Notices
2004 - 2008 F150 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 and 2008 Ford F150's with 5.4 V8, 4.6 V8 engine

5.4 to 4.6 engine swap possible?

 
  #1  
Old 09-10-2010, 08:42 AM
thumper477
thumper477 is offline
Junior User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 57
thumper477 is starting off with a positive reputation.
5.4 to 4.6 engine swap possible?

The 5.4 engine is toast in my 2006.It is the 3 valve engine.The prices that I have gotten for engines,used or reman,have made me cry.1500 and up for used and around 3,000+ for a reman.My truck is a 4x2 automatic.My question is: if I had access to the same year truck from a salvage yard with the 4.6,is the swap feasable to do?The junkyard will make me a package deal for all the stuff that I would need(computer,harnesses,exhaust,air cleaner,hoses,mounts,etc.Has anyone here done this swap?I use my 1 ton dually to tow anything big so I am not concerned that the 4.6 has less power.I have had great success with all of the 4.6's and the 2v 5.4's that I have had in the past but this 3v motor woofed out with low miles(44k) and is out of warranty.I think in the long run I would be more confident in the 4.6 motor lasting than spending the big bucks for another 3v "hand grenade" that might puke again.Plus the cost to do the 4.6 is less than 1/2 to do the 5.4.Any thoughts or opinions?BTW,I can do all the work myself so the extra time to do the swap does'nt count in the equation.Thanks.
 
  #2  
Old 09-10-2010, 05:34 PM
rick99601
rick99601 is offline
Freshman User
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: westland, mi
Posts: 28
rick99601 is starting off with a positive reputation.
sure you could

the 5.4's dont usually die unless you dont change the oil/run it out.

whatd you do to it?
 
  #3  
Old 09-10-2010, 09:31 PM
tbear853's Avatar
tbear853
tbear853 is offline
Postmaster
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Shenandoah Valley
Posts: 2,509
tbear853 has a very good reputation on FTE.tbear853 has a very good reputation on FTE.tbear853 has a very good reputation on FTE.
What happened to your 5.4 3v? Why do you think it's a hand grenade?
 
  #4  
Old 09-10-2010, 10:18 PM
thumper477
thumper477 is offline
Junior User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 57
thumper477 is starting off with a positive reputation.
I am not sure what combination of things killed the 3v 5.4 in my truck.I bought it used at an auction and had very little history on it.Ford replaced the cat converter under warranty just before I bought it on the drivers side.So the previous owner drove it for a time with a plugged exhaust.When I bought it it ran crappy and misfired and had a lot of clatter from the timing chain area.When I got it home I pulled the engine out and disassembled it.There was a lot of metallic sludge in the oil pan.The cam journals were scored as well as the cam bearing surfaces in the heads.There were 2 combustion chambers that leaked when I filled the chambers with gas(leaky valves).The crank and rod and main bearings looked decent as well as the pistons and rings.It seemed that there was an oil pressure/flow issue to the top end of the motor.Maybe a cheap oil filter was used at one time and it spit some crap into the oil passages.Maybe the previous owner used the wrong oil or did'nt change often enough.Who knows?Maybe Ford just did'nt get this engine right from the start.In any case it will be a lot of money to fix this engine and as stated in my earlier post,buying a 5.4 3v Ford engine is EXPENSIVE.I can live with the lower power/torque of the 4.6 in exchange for peace of mind that my engine will not puke prematurely.I remember the brand new 2006 F150 work truck that I had in 2005-06.We used only motorcraft filters and the correct oil and that motor clattered almost since new(bad phasers).We kept it 2 years and got rid of it before the warranty ran out.We did'nt trust a motor that was that noisy to run the usual 200-300 thousand miles that you would expect to get out of a quality american made truck.
 
