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1980 - 1986 Bullnose F100, F150 & Larger F-Series Trucks Discuss the Early Eighties Bullnose Ford Truck

1985 F250 EFI starting problems.

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Old Jul 12, 2010 | 12:16 PM
  #16  
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You can replace the connector without harming anything. Your computer test port to read the codes and test the fuel pump is located under the hood. Here's a good site to help you find what it looks like and how to read the codes. Ford Fuel Injection
 
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Old Jul 12, 2010 | 07:34 PM
  #17  
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Awesome, thanks Dave! That is a great site...just finished reading through it all. Looks like the EEC is to the right of my steering wheel. I understand how a relay works now too...I should be able to read 12V at the fuel pump relay.

My project tonight is to finish replacing the spark plugs. I was surprised that even though they were brand new, they didn't have the correct gap set. I found out you can use a piece of tubing to guide the spark plugs back in and start them. If you cross thread, the tubing 'lets go' so you don't jack up the threads.
 
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Old Jul 14, 2010 | 03:26 PM
  #18  
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Just a quick update. The spark plugs are all in. I tested the relay and it is working properly. So there must be something wrong somewhere between there and the fuel pump.
 
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Old Aug 1, 2010 | 03:31 AM
  #19  
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Well...no spark from the ignition coil at all.

Plugs, plug wires, distributor, dist cap, rotor and coil have all been replaced.

The primary and secondary winding readings are within spec on the new coil and the coil wire harness gets almost full battery voltage when in the 'run' position.

I pulled codes and get a continuous memory 31 which according to the manual is "PFE, EVP or EVR circuit below minimum voltage."

There is a wire that goes from the negative terminal of the coil wiring harness that ends in a cylinder object near the ignition coil. Does anyone know what that is and what its for? I wasn't able to snap a picture of it but anyone with the 1980 thru 1996 Haynes manual can see it on pages 5-6 & 5-7. It's shown in all four pictures.

Could that be part of one of the above mentioned circuits?
 
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Old Aug 1, 2010 | 06:01 AM
  #20  
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I am having similar problems as you with my 5.0 EFI. On my truck, if I pull a spark plug wire, put an old spark plug in it, and hold it against the engine block, it'll fire right up and run on seven cylinders. I shut if off, put the wire back up and it will often run for 45 min or so and then back to the same problem.

I have replaced the
ECC
Coil
Distributor Cap and Rotor

and still have the same issues

Next I'm going to replace the distributor with the pickup coil in it.

That small cylinder is the condensor, I'm not sure of it's function. I think it eliminates noise through the radio from the ignition system.
 
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Old Aug 1, 2010 | 03:30 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by bookpile
That small cylinder is the condensor, I'm not sure of it's function. I think it eliminates noise through the radio from the ignition system.
Thanks bookpile.

The wiring diagram shows a 'Noise Filter' coming off the Ignition Coil. I guess condenser is another name for it.

Could that being bad cause the problem? Is it part of of one of the above mentioned circuits? I'm curious if a noise filter could cause a no start condition and why the heck it would?
 
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Old Aug 1, 2010 | 06:00 PM
  #22  
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You know what's odd...the ignition coil wiring harness connector shows 11.85 V on the negative side while on the positive side I get 4.25 V...(I assume the later is reference voltage).

I think it should be the opposite. I wonder if I reversed the wires when replacing the wiring harnesses for the ICM & IC. Back out for some more testing.
 
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Old Aug 1, 2010 | 11:32 PM
  #23  
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Great news ya'll! I have spark out of the coil now!! On my last post I let you know that I was getting 12V on the negative side of the coil.

I took off all my fancy wrapping to verify I connected the wires correctly...and I had. The issue was that when the connector was assembled, they did so backwards. The two wire positive was in the negative position and vice versa. I was so focused on making sure I re-connected the wires right that I didn't even think to check the brand new coil harness! So, I swapped the connector around and did my primary circuit tests again. Everything tested there OK so the manual said the Ignition Control Module has a stuck open transistor.

Just got back in from replacing it and I now get spark out of the coil!! I tried to start her up but she wouldn't go. I tried spraying starter fluid into the air intake and tried again. This time it only did one and a half turns before dieing...like when you have a low or bad battery.

My MM reads a full 12V when I test the battery though. Is it possible to have a battery read at 12 V but not have enough current to sustain starting since its been used for turning over a bunch of times while testing?
 
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Old Aug 1, 2010 | 11:48 PM
  #24  
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have your battery tested as you may have 12 volts, but low cold cranking amps
 
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Old Aug 2, 2010 | 12:46 AM
  #25  
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Thanks for the advice Joe.

It's a new battery so I'm thinking that it just ran low after all the testing I've been doing the last couple of weeks. I have it on the charger now.

Test again tomorrow and if it still does it, I'll take it in for a checkup. The starter is only a couple of months old too.
 
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Old Aug 2, 2010 | 03:54 PM
  #26  
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Update

Now that the battery is re-charged, it turns over properly. That's the good news.

The bad is that it still won't start. I sprayed starter fluid into the air intakes (the filter and hose assembly were taken off for troubleshooting purposes.) Turned her over and nothing.

I do hear the 'suck' sound so I think that means it has compression and is pulling air in. (the air intake discs stay closed though.) I verified spark from the coil and spark out of the plug wire.

So, I have spark...I have fuel in the form of starter fluid (I don't think the fuel pump is getting enough juice to run right now.), and I think I have air in the system.

Fire + Fuel + Air (O2) = ignition right?

When I stopped cranking the last time, I heard what sounded like a 'burp' from the engine and saw a puff of black smoke blow out both air INTAKE holes.

Smoke tells me something burned...but why the heck would whatever burned be blown back out the INTAKE?
 
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Old Aug 3, 2010 | 08:35 PM
  #27  
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Update

I asked my Dad to take a gander at this thread and he asked several questions...

1. Was I opening the air intake while spraying in the starter fluid?
Nope, I sure wasn't. However, I tried that this morning and more of the same...no start.

2. Was I sure I installed the new distributor right?
Hell no I'm not sure...first time I've ever done it! However, I was careful to set the timing mark at the 8° BTDC (per the label on my truck), and then made sure the rotor was pointed at plug wire one.

I called him up and he explained that I may have it at TDC of the exhaust instead of compression stroke. Huh?!? I thought every time you could see the mark, it was showing TDC of the compression stroke. Well, evidently, that mark shows TDC of both the compression and exhaust strokes! What can I say...I'm a computer guy new to working on this stuff.

So, for anyone else who may be reading this and not know...the mark shows TDC for the compression stroke then shows TDC for the exhaust stroke > compression > exhaust > compression > etc....you need to set the static timing so that its on the compression stroke.

I probably have the timing off by 180°. I'll be checking that next. Thanks Dad!

When setting static timing after replacing a distributor, how do all ya'll pros make sure you're on the compression stroke? Any hints or tips to make it easier?
 
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Old Aug 3, 2010 | 09:49 PM
  #28  
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I learned a good method here... remove the #1 plug, put your thumb over the hole, then crank
the engine with a remote starter switch (jump the solenoid) and you'll feel it.
 
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Old Aug 3, 2010 | 11:23 PM
  #29  
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Thanks ctubutis...

What should I be feeling? I used the remote starter and moved it back around and the rotor was in the same position. I thought that if it was wrong, it would be on the opposite side...

So after I feel what it is I should feel...is that the compression stroke and I can just do minor adjustments from there?
 
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Old Aug 4, 2010 | 07:50 AM
  #30  
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The compression stroke will want to push your thumb off the hole with air.
 
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