starting
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
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starting
I have a 85 ford, 4x4 6.9 diesel, manual trans. push button glow plugs, new starter sylenoid, return lines and o rings on the injectors. When the engine is cold I need to light the glow plugs for ten seconds and then crank the engine for about 15 seconds. I need to perform this 3 times for it to start. I see no fuel leaking or lines even wet. I have 5.5 PSI at my Schreader valve. My glow plugs all heat. I have good battery power and my starter was just cleaned and turns over quickly. When the engine is warm, It starts good. The engine has plenty of power.
Why does it take so long to start cold???
Why does it take so long to start cold???
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,227
Likes: 149
From: Higginsville, MO
air molecules are smaller than that of the diesel fuel air can be getting in but you not even notice it on the lines but it will be hard to start.... im having the same problem i know which injector it is though.... you may not.... i just picked up some knew o-rings today i haven't changed them yet
Methanoholic
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,442
Likes: 8
From: Maine (NorCal Native)
Once it starts does it stay running or die ??
Pull your fuel filter after it has been setting and you expect it to start hard and see if it's completely full to the top ... If not you have the classic Air Intrusion and you'll need to install an Injector Installation Kit.
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
Pull your fuel filter after it has been setting and you expect it to start hard and see if it's completely full to the top ... If not you have the classic Air Intrusion and you'll need to install an Injector Installation Kit.
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
If it has been sitting over night the filter is still full. There is no longer a water seperator. it has been replaced by a double hose barb.
If I trace the lines and don't see any wet spots, what am I looking for? Do I need to replace every hos back to the tank? It has only one tank that is in the bed of the truck
The truck runs like a champ and has good power after it starts. The starting is the only issue.
I replaced the o-rings on every cylinder when I put the new plastic t's and return lines on the injectors. If an injector is working poorly would it run so well after it is started?
If I trace the lines and don't see any wet spots, what am I looking for? Do I need to replace every hos back to the tank? It has only one tank that is in the bed of the truck
The truck runs like a champ and has good power after it starts. The starting is the only issue.
I replaced the o-rings on every cylinder when I put the new plastic t's and return lines on the injectors. If an injector is working poorly would it run so well after it is started?
Methanoholic
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,442
Likes: 8
From: Maine (NorCal Native)
Two good things ... Full fuel filter and the bypassed/removed water separator.
Although to reduce the possible locations for air leaks, you should use one piece of hose to bypass the water separator, not two with a barbed joint, but not a big deal.
The o-rings have nothing to do with the injector operation ...
If your fuel filter is full when you would expect it to start hard, then your are not having Air Intrusion!
It runs good, so it's not sucking air.
Does it run smooth as soon as it starts or does it take a little time to smooth out???
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
Although to reduce the possible locations for air leaks, you should use one piece of hose to bypass the water separator, not two with a barbed joint, but not a big deal.
The o-rings have nothing to do with the injector operation ...
If your fuel filter is full when you would expect it to start hard, then your are not having Air Intrusion!
It runs good, so it's not sucking air.
Does it run smooth as soon as it starts or does it take a little time to smooth out???
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2010
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Methanoholic
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,442
Likes: 8
From: Maine (NorCal Native)
Do you get any smoke out the tail pipe before it starts ???
Is the Cold Start Circuit working ... I.E. High Idle
Being you have manual GP's ... Do not use them for the following test!
Next time it's set and you expect it to start hard ... Crack an Injector line at the Injector, have someone crank the motor (or use a remote starter button) and see if you get fuel immediately ... Be prepared to tighten it if in the unlikely chance it starts.
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
Is the Cold Start Circuit working ... I.E. High Idle
Being you have manual GP's ... Do not use them for the following test!
Next time it's set and you expect it to start hard ... Crack an Injector line at the Injector, have someone crank the motor (or use a remote starter button) and see if you get fuel immediately ... Be prepared to tighten it if in the unlikely chance it starts.
