Hey guys!

I've searched the forum for this problem and haven't found anything that addresses my specific problem, I'm sure it's out there but I can't seem to find it and I'm desperate....

While driving back to Vegas from Anaheim yesterday somewhere around the Cajon pass the A/C in my girlfriends 2006 Escape stopped working. We just had the 60k service done last Thursday and had great A/C up until this point. The only thing done out of the ordinary on the service was having the belt tension pulley replaced due to loose bearings. We drove from Vegas to Escondido on Saturday, all around San Diego on Sunday, from Escondido to Anaheim on Monday and parked the car at the hotel for 2 days.

It started to get warm coming over the pass so we switched the AC on, it never really got super cold, but it was cool air for sure. We stopped in Victorville for gas and food when we realized we were getting hot air. I checked to look for anything obvious and saw nothing. I stopped by Autozone to pick up a recharge kit thinking it would at least be a shot at getting us back to Vegas in the 100+ degree heat.

When I hooked the gauge up to the low pressure side it immediately pegged the gauge until the needle was pushed all the way back to 0, I think that particular gauge only goes up to 80psi. The compressor clutch is working, and the compressor pulley spins and makes no strange noises. I've checked the low pressure reading twice since we've been back and get the same results. I have checked as soon as the compressor turns on and after it has been running for ~5 minutes. So from Victorville to Vegas we drove without A/C, when we stopped in Baker it was 117, we both felt baked and completely drained by the time we got home.... but we made it.

I'm thinking at this point it's the expansion valve or orifice tube (whatever it is the Escape uses).

Any thoughts? I'm pretty technically savvy but I've never dealt with A/C before other than what I've done this far.

 

you really need to hook up a manifold gauge and give high side and low side readings if your low side has that kind of pressure you might have a compressor issue you really need to use a good set of gauges and don't rely on those quick fix cans

 

I have a friend that has the gauges and much more knowledge than me about AC systems. I'm going to head to his place on Monday to see what we can figure out.

 

In case anyone else is having a similar issue... here's what I found.


I used my friends gauges and verified the high and low pressure readings were exactly the same.

Rather than screw around with it anymore I took it to my mechanic and he found that the compressor had completely locked up. Since the hub on the compressor is plastic it immediately shattered giving the illusion the clutch was engaging and spinning the compressor. Apparently this is a pretty common problem with this compressor, he said generally your lucky if you get 50-60k miles out of them. I guess living in Vegas really does a number on them.

Anyway, when the compressor locked up it crapped all sorts of metal into the system so everything had to be replaced. All said and done it was $1,140 and it was done in a day.

I asked about preventative maintenance and he said the best bet is to take it in once a year and have the system evac'd flushed and recharged.

Anyway, all is well now and hopefully this can help someone else figure out a problem.

 

There's oil in with the freon, so if it's cooling, your lubercating the compressor. Even if you had a slow leak, the oil will still likely stay in the system. If a hose lets go then the oil comes with it. I can't really see what a that job every year is going to do for you. Of course, they like you to come back every year, it's easy money!

 

Actually since there is so little freon in the system even a little leak will lower the amount of lubricant in the system. $59 bucks a year is a small price to pay if it extends the life of the system, even if only by a couple years.

 

In the old days when you just released the freon, you just cracked the guage open to allow a slow leak as to not release the oil. Less freon means less oil. If it makes you feel better, spend the money but $59 sounds rather cheap for that job.

 

You'd might as well have them flush and refill the air in the tires as to have the AC system evacuated, flushed, and refilled every year as a preventative measure.

Both are relatively worthless services.

 

You're a funny guy.

So let me get this straight....
You'll spend $20-40 to change the oil in your engine every 3-10,000 miles (I have a VW tdi and the interval is 10k). Yet spending $60 to change the oil in a compressor every 12-15k is pointless?

 

sfxtech, that is an apples and cauliflower comparison. Way beyond apples and oranges!

You are being led down the garden path by the place you went to. They are NOT going to recover, flush, and recharge your A/C system for $60!!!

To do what you said, this is what they would have to do:

1. Recover the HFC-134a from the system. And you will pay for its disposal.
2. To "Flush" the system, it must be disconnected at many points.
3. The orifice, or TXV must be removed. Can't flush through them.
4. Any parallel-flow device, like many/most condensors, can not be reliably flushed, as the solvent just takes the easiest path and leaves the other paths alone, particularly if there is any buildup in said other parallel paths, which is exactly the opposite of what is wanted for a good flush. So the parallel-flow device would need to be replaced. $$$$$
5. All of the connections that are opened up would need to be cleaned up, and O-rings replaced.
6. The compressor would have to be physically removed from the vehicle. Then positioned appropriately, and the shaft turned by hand to purge the compressor of old oil. Then new oil added, purged again, then final oil amount added. You will be paying for the oil. It's not motor oil.
7. After everything that can be flushed with a solvent is done, it will have to be evaporated out real well by compressed air. You will pay for the disposal of the solvent used.
8. System is all put back together, all connections, any parts removed, including remounting the compressor, and putting the serpentine belt back on.
9. Vacuum pump and gauge set is connected, and the pump is started. This needs to run with a deep vacuum, for a long time, to do a good job. Any volatile contaminants and moisture must be boiled off. In the meantime, that space for the vehicle and that equipment cannot be used for another vehicle.
10. System is isolated from the vac pump, pump shut off, and a leak-watch starts. To see if the system vacuum holds. The longer the wait, the better. If the pressure goes up (less vacuum), then it needs to be determined why.
11. If good, then new 134a is weighed in and engine started and A/C turned on in the early part of this step. You will pay list++ dollars per ounce for every ounce of 134a used.
12. Performance check. Measure pressures and temps to see if it is operating properly.
13. Check for leaks, now that it is under pressure.

And the per-hour labor rate is... what?

Special note to projectSHO89 - I gave up years ago commenting on A/C on forums. Just wasn't worth it. I tip my hat to you for doing so across many forums here! You must like walking on broken glass, or something to keep it up

and I violated my own rule by commenting on this one. And I didn't even mention the accumulator/dryer or receiver/dryer, whichever it has.

 

Short answer: Yes, it is pointless. It is also impossible, as Torky outlined, to do for $60. You're getting scammed.

Longer answer: The oil in the refrigerant system does not deplete or degrade during normal use such that it requires replacement. The factory charge of refrigerant oil (PAG 46 or equal) will last the life of the system (or until breached) or the life of the vehicle, whichever comes first. My 97's AC system has never been opened or otherwise recharged since I bought it in '03 at 110K miles.

If you can find a MANUFACTURER'S recommendation to perform such as service, then I'd be impressed. Otherwise, you're just letting them blow smoke up your ...er, leg. Perhaps you're a bit sensitive (gullible) that you just gotten bitten by an expensive repair.

Torky,

Thanks. I haven't given up yet....

 

Torky &projectSHO nailed. A/C being a sealed system will only need work if you have a leak or it the system is opened. Honestly find a new shop.

My wifes 04 has over 180k and had one issue- low freon from the factory. We had it checked, under warranty, the first summer we had it and it has been fine ever since. It doesn't blow that cold, but it hasn't changed since 2004.

 

I had a '86 Ranger for 11 years, never touched and a '97 Ranger for 11 years, never touched. I have a '90 Buick that belonged to my parents that has never been touched either!