Ive read a few articles on the water/methane injection into the return side on the IC pipes and the propane injection as well. I think the articles I was reading are biased towards one or the other and I am curious if anyone has installed either and if the savings are worth the cost of the setups. The water/methane claims to drop EGT's by 150-300 degrees but I am curious about the water part of the whole equation and the cost of the additives/products for the methane side. The propane claims to drop EGT's about 50-150 degrees but does the cost of the propane offset the savings in efficiency? All in all I'm just looking to get educated on the subject and see if I can find real results.

 

Might help to know what mods are on your truck, so we know why you're looking into water/meth or propane. From the sounds of it, you're looking to reduce EGT's more than anything else.

Propane was big years ago, until people started scattering blocks by getting too greedy on the pane. Propane in very very small quantities won't hurt, but it's hard to make it cost effective. Start throwing more propane into the mix, and you'll have uncontrollable combustion and extremely high cylinder pressures.

Water/meth is used by some, but it's only designed to progressively come on at higher boost pressures. Straight water is used by some to control EGT's on very high HP trucks. Depending on your application, it might not even be worth it. Hence it's a good idea to post up your mods, or your mod plans, and then we can help more.

 

Asking about this wasnt so much to see if its a viable option for what ive got but to find out what is the best rout for an economic build thats got some power behind it. So the question I asked is better to be rephrased as "which of the two, methane/water or propane injection, is better suited to save moneyand provide a reliable and efficient 7.3"

 

With propane, your shooting a fuel on top of fuel. Plus you deal with a propane tank and have to deal with getting it filled.
With water/meth, any gas station carried windsheild washer fluid. .99 vs. Finding a fill station and paying $20. Both are touchy and can do major damage if you feed too much. Gauges are a definate before you add either system.

 

IMHO gauges, exhaust and intake are the basic "stage 1" mods along with other minor changes, including all the CCV, hutch and etc). I wouldnt think about trying to put a drop of propane or methwater in without them. I was just curious if anyone has propane or methwater and what kind of mileage gains they got along with any information people may have.

 

To answer your question, I would personally say none of the above.

If you want a build with power behind it, build it without propane or water/meth in mind.

Any mild to moderate HP build should never need any propane or water/meth. Period. If it's done correctly, it shouldn't even be a consideration, as it shouldn't be needed. If it's a very high hp build, then you might need water injection (not water/meth) to keep EGT's down when you're really deep in the pedal and trying to maximize fuel. For those with high HP trucks, propane or water/meth isn't really even a consideration. When it's that much power, the potential for problems with uncontrollable combustion becomes way too great.

There's plenty of daily driver 500+ hp 7.3L's out there without any propane or water/meth, and they can control EGT's with a proper build and correct tuning. In addition, look around for those running 600+ hp, and see how many are running propane or water/meth. The chances of you finding that combination are slim to none. You'll find way more running nitrous, straight water injection, or fuel only.

There's also plenty of sub-500 hp trucks running as DD's and towing, while having EGT's at stock levels or lower..... without propane or water/meth.

 

Thats the exact information I was looking for. Ive had this truck for about a year now and I'm getting to the point where I would like to build towards a goal, particularly high mpg with a decent amount of power. I'll do some more looking around to see if I can find some threads on that topic before I start a new one. Thanks for the insight. I was wondering why I never hear much about the methwater and propane systems and now I know.
Thanks guys.

 

Forum is acting weird on me. I didn't even see this post until now... and I posted 5 minutes after this was up.

Water/meth won't gain you any mileage. The reason is that water/meth isn't even injected until boost pressures start to come up. At that point, you aren't driving for mileage anymore. When your boost pressure is 10, 15, 20, or more PSI... mileage is long gone.

Propane is iffy. It can increase mileage, but cost savings really depends on the price of propane. Also take into consideration that too much propane will increase cylinder pressures by a LOT. So saving money with propane is sketchy at best.