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
You are right, the high idle sylenoid isn't working, but don't I basicly override that by pushing on the pedal? I usually pump it while I push the button and then put it to the floor when I crank it.
I will try to check the fuel at the IP today
thanks
I will try to check the fuel at the IP today
thanks
Methanoholic
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,442
Likes: 8
From: Maine (NorCal Native)
No, You need the Cold Start system working, It also advances the IP for easier starts ...
Don't waste your time checking fuel at the injector until you get the Cold Start Circuit working!
When the motor is cold (below 112F), test for power at the rearward (towards rear of truck) IP electrical connector with keyon.
If no power then the Cold Start Thermal Switch is likely not working, it is located in the right (US passenger) side head behind/under the Thermostat housing.
On my 86 when I got it the Cold Start Thermal switch was broke (terminals broke off), I didn't want to open the cooling system yet, so I just hung a toggle switch in the grill temporary to replace the broken Cold Start Thermal switch, worked great, It's now correctly fixed!
That Cold Start Thermal switch is about $40 and is only available from Ford or International. Ford part number: E8TZ-9E939-A
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
Don't waste your time checking fuel at the injector until you get the Cold Start Circuit working!
When the motor is cold (below 112F), test for power at the rearward (towards rear of truck) IP electrical connector with keyon.
If no power then the Cold Start Thermal Switch is likely not working, it is located in the right (US passenger) side head behind/under the Thermostat housing.
On my 86 when I got it the Cold Start Thermal switch was broke (terminals broke off), I didn't want to open the cooling system yet, so I just hung a toggle switch in the grill temporary to replace the broken Cold Start Thermal switch, worked great, It's now correctly fixed!
That Cold Start Thermal switch is about $40 and is only available from Ford or International. Ford part number: E8TZ-9E939-A
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
I do have 11.62 volts on the high idle sylenoid with the key on, cold engine. but it does not advance the throttle.
When I get the pickup started, then I let it idle for about 20 seconds and shut it off, then immediatly try to start it, it fires right up.
I do get smoke out of the exhaust as soon as I start to crank the cold engine.
I will try to check the power at the cold start thermal switch today.
When I get the pickup started, then I let it idle for about 20 seconds and shut it off, then immediatly try to start it, it fires right up.
I do get smoke out of the exhaust as soon as I start to crank the cold engine.
I will try to check the power at the cold start thermal switch today.
Methanoholic
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,442
Likes: 8
From: Maine (NorCal Native)
What color of smoke ???
You need to test it at the IP ... The wire could be broken between High Idle solenoid and IP, Unlikely though!
Does the High Idle solenoid work ??? (does it move when you unplug and replug with keyon)
Is it just out of adjustment ??? (the pushrod turns to adjust)
No you don't really need it, it's just nice to have properly working!
However, You do need the Cold Start Advance for the IP working for easy starts.
Personally I am against starting the motor with the foot on the pedal ... Not much worse for a motor then high rev cold starts!
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
You need to test it at the IP ... The wire could be broken between High Idle solenoid and IP, Unlikely though!
Does the High Idle solenoid work ??? (does it move when you unplug and replug with keyon)
Is it just out of adjustment ??? (the pushrod turns to adjust)
No you don't really need it, it's just nice to have properly working!
However, You do need the Cold Start Advance for the IP working for easy starts.
Personally I am against starting the motor with the foot on the pedal ... Not much worse for a motor then high rev cold starts!
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
Methanoholic
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,442
Likes: 8
From: Maine (NorCal Native)
I will take that as white ... That means you have fuel, not enough heat!
That could be glow plugs or low compression.
You state it runs smooth as soon as it starts ... That pretty much counts out GP's.
I would test the compression.
If you have Motorcraft/Beru glow plugs try a little longer burn ...
-Enjoy
fh : )_~
That could be glow plugs or low compression.
You state it runs smooth as soon as it starts ... That pretty much counts out GP's.
I would test the compression.
If you have Motorcraft/Beru glow plugs try a little longer burn ...
-Enjoy
fh : )_~