HELP == Start up Problems 99 F250 == HELP
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
HEy guys, I have been posting to the heavy duty super duty truck page in the belief that the V10 guys were all over there. MISTAKE.
So here's the deal, I have a 1997 Super duty E350 box truck( ex Ryder lease). Runs great for 15/20 mins, then quits. Takes 15 /20 mins to restart and then does the same thing. Took me 3 days to go 500 miles. Ford dealer said fuel pump, so installed new pump and filter. Started right up, left dealership with a boatload of $$ and drove 20 minutes and guess what?? SAME DAMN THING !! To far away to go back, but called and of course you know the answer. I have checked relay, replaced pressure reg, get 30 lbs pressure at rails, NO START. Turns over, kicks a couple times , dies. Got it running with starter fluid, ran for 2 or 3 minutes, then died and same ole same ole. No codes on OBS
Going crazy here. Any ideas?? Much appreciated.
Thanks.
So here's the deal, I have a 1997 Super duty E350 box truck( ex Ryder lease). Runs great for 15/20 mins, then quits. Takes 15 /20 mins to restart and then does the same thing. Took me 3 days to go 500 miles. Ford dealer said fuel pump, so installed new pump and filter. Started right up, left dealership with a boatload of $$ and drove 20 minutes and guess what?? SAME DAMN THING !! To far away to go back, but called and of course you know the answer. I have checked relay, replaced pressure reg, get 30 lbs pressure at rails, NO START. Turns over, kicks a couple times , dies. Got it running with starter fluid, ran for 2 or 3 minutes, then died and same ole same ole. No codes on OBS
Going crazy here. Any ideas?? Much appreciated.
Thanks.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,561
Likes: 423
From: Long Island USA
When it does this, check for spark - kinda hard in an E350 unless you take out the doghouse.
If there's no spark, I bet I know what it is - crank position sensor.
The sensor gets hot, fails, the engine cools off, sensor works again. Engine heats up, sensor fails, cools off, works again.
Basically, the computer has no idea that the engine is turning.
The crank position sensor is under the AC compressor on the passenger side of the engine, I believe it's in the timing cover. Easy to replace from underneath, or so I've read.
There is a slight chance that the tone ring on the crank moves away from the sensor enough to cause problems because of excessive crankshaft end-play. But the "cut off and not run for 15 minutes" leads me to believe it's a heat-related issue with that sensor.
If there's no spark, I bet I know what it is - crank position sensor.
The sensor gets hot, fails, the engine cools off, sensor works again. Engine heats up, sensor fails, cools off, works again.
Basically, the computer has no idea that the engine is turning.
The crank position sensor is under the AC compressor on the passenger side of the engine, I believe it's in the timing cover. Easy to replace from underneath, or so I've read.
There is a slight chance that the tone ring on the crank moves away from the sensor enough to cause problems because of excessive crankshaft end-play. But the "cut off and not run for 15 minutes" leads me to believe it's a heat-related issue with that sensor.
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Hey Guys, Thank you. I too think it is an electrical situation and will take a look at spark first, then sensor issue.
I have looked at all the harnesses and no rats or other critters. I did have that happen on another occasion with another vehicle where a mother opossum decided to have her brood in the engine compartment of a Volvo I had stashed at a weekend cabin. Sure did like the taste of the ign. wiring!!
This damn Ford is killing me, but I'll give it another chance before I order some C4.
I have looked at all the harnesses and no rats or other critters. I did have that happen on another occasion with another vehicle where a mother opossum decided to have her brood in the engine compartment of a Volvo I had stashed at a weekend cabin. Sure did like the taste of the ign. wiring!!
This damn Ford is killing me, but I'll give it another chance before I order some C4.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,561
Likes: 423
From: Long Island USA
When I said "check for spark" - if you have none, that will point at the crank sensor. Without the sensor working right, there will be no spark, no injector pulses, nothing.
Modular motor junkie
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 6,190
Likes: 8
From: Texas
If it was the crank position sensor it would show 0 RPM even with the engine turning over.
Something like a Livewire or scangauge could really help if thats what it is.
Where are you viker?
Something like a Livewire or scangauge could really help if thats what it is.
Where are you viker?
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
OK Guys.
Went out today and checked the spark. A TON OF IT !! Put the plug back in,and tried to start. SAME OLE SAME OLE. Kicks over a couple times, like only a couple cylinders and then ZERO. Fuel pressure is there, spark is there, but no run. The boots looked good although the plugs could probably be replaced. They were not real dirty, but reflected the several days of attempts I have made to get this thing started. ANY chance the O2 sensors or the MAF or idle control are bad??