 

I run the snow stage II an it was the second biggest waste of money I made,next to all the banks stuff I bought and now don't have anymore. It doesn't work,and snow has the worst customer service. Stick with turbo mods,custom tunes,intakes,gauges,exhaust,and get rid of your foil on your hot pipe. Listen to that turbo workin. Just my opinion,thanks for supportin.

 

Thats what im gathering from this thread, that anything expensive is almost a waste for what little results you get. I just did the foil delete last week or so and i was actually surprised at how much louder the higer pitch was, especially on the highway. Just bought the wicked wheel and it came in today so tomorrow is going to be full of frustrations im sure. After this tho all my money is going towards gauges and exhaust (and an AR-15 ) Not to worried at this point about egts cuz i generally keep mpg's in mind and dont dog it. Debating on taking the diesel innovations chip out for a while until i get the exhaust set up just to be sure. Anyone have any input on the best way to get the most mpg out of the 7.3?

 

Give her more power to pull the weight of the truck and ANYTHING you need to relocate. The DP-Tuner custom tunes are great. Call Jody and talk to him. My f5 is in for updates and I'm only getting 12mpg. With the chip I get 15-24. Heck of a difference.

 

Anybody else seeing those kind of fuel economy gains by running a tuner, DP or otherwise, compared to stock? First I've seen such a big difference being experienced in mpg by adding the tuner.

 

i have a 2000 4 dr short bed sittin on 35s and a 4" lift i do not know exactly what my mileage numbers are but im running a ts performance chip and when i set the chip on stock my truck does terrible on fuel mileage but when i turn the chip on it helps on alot. im taking a 1,000 mile trip this weekend il try to remember to figure my mileage and see what it does.

 

I agree with alot of what you've said - specifically the dangers of high CP's when adding a combustible into the intake air. However, I've concluded there are gains to be had by injecting small amounts of water at 'low' boost - say 7-8psi. I run 3-4psi at cruising speed, but easily get to 8psi on a grade or passing. If you add a little water at that time, you get a little boost in power due to the expansion of the water into steam. It also increases the efficiency of the combustion event by creating a more complete burn - as a result of lowering the combustion chamber temperature. There is also the lowering of EGT's at high boost if ya add enough water. I want to run water for the CLEANING effect it has on the combustion chamber.

At higher boost levels, its safe to add MORE water. Further increasing the boost in power from WATER without burning additional fuel. It has the same effect as adding more fuel. I suspect that an engine making 30psi of boost and spraying water will make more power using the same amount of fuel as an engine making 30psi and no water. While 'economy' may be out the window - its still a fuel savings. Again, I would have to agree its not 'cost effective' to add WI for power OR economy.

Now, methanol is another story. Although adding meth increases the expansion and cooling effects over straight water - we are sending combustibles into the combustion chamber and like 'pane or NOS, we lose control of when the combustion event takes place - potentially resulting in deadly CP's from 'early' detonation. (the timing in a diesel is dictated by the fuel injection event) I plan to use enough alcohol to prevent freezing. (13% = 20*F, 24% = 0*F and 35% = -15*F) It appears most people have no prob's if they stay below 40% methanol.

Aside from high CP's, the only real danger is hydrolocking the engine from putting waaaaay to much water in the air or letting water run into the cylinders while engine is off.

I know a few people with WI in their PSD's - both DIY and store-bought systems. Although most of my friends don't want more HP or measure MPG's - they are concerned about any potential carbon build-up from burning WVO...

As soon as I find my boost leak, I'll be adding 3-stage WI to my F350. I plan to get some dyno time, then add big oil and go back on dyno if I can. I'll be sure to make some runs comparing WI to no-WI - mmmmkay?

 

I ran propane for a couple of years. Propane has less btu's than diesel, my experience was if the cost of propane is 50% or less than the cost of diesel per gallon, you can save some money with it, I typically got a 2mpg boost while running propane.

You need to spend money on a good system and exercise self control in the amount of propane fumigated or you can easily bust a rod. You also need to run tunes for propane or with little timing advance because propane will advance your timing, which is what gets people in trouble.