phill is priced at about $4500 plus installation.
Looks like I'll be using regular gas for some time to come
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,684
Likes: 0
From: Phoenix, AZ
I like how people claim government has to develop infrastructure for gas stations or start/stop drilling/fracking/etc... Government has to do nothing but allow the markets to work. When the world runs low on oil and extraction will become harder and supply lower, and the prices start rising, that's when we'll move on to the next cheapest source of energy. Demand stipulates innovation, not government legislation.
This week I've read that the EU plans to ban all diesel/gasoline cars by 2050. We are purposefully diverting ourselves to more expensive sources of energy because of green lobbyists and environmental groups. If you believe global warming is so bad, feel free to do your share to fight it, and feel free to convince as many people as possible to do it; but don't legislate me to do it, and don't tax me for your beliefs and causes. I wish I could force prius drivers to come shovel my driveway of snow now that it's almost April and it still has snow in it... Would only be fair, if I get taxed for warming the globe, they should be taxed for cooling it (if they really are, as they claim).
This week I've read that the EU plans to ban all diesel/gasoline cars by 2050. We are purposefully diverting ourselves to more expensive sources of energy because of green lobbyists and environmental groups. If you believe global warming is so bad, feel free to do your share to fight it, and feel free to convince as many people as possible to do it; but don't legislate me to do it, and don't tax me for your beliefs and causes. I wish I could force prius drivers to come shovel my driveway of snow now that it's almost April and it still has snow in it... Would only be fair, if I get taxed for warming the globe, they should be taxed for cooling it (if they really are, as they claim).
Tuned
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 370
Likes: 3
From: SoCal
Good point Fosters! But one little correction..it is no longer called Global Warming...the new lingo is "climate change" - kinda like calling toilet paper "bathroom tissue." I just hope people come to their senses soon and vote all these baboons out of office!
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Tuned
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 365
Likes: 1
From: Massanutten,VA
I wish I could force prius drivers to come shovel my driveway of snow now that it's almost April and it still has snow in it... Would only be fair, if I get taxed for warming the globe, they should be taxed for cooling it (if they really are, as they claim).
I'm still trying to get one of those Prius out of my Blocker Beam
I'm still trying to get one of those Prius out of my Blocker Beam
Junior User
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
I like how people claim government has to develop infrastructure for gas stations or start/stop drilling/fracking/etc... Government has to do nothing but allow the markets to work. When the world runs low on oil and extraction will become harder and supply lower, and the prices start rising, that's when we'll move on to the next cheapest source of energy. Demand stipulates innovation, not government legislation.
This week I've read that the EU plans to ban all diesel/gasoline cars by 2050. We are purposefully diverting ourselves to more expensive sources of energy because of green lobbyists and environmental groups. If you believe global warming is so bad, feel free to do your share to fight it, and feel free to convince as many people as possible to do it; but don't legislate me to do it, and don't tax me for your beliefs and causes. I wish I could force prius drivers to come shovel my driveway of snow now that it's almost April and it still has snow in it... Would only be fair, if I get taxed for warming the globe, they should be taxed for cooling it (if they really are, as they claim).
This week I've read that the EU plans to ban all diesel/gasoline cars by 2050. We are purposefully diverting ourselves to more expensive sources of energy because of green lobbyists and environmental groups. If you believe global warming is so bad, feel free to do your share to fight it, and feel free to convince as many people as possible to do it; but don't legislate me to do it, and don't tax me for your beliefs and causes. I wish I could force prius drivers to come shovel my driveway of snow now that it's almost April and it still has snow in it... Would only be fair, if I get taxed for warming the globe, they should be taxed for cooling it (if they really are, as they claim).
If the gov. is going to get involved they should look with a broader vision that will help our country become independant and not look toward another country to provide for us.
I encourage the Prius owners and everyone to buy a Prius If the demand on fuel goes down so does the price. I'll keep my Ex!
Wiser by FTE
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,837
Likes: 48
The big oil company's are smart, buy/consume/lease/use all of the other countries oil before harvesting our own oil & SELLING IT to those opec partners for $500.00 A BARREL! 
CNG is a very clean alternative to oil,
we need the infrastructure for that & new oil refineries for that matter.
CNG is a very clean alternative to oil,we need the infrastructure for that & new oil refineries for that matter.
Posting Guru
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,440
Likes: 1
I like the term "climate change" much better...the climate has been changing since the beginning of time and will continue to change on it's own merit whether we pollute all we want or ban gasoline altogether. With that said, I'm all for alternative fuels; what's so wrong with innovation and new ideas? Politics unfortunately can not leave it's ugly head out of this though.
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