  #5  
Old 09-11-2010, 04:44 AM
rick99601
rick99601 is offline
Freshman User
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: westland, mi
Posts: 28
rick99601 is starting off with a positive reputation.
Originally Posted by thumper477 View Post
I am not sure what combination of things killed the 3v 5.4 in my truck.I bought it used at an auction and had very little history on it.Ford replaced the cat converter under warranty just before I bought it on the drivers side.So the previous owner drove it for a time with a plugged exhaust.When I bought it it ran crappy and misfired and had a lot of clatter from the timing chain area.When I got it home I pulled the engine out and disassembled it.There was a lot of metallic sludge in the oil pan.The cam journals were scored as well as the cam bearing surfaces in the heads.There were 2 combustion chambers that leaked when I filled the chambers with gas(leaky valves).The crank and rod and main bearings looked decent as well as the pistons and rings.It seemed that there was an oil pressure/flow issue to the top end of the motor.Maybe a cheap oil filter was used at one time and it spit some crap into the oil passages.Maybe the previous owner used the wrong oil or did'nt change often enough.Who knows?Maybe Ford just did'nt get this engine right from the start.In any case it will be a lot of money to fix this engine and as stated in my earlier post,buying a 5.4 3v Ford engine is EXPENSIVE.I can live with the lower power/torque of the 4.6 in exchange for peace of mind that my engine will not puke prematurely.I remember the brand new 2006 F150 work truck that I had in 2005-06.We used only motorcraft filters and the correct oil and that motor clattered almost since new(bad phasers).We kept it 2 years and got rid of it before the warranty ran out.We did'nt trust a motor that was that noisy to run the usual 200-300 thousand miles that you would expect to get out of a quality american made truck.
there is NOTHING wrong with the design of the 3v that causes catastrophic engine damage.

you bought a truck at an auction that someone beat and are pretty much blaming ford.

just the other day i heard of a 3v 5.4 going 35k miles on factory oil before failing.

yes it can be done. watch out for 4.6's with higher mileage, the timing chain tensioners go bad.
 
  #6  
Old 09-11-2010, 06:03 AM
thumper477
thumper477 is offline
Junior User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 57
thumper477 is starting off with a positive reputation.
OK,I am not going to expect anyone on a Ford forum to throw dirt on the reputation of the 5.4 3v engine.I guess every post that i have read about 5.4 engine problems on this site were caused by the owners neglect or abuse,not an engine design issue.In any case i did'nt start this thread to argue about WHY the engine in my 44k mile truck is toast.That is water over the bridge now.I just wanted any input from the members here as to the feasability of the 4.6 swap into my 2006 truck.That's all.Anyone's input on that subject would be appreciated.I did'nt start this post to **** on the reputation of the 5.4 3v engine.Thanks in advance for any help on this.
 
  #7  
Old 09-11-2010, 06:33 AM
db_tanker's Avatar
db_tanker
db_tanker is offline
Elder User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Willis, Texas
Posts: 549
db_tanker is starting off with a positive reputation.
don't worry bro, lots of folks around here have thin skin with their 5.4's. lol

your best bet is to find yourself a factory service manual and work from there.

you have to think that some of the wiring harness is going to be the same...mostly for the body and AC, when it comes to the engine is where it gets iffy...So be sure to get as much of the wiring harness as you can get. Even if it IS part of the body, never hurts to get extra. Motor mounts. The tranny in your truck is a 4r75 vs a 4r70 in the 4.6 truck. the 75 just has some stouter guts but its still just a 70 "Built" from the factory.You covered the snorkel and other stuff...

just going to have to treat it like a jig-saw puzzle...as I said first off...get that factory repair manual. That will by and far be your best "tool" in the box.

Hope this helps a little bro,

D


edit to add...

Good point with a previous post...

Since you will have the donor motor out...do the basics...new gaskets all around, new tensioners and chains, and just overall go over the engine since you will, I assume, have it on an engine stand. If you can, I would also do a compression check as well...Get the yard where you get it to give you some kind of guarantee on that to get you a different motor if it isn't in spec. I would try, at least...
 
