Ok, so got to noticing that the batteries werent charging up like they should and so i pulled the alt/VR to get tested. VR was bad, bought a new one stuck it in, bout 10 minutes later the thing was almost on fire. Pulled over went to shut the truck off, and seemingly everything died but the engine, pulled the IP wire and killed it. Disconected the VR, restarted and shuts off normal. Can definately tell that the batteries are charging, but for some reason im gettin power feeding back thru to the IP and voltage regulator and i dunno how or why. I already checked and cleaned all grounds. Any help would be great, really need the truck goin and cant afford another 20 on another VR.

 

With the motor dead, plug in the vr and start checking what all wires is hot with the key off.

Check the relays on the passenger fenderwell and make sure there is no melted wires anywhere.

 

what relays would those be? The engine is in my 79, only thing i can think of off hand would be the starter solenoid. I did check wires for which had power and which didnt but doesnt help a whole lot as ive no idea which wires on the regulator should have power which ones should not. The engine harness in its entirety is unmolested. The wires leaving the VR are all melted a bit in the same spot, about 5" down for about 1/2", my guess is something else got them hot not the wires themselves. When the VR about cooked, all the wires were cool, not even warm, IP did seem warmer than what i thought it ought to be tho, maybe just my imagination. On top of the engine, right side in the front the harness mostly ends in a relay of sorts i assume, anyone know what it is, what it does, and possibly if it may be the culprit? I just for the life of me cant figure out how im somehow getting juice to the the VR and IP when neither should, especially when the damn key is off.

 

Where your wires are burned, is it possible that you have two of them actually bare and touching? Also can you return the VR and replace it with another one under warranty?

Also that relay thing you mentioned, if it looks like a little cube with International's logo on it, I think that is for the fuel filter sensors or heater, I remember reading on it here somewhere.

 

that would be it. Negative, wires are not bare nor touching. I dont know of anywhere that will take anything electrical back once you leave the store with it. Although, im gunna get one outta the JY and see what happens, if it works then obviously i will try and get my money back, but im thinking that its not the VR, and rather that whatever is wrong is what killed my other one, in fact now that i think about it, it did some weird shutting off stuff for a long time.

 

bump

 

Ok so i went out and checked some wires, the yellow, possibly yellow/white that comes from the battery side of the starter solenoid, is obviously hot, this is the same wire that connects to the resistor / raido static filter, the resister was not hooked up on the diesel donor. Secondly the orange wire, that goes to the 2 wire plug on top of the altenator is hot FROM the voltage regulator via the yellow wire when plugged into the VR. The orange altenator wire is hot with key on AND off. The other two wires (green w/red, and white w/grey?) do not have power with key on OR off while the engine is stopped.

Also, the VR was getting very hot again w/out the engine running, i had the key on and off so not sure if it was hot from key on or off or both.

 

okay i think i may have an idea whats wrong, but no idea where. And still not sure why the regulator gets hot unless the points are stuck. For whatever reason, it seems that when the voltage regulator is plugged in it is closing a circuit that shouldnt exsist, aka a shorted wire. More specifically a wire that is key on hot to my ignition wire, which now provides the key on power to my IP. When the VR is plugged in the truck wont shut off so there is a hot wire from the VR shorted to my ignition wire somewhere, or somehow the altenator when charging is shorted or doubling back into the system somehow. If this is the problem, apparently it has been an issue long before now, and in fact before i even swapped the diesel in the truck. And i think it all could have started from when i had to hot wire the truck to move it. basically remove the ignition switch and make a little pigtail that plugged into all the wire terminals at the ignition switch. The reason i say this is when it was hot wired sometime you would kill it, (removing the key on hot wire from the plug) sometimes it would shut off normally, other times it would just kinda run for a sec, then slowly stutter and die. Acting like that if the altenator were producing enough power to keep it running it would still run. Also, when it would shut off odly like this the tach instead of simply dropping to 0 as it should would pretty much wig out and die at the top. The diesel would also do this this to an extent. you would unplug the wire, it would run for 3-5 seconds than die, rather roughly like it was starved of fuel rather than the fuel being shut off. This continued until i actually got an ignition switch seemingly and that is apparently when the old voltage regulator finally gave it up. And now with the new voltage regulator, it would seem there is the same problems, just simply worse than before. Im lost here guys, i think i can try and wrap my head around it and then i still cant figure it out. If you guys just have some ideas, feel like kickin it around and guessing it would be apreciated. I know the problem it seems, but just not HOW it is a problem.

 

When I did my swap in my 76 I made sure to not use the points type regulator it had issues in mine. Use the solid state unit and that may help. Mine was having issues with low voltage output at idle then the points would weld together and the field circuit would go into full output. I ended up swapping in a 3G alternator to clean up the engine bay and will never go back to the junk 1g ever again.

 

I believed this to be a solid state unit, guy at the rebuilding shop said that theyre just printed curcuit, and this has the gel backing on it. It suprised the hell outta me when it started clicking. He also said that there is only 1 ford voltage regulator. What do you mean as far as 1g and 3g?

On a side note, does anyone specifically know what the orange wire on top of the altenator does? it runs to the VR and thats it, it is hot when the VR is plugged in, and if you remove the plug from the altenator and use a voltmeter, the orange wire prong will complete a circuit, seemingly grounding out the orange wire coming from the voltage regulator... is this right???

 

watch this YouTube - Ford externally regulated alternator wiring

 

Now why in the world would my Green/w red HAVE power coming out of the regulator when it is disconnected from its key on source... im starting to think i have a bad regulator among other things. I did find out as far as the whole wont shut off thing, when i disconect that wire (green w/red) from the truck, the engine shuts off, so it must that wire that is back feeding thru the truck not letting it shut off.
Mine also has 5 prongs on the regulator. The stator wire, not shown in the vid white /w black best i can tell, run from the top of the Alt. to the regulator on the prong between the field wire (orange) and the key on green w/red.
Oh, and thanks a ton Joe that definately clears up some of my questions.

 

The more i watch the video the more it seems that my setup is different. Tomorrow when i can see again i will go out and look again more closely and draw up a Paint diagram and post it. It is seeming to me that they are different, and makes it more logical that i have the wrong regulator. in the video it looks like the green w/red are right in touching slots right next to each other, 99% sure mine is different.

 

If the electrical component is messed up many big-chain places like AutoZone or O'reily will allow you to return the part if it does not work. About your wiring, I cannot be of assistance there as I am nowhere near as bright as needed to understand what is going on there, but maybe this here will be of some help to you?



I have noticed that Ford likes to label electrical plugs, so it is possible the plug with the wires have them labeled as I, A, S, and F, so maybe worth checking into that?

 

Bubblegum, thanks a ton for that. That helps in one way, yet now im twice as confused. I need to find out now whether, 1G and 3G alternators have different regulators or what the hell is goin on. The diagram below is how my diesel harness was setup. I got to lookin at our old shop manual and another old truck and it is wired differently. In the manual and on the truck, I is empty, A is the battery hot, S is key on power, and F is still Field. With my regulator that i have now, (from a alt, gen, and starter rebuilding shop who wont accept a return). The I post sends OUT a positive signal, and according to the video below, is for the idiot light as says our manual. Im thinking one wire with 12v sources on both ends is bad and is what cooked my new regulator, in the video i notice there is no stator wire from the Alt to the regulator, and no Instrument wire. Our book and old ford both are wired the same as in the video, whereas my truck WAS wired like the diagram.

Now for the ultimate question: Why in the **** are they different?!?! Which one am i supposed to have and are there in fact TWO different regulators... this seems really simple, i just cant figure out why its a problem.