Died while driving
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From: North Cackalacky
Died while driving
Engine died this morning on the way to work. Hooked up AE and only had >200 psi showing on ICP while cranking. Unplugged ICP sensor and had above 2k but still no start. I have a new CPS and fuel pressure is ok according to my guage. It finally started without much cranking and I drove on in with no problems. Stomped on it a few times afterwards and it did fine, holding 2600. Yesterday at lunch it wouldnt start so we took a different vehicle, came back an hour later and it started fine up until it cutoff this am. I'm thinking maybe IPR, what do yo guys think?
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Sounds like your ICP sensor is going south.
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From: North Cackalacky
Clay, when I unplugged it and the pressure went to over 2k while cranking, and it still didnt start, I thought that it was ok.
After sitting for about 10 minutes, it started and I was on my way.
After sitting for about 10 minutes, it started and I was on my way.
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Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2007
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From: Payson, AZ
Darrell,
I copied this from PSN. It may help you narrow down your problem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Dave (golfer) on PSN 02-10-2010 Thanks Dave for the great trouble shooting guide.
its nevvvvver the oil pump...seriously.
I see sooooooooooooooo many guys (dealerships included) that see "no ICP" or some ICP codes in a scantool...and toss HPOP's on truck after truck...when it is either an IPR or an injector (poppet valve) issue.
If you hook up the scantool, and monitor ICP (psi) while cranking...you'll see IPR% (duty cycle) climb & climb 15% key on..20, 30, 40, 55%, higher..the increase in IPR% means that the PCM is requesting ICP pressure to increase...
so ALSO watch ICP(psi) and if it comes up to only 180-250psi or so and stays there...then it's the IPR hung open (bypassing oil back to the oil pan through the front cover) such that only minimal psi can be made.
If the ICP is VERY low...like under 60psi...then it could be injector (poppets) pissing oil (under the VC's)..which is typical for injector with more than 180-200k miles.
if ICP climbs above 550-600..then it will probably climb much higher (15-1800+) and it is most likely going to be an electrical issue.
If his scantool will not connect then its a PCM or chip issue (remove the chip if you have one & haven't removed it yet)
if the scantool connects AND you have >600ICP then look at the datastream for a RPM reading.
if the scantool picks up an RPM signal and it seems accurate....then the CPS is good.
If no RPM on the scantool, replace CPS.
If you have RPM (on scantool, not just on dash)...AND have ICP >600, then run an (key on, eng off) injector "buzz test"...
the buzz test is nothing more than a continuity test from the PCM, through the IDM, and to & from each injector solenoid.
LISTEN to each inj buzz....do they all sound the same? nice & crisp?
if the test passes (and you audibly heard them all)...then wiring is good, IDM is good, HPOP is good...CPS is good...then it could be a fuel issue. gasoline, water, etc....
I wouldn't mention it if I haven't seen it myself numerous times...
any chance this no start began with 10-20miles after a fillup?
holler if you need help troubleshooting.
take care~
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hope this helps.
I copied this from PSN. It may help you narrow down your problem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Dave (golfer) on PSN 02-10-2010 Thanks Dave for the great trouble shooting guide.
its nevvvvver the oil pump...seriously.
I see sooooooooooooooo many guys (dealerships included) that see "no ICP" or some ICP codes in a scantool...and toss HPOP's on truck after truck...when it is either an IPR or an injector (poppet valve) issue.
If you hook up the scantool, and monitor ICP (psi) while cranking...you'll see IPR% (duty cycle) climb & climb 15% key on..20, 30, 40, 55%, higher..the increase in IPR% means that the PCM is requesting ICP pressure to increase...
so ALSO watch ICP(psi) and if it comes up to only 180-250psi or so and stays there...then it's the IPR hung open (bypassing oil back to the oil pan through the front cover) such that only minimal psi can be made.
If the ICP is VERY low...like under 60psi...then it could be injector (poppets) pissing oil (under the VC's)..which is typical for injector with more than 180-200k miles.
if ICP climbs above 550-600..then it will probably climb much higher (15-1800+) and it is most likely going to be an electrical issue.
If his scantool will not connect then its a PCM or chip issue (remove the chip if you have one & haven't removed it yet)
if the scantool connects AND you have >600ICP then look at the datastream for a RPM reading.
if the scantool picks up an RPM signal and it seems accurate....then the CPS is good.
If no RPM on the scantool, replace CPS.
If you have RPM (on scantool, not just on dash)...AND have ICP >600, then run an (key on, eng off) injector "buzz test"...
the buzz test is nothing more than a continuity test from the PCM, through the IDM, and to & from each injector solenoid.
LISTEN to each inj buzz....do they all sound the same? nice & crisp?
if the test passes (and you audibly heard them all)...then wiring is good, IDM is good, HPOP is good...CPS is good...then it could be a fuel issue. gasoline, water, etc....
I wouldn't mention it if I haven't seen it myself numerous times...
any chance this no start began with 10-20miles after a fillup?
holler if you need help troubleshooting.
take care~
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hope this helps.
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From: North Cackalacky
Darrell,
I copied this from PSN. It may help you narrow down your problem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Dave (golfer) on PSN 02-10-2010 Thanks Dave for the great trouble shooting guide.
If you hook up the scantool, and monitor ICP (psi) while cranking...you'll see IPR% (duty cycle) climb & climb 15% key on..20, 30, 40, 55%, higher..the increase in IPR% means that the PCM is requesting ICP pressure to increase...
so ALSO watch ICP(psi) and if it comes up to only 180-250psi or so and stays there...then it's the IPR hung open (bypassing oil back to the oil pan through the front cover) such that only minimal psi can be made.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hope this helps.
I copied this from PSN. It may help you narrow down your problem.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by Dave (golfer) on PSN 02-10-2010 Thanks Dave for the great trouble shooting guide.
If you hook up the scantool, and monitor ICP (psi) while cranking...you'll see IPR% (duty cycle) climb & climb 15% key on..20, 30, 40, 55%, higher..the increase in IPR% means that the PCM is requesting ICP pressure to increase...
so ALSO watch ICP(psi) and if it comes up to only 180-250psi or so and stays there...then it's the IPR hung open (bypassing oil back to the oil pan through the front cover) such that only minimal psi can be made.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hope this helps.
That nails it right there Robin. I was seeing 60% dc and somewhere around 200 ICP when cranking.
Tried to rep ya but you know the deal.
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Joined: Feb 2010
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From: Opelika, AL
what about this?
"if ICP climbs above 550-600..then it will probably climb much higher (15-1800+) and it is most likely going to be an electrical issue."
or is this not valid since you got 2K after unhooking the icp? just trying to learn
"if ICP climbs above 550-600..then it will probably climb much higher (15-1800+) and it is most likely going to be an electrical issue."
or is this not valid since you got 2K after unhooking the icp? just trying to learn
Because racetruck
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,786
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From: Monterey Bay, CA
Shawn, when you unplug the ICP, the PCM goes to a default oil table. Hence the 2000+ psi. The ICP is what tells the PCM what the pressure is. With it unplugged, the PCM sees zero. Therefore it defaults to 2000+. Your truck will run with the ICP unplugged but you won't like it.
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From: Opelika, AL
Shawn, when you unplug the ICP, the PCM goes to a default oil table. Hence the 2000+ psi. The ICP is what tells the PCM what the pressure is. With it unplugged, the PCM sees zero. Therefore it defaults to 2000+. Your truck will run with the ICP unplugged but you won't like it.
thanks!!! that explains it