The thing that is making me crazy is how it acted, run for awhile then crap out, restart after a bit and do it all over again. I could get to 65 on the hwy and maintain for ten to fifteen minutes before it would stumble and then drop to 25 to 30 mph. At that point it would either die completely or burp a couple times and get back up to speed and start all over again. That is why we suspected fuel filter, then fuel pump and now who the hell knows??
I can't get it running to get to a dealer for a diagnostic.
I need a traveling FORD mechaic!! LOL
Thanks
Went out today and checked the spark. A TON OF IT !! Put the plug back in,and tried to start. SAME OLE SAME OLE. Kicks over a couple times, like only a couple cylinders and then ZERO. Fuel pressure is there, spark is there, but no run. The boots looked good although the plugs could probably be replaced. They were not real dirty, but reflected the several days of attempts I have made to get this thing started. ANY chance the O2 sensors or the MAF or idle control are bad??
The thing that is making me crazy is how it acted, run for awhile then crap out, restart after a bit and do it all over again. I could get to 65 on the hwy and maintain for ten to fifteen minutes before it would stumble and then drop to 25 to 30 mph. At that point it would either die completely or burp a couple times and get back up to speed and start all over again. That is why we suspected fuel filter, then fuel pump and now who the hell knows??
I can't get it running to get to a dealer for a diagnostic.
I need a traveling FORD mechaic!! LOL
Thanks
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
HEY A THOUGHT !1 Could it be dirty injectors?? If so, what is the best way to clean or to check this out?/ OH I am in California out of Stockton.
Thanks
Thanks
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Senior User
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 364
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From: mt.prospect
Definetly doesn't sound like a maf or o2 problem. Sounds like a fuel problem. Are you checking fuel pressure at all times, even when it's cranking? Fuel pumps and fp relays can trick you..Put a fuel pressure gauge on it and temporarly zip tie it to you windshield wiper and watch it when it starts to die out. I bet it drops! Or the spark plugs are extremely fouled out. G/l
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
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I have the air box removed or at least the air filter portion.From air filter back to MAF and idle control, it is intact. That is how I am squirting the starting fluid to get it to kick over, although it is not doing even that now.As for the other suggestion, the pressure reading is from the pump at turn of the key( 30 psi) I can't get it to run to recheck, but as soon as the new pump was installed, it read 30 at key turn and a bit over 40 when it started and was running. The one plug I pulled did not look anywhere near fouled, just a bit old. I do not know when they were replaced, but the symptoms I am having are not plug related except perhaps now for the hard starting. They would not be the cause of running at hwy speeds, then just dropping to nearly zero.
This one really has me baffled.
This one really has me baffled.
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
OK GUYS.. WHERE ARE YOU??
EVERYTHING that has been recommended has been checked and found to be OK. Since this seems to be an intermittent problem, my focus will be on the electrics. No codes tells me it is not ELECTRONIC, but it still could be electric to mechanical. (anyone follow that?). I am going to focus on all the grounds as well as the battery as it seems to have some funky terminals that cannot be tightened more the loose( can turn terminals even when tightened to the max).
Has anyone had a ground situation and if so, care to share as it may be common and overlooked..
As stated previously, relays, pump, filters, regulators, ALL have been checked and/or replaced with absolutely no change. Ignition is very healthy, no water found at base of plugs, COPS all look good with no boot deterioration.
WHATS LEFT ?
Thank you.
EVERYTHING that has been recommended has been checked and found to be OK. Since this seems to be an intermittent problem, my focus will be on the electrics. No codes tells me it is not ELECTRONIC, but it still could be electric to mechanical. (anyone follow that?). I am going to focus on all the grounds as well as the battery as it seems to have some funky terminals that cannot be tightened more the loose( can turn terminals even when tightened to the max).
Has anyone had a ground situation and if so, care to share as it may be common and overlooked..
As stated previously, relays, pump, filters, regulators, ALL have been checked and/or replaced with absolutely no change. Ignition is very healthy, no water found at base of plugs, COPS all look good with no boot deterioration.
WHATS LEFT ?
Thank you.
FTE Leadership Emeritus
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 42,561
Likes: 423
From: Long Island USA
Next on the list is to check for 12 volts at the injector harness when this happens.
When it won't start, check with a meter between the red wire at one injector on BOTH banks and ground and see if you have 12 volts with the key on.
When it won't start, check with a meter between the red wire at one injector on BOTH banks and ground and see if you have 12 volts with the key on.
Freshman User
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 41
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OK, got 12V at the red and ground. Still no start! As I have stated, kicks over like on a couple cylinders and dies. Like a typical carb car would do when cold and no choke.
I am going over all grounds now just to make sure.
This one has me by the pelotas for sure!!
I am going over all grounds now just to make sure.
This one has me by the pelotas for sure!!
