After 45000 miles on GY Silent Armor's I just had new Michelin LTX-MS2's mounted and balanced by Ford, I am still questioning whether or not new GSA's would have been the better choice. I still have 2 weeks left under Michelin's 30 day guarantee, so I would appreciate any input that any of you have had in going from GSA's to the LTX-MS2's or going from LTX-MS2's to GSA's on your 4x4 Excursions.
What I have experienced is the following:
Michelin Pros: Lower Rolling Resistance; Less drag when turning yielding shorter turning radius; better MPG by 1.0-1.5 MPG; better cornering; very quiet for LT 10 ply tires. Cons: They appear to give a harder ride on highway and side roads and I have felt a "looser" road feel on highway compared to the GSA's.

Have any of you experienced the same thing where the GSA's offer a softer (while definitely a little noisier) ride on the highway?
Thanks in advance for your input.
Jeff

 

I have the Michelin LTX A/T 2 that were on the truck when I got it. I have not had any problems with them and they work fine whether I tow or not. They have also been good at the boat ramp, even at low tide. Though I don't really do any 4wheeling I did use these tires to unload/load my boat into a lake (from the shore with no boat ramp) and I didn't have a problem that day either.

I will be sticking with these.

 

I'm getting the Michelin LTX A/T 2s soon. Never heard a bad thing about them, 70,000 mile warranty helps as well.

 

keep the Michelin's

they are hands down the best tire on the market. without a question

but...always one of those

they don't look the coolest, they are expensive, and they'll last for freakin' ever. This is my second set (different vehicles though).




I've also had the Silent Armour. Great tire. I loved it as well. And the price was very very reasonable. But it can't hold a candle to the Michelin. They do look nice however

 

Haven't switched from Goodyear silent armors because I have never had them (have heard some bad reviews on them in larger sizes) but I do have the MS2 Michelins on my Ex in 285's and they are outstanding tires. Quiet and so far like brand new with 3k on them.

 

Then it appears to me that what I am experiencing is not a problem with the tires, but perhaps a need to have my Excursion alignment checked one more time by Ford! They have already aligned it once and then realigned it after I complained of excessive looseness in the steering. So I wonder if the caster needs to be increased from 3.0 & 3.2 to 3.5 and the toe-in/out increased from -.03 & -.04 to 0?


After the 1st alignment (in degrees):
LF Camber .3; Caster 3.0; Toe .01
RF Camber -.2; Caster 3.2; Toe -.03
Total Toe -.03; SteerAhead .02
LR Camber .1; Toe .12
RR Camber -.03; Toe .16
Total Toe .27; Thrust Angle -.02

After the Realignment (in degrees):
LF Camber .3; Caster 3.0; Toe -.03
RF Camber -.2; Caster 3.2; Toe -.04
Total Toe -.07; Steer Ahead 0.00
LR Camber .1; Toe .13
RR Camber -.3; Toe .18
Total Toe .31; Thrust Angle -.03

Do you think those adjustments would tighten up the steering?

 

first check the easy stuff

what tire pressure are you running?
are the tires D or E rated?

 

These are the specifications for alignment for the Excursions. You can compare what you have to this. I do not believe this takes into consideration adjustments to alleviate road crown. Any changes in rake from a lift or change in springs has to be accounted for along with tire changes.


<table border="1" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="3"><caption>Alignment Specifications </caption><tbody><tr><th align="center" valign="bottom">Item </th><th align="center" valign="bottom">LH </th><th align="center" valign="bottom">RH </th><th align="center" valign="bottom">Total/ Split </th></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top" colspan="4">4x2 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Camber </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.62° ± 1.0° </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.62° ± 1.0° </td><td align="center" valign="top">0° ± 1.0° </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Caster </td><td align="center" valign="top">4.4° ± 1.4° </td><td align="center" valign="top">4.6° ± 1.4° </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.2° ± 0.75° </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Toe @ curb ride height (positive value is toe-in, negative value is toe-out) </td><td align="center" valign="top">— </td><td align="center" valign="top">— </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.1° ± 0.25° </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top" colspan="4">4x4 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Camber </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.25° ± 1.0° </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.25° ± 1.0° </td><td align="center" valign="top">0° ± 1.0° </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Caster </td><td align="center" valign="top">3.63° ± 2.0° </td><td align="center" valign="top">4.0° ± 2.0° </td><td align="center" valign="top">-0.37° ± 0.55° </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Toe @ curb ride height (positive value is toe-in, negative value is toe-out) </td><td align="center" valign="top">— </td><td align="center" valign="top">— </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.01° ± 0.25° </td></tr></tbody></table>