  #8  
Old 09-11-2010, 09:43 AM
Greg B
Greg B is offline
Postmaster
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,565
Greg B has a good reputation on FTE.Greg B has a good reputation on FTE.Greg B has a good reputation on FTE.
Doesn't sound like the 5.4L engine is completely gone, but it is the result of never changing oil or running the wrong viscocity of oil. Kinda sounds like the top end was starved for oil. The 4.6 swap is possible. Just follow everyone's advice and get all that you can from the donor truck. You will need wiring diagrams for both combinations as the wiring will be the biggest challenge.
 
  #9  
Old 09-11-2010, 03:39 PM
thumper477
thumper477 is offline
Junior User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 57
thumper477 is starting off with a positive reputation.
Originally Posted by tbear853 View Post
What happened to your 5.4 3v? Why do you think it's a hand grenade?
When i called the local Jasper engine rep for prices on a reman 5.4,"hand genade "was the phrase HE USED to express his opinion of the 3v 5.4 engine.He said the oiling system was poorly designed and only perfect maintenance would give anyone a chance for any longevity with it.He said that the high price of a reman was because of the high scrappage rate of the used engine parts that normally can be refurbished/reused and the amount of expensive brand new parts they had to use to rebuild one.He also said that there are no upgrades or mods that they can do to make the reman's any better than a stock ford motor.No magic pills in other words.
 
  #10  
Old 09-11-2010, 04:02 PM
Beechkid
Beechkid is offline
Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Southern California
Posts: 4,448
Beechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud ofBeechkid has much to be proud of
Originally Posted by thumper477 View Post
When i called the local Jasper engine rep for prices on a reman 5.4,"hand genade "was the phrase HE USED to express his opinion of the 3v 5.4 engine.He said the oiling system was poorly designed and only perfect maintenance would give anyone a chance for any longevity with it.He said that the high price of a reman was because of the high scrappage rate of the used engine parts that normally can be refurbished/reused and the amount of expensive brand new parts they had to use to rebuild one.He also said that there are no upgrades or mods that they can do to make the reman's any better than a stock ford motor.No magic pills in other words.
A sales job if I ever heard one before!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
  #11  
Old 09-11-2010, 07:10 PM
thumper477
thumper477 is offline
Junior User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 57
thumper477 is starting off with a positive reputation.
Well,I guess Jasper and all the other vendors that sell engines must all be in bed together to fix the prices as everyone wants 3,000-4,000 for a reman engine.
 
  #12  
Old 09-11-2010, 07:37 PM
db_tanker's Avatar
db_tanker
db_tanker is offline
Elder User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Willis, Texas
Posts: 549
db_tanker is starting off with a positive reputation.
you also should look at the number of these engines built vs number of 4.6 engines built. There is a rather disparaging number in favor of the 4.6...quite a few of 'em laying around. lol

The 5.4 3v started in 2004 so its had about 6 or so years.
 
  #13  
Old 09-11-2010, 08:44 PM
FlyByNight
FlyByNight is offline
Senior User
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 332
FlyByNight is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Originally Posted by thumper477 View Post
Well,I guess Jasper and all the other vendors that sell engines must all be in bed together to fix the prices as everyone wants 3,000-4,000 for a reman engine.
You sound like you know what you're talking about thumper so I have a stupid question that means nothing, did that 5.4 have aluminum rod and main bearings? I'm also wondering why you don't just rebuild the short block and go with a set of 2v heads? It seems like it would be the cheapest, most dependable way out. I know you would still have wiring issues to deal with.
 
  #14  
Old 09-12-2010, 06:01 AM
thumper477
thumper477 is offline
Junior User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 57
thumper477 is starting off with a positive reputation.
Good idea on the head swap.I will have to do some resesrch on that to see if it is possible.
 
  #15  
Old 09-12-2010, 09:51 AM
Greg B
Greg B is offline
Postmaster
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,565
Greg B has a good reputation on FTE.Greg B has a good reputation on FTE.Greg B has a good reputation on FTE.
I would probably rebuild the 5.4L. I've killed enough brain cells in my life. And what the Jasper rep didn't tell is that all of the modular motors are in the $3000-$4500 range. A remanufactured 351 roller engine is in the $2000 range and a remanufactured 460 is slightly higher.
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: 5.4 to 4.6 engine swap possible?


Contact Us - About Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.