Super Duty getting Ecoboost?
Postmaster
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: None of your business
A turbo gas engine will have reliability issues just like a diesel. You notice that you see very few mass-produced turbo sports cars anymore? Turbo is awesome, but it drastically drops reliability that all automakers have to look at for their reputations and warranty claims. In the 80s and 90s, there was the GS-T and GS-X Eclipse, RX-7, Mitsubishi Starion/Dodge Conquest, Nissan 300ZX, Ford SVO Mustang, Dodge Omni Shelby GLH, numerous Chrysler cars (as they were teamed up with Mitsubishi then. Notice how all of the cars that were turbo at some point, were either dropped altogether (at least in the US) or given a non-turbo engine. Turbo engines run like a top for about 100K miles, and then is time to invest serious dollars into replacement and rebuilding of parts.
Mike
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From: Isanti, MN
Ford said every vehicle line will get an Ecoboost option. When will the Super Duty trucks get one, and which engine would it be? I'd bet it would be the 5.0. With twin turbos, the 5.0 EB should make about 480HP & 600TQ or so. If they build it, I will be in line! I'll take a 550 cab/chassis with 120" WB. That should have quite a bit more power and economy over the current V10, without the cost or problems of the diesels.
First of all diesels are complex because of the turbo systems as well as direct injection. EcoBoost has two turbos and a high pressure common-rail injection system which is nearly as complex as what you'd see on a diesel.
Originally Posted by LSchicago2
Ford did a lot of work on these engines to make them reliable. The turbos are stainless steel, and are liquid cooled to aid longevity. I have a lot of faith in Ford's engineering lately. Ford is #1 in quality in this country.
I would expect the EcoBoost engines to fare just as well as the 6.7L PSD as far as quality and reliability. So the question is, where's the benefit for reliability?
The new Ford diesel engine should prove to be reliable enough to make purchase cost the biggest reason for considering a gas engine. The EcoBoost isn't a simple engine, nor is it cheap. So where's the market for it? Those wanting a relatively simple, rock solid engine will choose the 6.2L, while those desiring fuel economy and towing power would choose the PSD.
Postmaster
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From: None of your business
Diesels also have urea and DPF systems, more frequent filter changes, more oil, higher pressure fuel injection, soot going through everything, higher temps, more coolers.
Other than the high pressure fuel injection, there is nothing brand new on the 3.5EB.
Mike
Other than the high pressure fuel injection, there is nothing brand new on the 3.5EB.
Mike
Hotshot
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From: Pa
A question in my mind is what is what are GM and Chrysler/Dodge/Fiat/Ram/Jeep doing to prepare for the future requirements?
I have to say I give kudos to Ford for looking ahead and getting this EB program off to a somewhat early start. I think starting with the smaller 3.5l EB and working their way up in displacement and GVWR applications is a very logical approach.
I have to say I give kudos to Ford for looking ahead and getting this EB program off to a somewhat early start. I think starting with the smaller 3.5l EB and working their way up in displacement and GVWR applications is a very logical approach.
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Joined: Jul 2002
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From: Long Island USA
In terms of the Powerstroke, that might be true. In terms of "turbo diesels" in general, the turbos are usually a 100K mile-replacement part, if not sooner.
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,502
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From: Bend Oregon
reality is several of those pieces of equipment are still on the road with over 1.5 million miles and the original turbo still hanging there on the side of the engine whistling away.Yeah the motors have been in-framed, they generally start using a little oil at over a million miles so you have to throw some new piston packs in there but the original turbos are still chugging away.
you did say "turbo diesels in general" so I assume OTR truck engines are fair to talk about
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From: Juneau, ALASKA
A turbo gas engine will have reliability issues just like a diesel. You notice that you see very few mass-produced turbo sports cars anymore? Turbo is awesome, but it drastically drops reliability that all automakers have to look at for their reputations and warranty claims. In the 80s and 90s, there was the GS-T and GS-X Eclipse, RX-7, Mitsubishi Starion/Dodge Conquest, Nissan 300ZX, Ford SVO Mustang, Dodge Omni Shelby GLH, numerous Chrysler cars (as they were teamed up with Mitsubishi then. Notice how all of the cars that were turbo at some point, were either dropped altogether (at least in the US) or given a non-turbo engine. Turbo engines run like a top for about 100K miles, and then is time to invest serious dollars into replacement and rebuilding of parts.
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This is what the SuperDuty should get.
This is what the SuperDuty should get.
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From: Auburn, Wa
Honestly I was reading an Article in Diesel Power Magazine, The future of engines have so many ways to go. I personally like what I read in the article.
Develpers at the University of Wisconsin-Madison:
They devolped an engine that was a Gas/Diesel Hybrid. Basically they took a diesel engine and through out the fuel curves they programed and added Gas.
November 2010 Vol. 6 issue 11
Diesel Power Magazine
The engine Had Near 0% emmisions, And the Thermal efficiency was 60%.
The engine also requires lower injection pressures 7,000ish-12,000ish.
Most current diesels can be converted easily by adding Gas tank, Common port injector and a control module.
NO EMMISIONS EQUIPMENT!! The emmisions on this was Well below current regulations. Bio diesel and E85 is expected to have higher Thermal efficiency.
Postmaster
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From: None of your business
Mike
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From: Dongola, IL
7.3L get at least 200,000 out of there tubos, usually longer. I had a 97 F-250 Powerstroke with 349,000 on the original turbo and it was still going strong.
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From: Long Island USA
Yes, yes I did. I should have said "medium-duty" or some such other qualification, because I was thinking about 3/4-1 ton pickups, and medium-duty trucks like the 450/550 and even the "heavier" medium-duty trucks like the 650/750. Not necessarily Ford, neither.