<table border="1" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="3"><caption>General Specifications </caption><tbody><tr><th align="center" valign="bottom">Item </th><th align="center" valign="bottom">Specification </th></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top" colspan="2">Ride Height — 4x2 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Front — RH </td><td align="center" valign="top">108 mm (4.24 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Front — LH </td><td align="center" valign="top">114 mm (4.72 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Rear </td><td align="center" valign="top">156 mm (5.32 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top" colspan="2">Ride Height — 4x4 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Front </td><td align="center" valign="top">100 mm (4.44 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Rear </td><td align="center" valign="top">142 mm (4.92 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top" colspan="2">Ball Joint Deflection </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Lower </td><td align="center" valign="top">0-1.0 mm (0-0.040 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Upper </td><td align="center" valign="top">0-0.6 mm (0-0.024 in) </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Wheel bearing end play (4WD) — maximum radial </td><td align="center" valign="top">0.13 mm (0.005 in) </td></tr></tbody></table>



<table border="1" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="3"><caption>Torque Specifications </caption><tbody><tr><th align="center" valign="bottom">Description </th><th align="center" valign="bottom">Nm </th><th align="center" valign="bottom">lb-ft </th></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Adjusting sleeve clamp nuts </td><td align="center" valign="top">55 </td><td align="center" valign="top">41 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Front spring U-bolt nut (4WD) </td><td align="center" valign="top">133 </td><td align="center" valign="top">99 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Rear spring U-bolt nut </td><td align="center" valign="top">200 </td><td align="center" valign="top">148 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Upper ball joint pinch bolt (4x2) </td><td align="center" valign="top">80 </td><td align="center" valign="top">60 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Upper ball joint nut (4x4) </td><td align="center" valign="top">94 </td><td align="center" valign="top">69 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Outer tie-rod castle nut </td><td align="center" valign="top">115 </td><td align="center" valign="top">85 </td></tr><tr><td align="left" valign="top">Lower ball joint nut (4x4) </td><td align="center" valign="top">204 </td><td align="center" valign="top">150
</td></tr></tbody></table>

 

More information can be found here:

Alignment specs and recommendations - PowerStrokeNation : Ford Powerstroke Diesel Forum

and here: (This is the best alignment and suspension tutorial for the masses that I have ever seen)

http://mysite.verizon.net/res108eps/...ion-basics.pdf

 

They are 10 ply E Rated and the are filled with nitrogen by Ford to 50 psi
front & 55 psi rear as was and is recommended by Ford for the Excursion 4x4. And they are obviously brand new, no wear so that cannot be the issue.
The alignment must have been off with the Goodyears as there was mild cupping on the tires after 45000 miles. And it could be that after the alignments what I am experiencing is just the difference in footprint, straight tread vs. aggressive tread?????
As I stated, there are many positives with the Michelins, the truck just "feels different" compared to the road feel I experienced with the Goodyears, the only tires on the truck since I have owned it!

 

No change in rake or lift from factory specs, original springs, etc.
So, based upon these charts, do I need to have them install caster shims to increase positive caster? And is my minimal toe-out incorrect as it should be 0? Or, are all my readings acceptable as they are within the accepted ranges? As you can tell I am a novice when it comes to knowledge of alignment!
Thanks for your help.
Jeff

 

What pressure are your new tires at? Try lowering to 45-55 PSI and see if you don't like the way they drive better. New tires with lots of pressure can feel kind of detached and floating around on the road.

 

The Michelins will always yield the best MPG and wear. If your truck is a "pavement princess", then get the Michelins. I say this becuase due to the tread pattern they don't have the teeth to get around in the slick stuff.

I had some on my Excursion before I lifted it and it always got no less than 18 mpg with them on. I was driving into a bar on the lake and they had a little mud in their driveway, I started to drive through it thinking I'd be ok, but then tires started to spin. Two months later, the Ex got lifted and I put some BFG All-terrains on and just happened to end up at that same bar again, it walked right through the mud as if it wasn't there.

My advice:

If your truck spends most of it's time on-road and on the freeway, get the michelins.

If your truck occasionally goes off road and sees mud from time to time, get the Goodyear Silent Armor tires. They're a good combination of off-road grip and on-road manners while yielding good fuel economy.

 

Ditto-- I couldnt be happier w/ my Goodyear Silent Armor pros in the snow or off road I have been in.

 

I went and checked the tire pressure @ all 4 wheels EVEN THOUGH they were supposedly checked by Ford when filled with nitrogen. The rear tires were and are both set @ 55 psi, but the LF was reading 50.5 psi and the RF 49, 1.5 psi difference. While that didn't seem like much, I adjusted them so that they would be equal @ 48.5 psi and took it out for a spin on the highway and it seems that that little adjustment may have eliminated the remaining little bit of looseness or sway. I will just have to try it for a few days and see.
Is it possible that since they are filled with nitrogen, that the 1.5 psi difference was that noticeable?