You seem to be dancing around the idea that more trucks came with auto hubs than manual hubs and this is why we see more failures of automatic hubs.

I'm gonna call BS on this because it sounds like you are making up facts to suit your argument. So point me to something from Ford that actually shows how many trucks were produced with auto hubs vs. manual hubs. Not your personal opinion, not the experience of you & your friends - but actual production numbers from Ford.

Can't find it? Then don't make the argument.

BTW both of my trucks - '89 F-150 and '90 Bronco - came with manual hubs from the factory.

I also would like to see these threads that you are referring to in the last sentence.

Of course it doesn't - you seem to have missed the point I was making.

The point is this: I see lots of posts in this forum complaining that auto hubs failed and very few posts where manual hubs have failed. And I have been reading this forum for a lot longer than you have.

You can argue production numbers all you want but until you actually PRODUCE said production numbers you're just blowing smoke.

 

My manual hub failed when I tried to put it into 4wd, it seized up and I couldn't turn it, and therefore I couldn't put it into 4wd. It was the same failure as an autohub.

Andy, (I'm not trying to be confrontational), while you may have read thousands of posts on failures, keep in mind this forum represents a minority of truck owners. Most of the comments you read on forums are people posting about problems or issues. No one comes online and registers to talk about all the parts of their truck that work well.

This is an honest question for you. How many posts have you seen with guys who have replaced auto hubs with new ones, and had failure with the replacements?

 

I'm not trying to be confrontational either... I think everyone is doing a good job of keeping things civil.

I agree that this forum represents a minority of truck owners, but it does represent a good sample. I believe that the problems that are posted in here are representative of the problems that ALL 87 to 96 F-series owners face. All the problems that people post about in here (rust, EGR problems, fuel delivery problems) are all representative of the problems that all the owners face. Including auto hub failures.

I honestly have only seen a VERY few people replace auto hubs with new auto hubs. The biggest reason is cost - no one makes a good aftermarket replacement and auto hubs from the dealership are $400. Each side.

And I agree that people only complain about the parts of their truck that work well. Rarely do you ever hear of a front 4x4 axle failure, or a sterling 10.25 failure. Or a ZF 5 speed failure. Or a manual hub failure.

I can really only remember one user that INSISTED on using auto hubs after they failed. He would take the auto hubs off once a year and soak them in ATF to clean them, then he would re-assemble them. To me that's too much hassle when I can just get out and turn a dial when I need to.

Confession time... when I bought my Bronco one of the front hubs was seized. Even with the dial on free it wouldn't let the axle spin. So I replaced both of them with a set of warns that cost me under $100 total. And I can honestly say I never have to worry about a hub failing. If I had auto hubs I would wonder if today was the day they are going to fail every time I used them.

 

Some of us consider the respectful exchange of ideas and opinions a good thing....

 

BTW I don't think that manual hubs are immune to failure. I simply think that they are far more reliable than the auto hubs. And every time this debate comes up in this forum, there are a whole pile of users that chime and say how unreliable auto hubs are... I wonder where they all are this time.

 

Sigh. How quickly I am reminded of why I generally do not engage in conversations like these. This endless banter is not going to get us anywhere, but I'll see if I can give a few diplomatic responses.

My comparison was actually between the number of vehicles shipped with auto hubs versus vehicles converted to aftermarket manual hubs. Ford still used manual hubs after creating the auto hub? That I was not aware of, so yes, the numbers would be different.

We were both presenting our arguments based from our personal observation, though now mine is invalid without hard numbers? Why does the same not apply for you? If you could show me the numbers of auto hub failures in relation to manual hub failures to substantiate your claim that auto hub failures are much more common, then we can continue this conversation. Otherwise, you are just blowing smoke. [/sarcasm]

read this thread yet?

My point was not to claim that auto hubs are the greatest thing ever. I can see why some people convert to manual hubs, but I think it is a disservice to just tell anyone that experiences problems with auto hubs to get rid of them. Sort of like telling someone with broken power windows to convert them to manual crank ones. Though that is an option, it is not the only one. By the way, when do power windows (or manual ones) fail? When you need them!

 

That's fair.

Look, if it's a cost thing, manuals win hands down. I can't debate that.

Heres my theory on surprise auto hub failures.

They get absolutely no preventive maintenance by most people, so they don't realize they have any issues until they fail. I'm guessing a person would notice when a manual hub would start turning hard, and then do some preventive maintenance and not have an issue. I'd be willing to bet most of the failures here had never looked twice at the auto's prior to the failure.

I refuse to believe auto hubs are a bad part or something that is destined to fail because it wouldn't be on a majority of 4wd vehicles today. I came back to Fords after dealing with a Dodge...I could tell you stories of bad parts...lol

 

good deal...

LOL! let er rip, taterchip!!!

 

I still want to change to auto hubs for my wife's sake

and I'd love someone to tell me the effects of leaving the hubs locked in 2wd. Anyone?

 

Interesting, I had not considered that. As much as I like the convenience of auto hubs, I certainly would not spend anywhere near that much to replace them. That makes more sense why people would only recommend a manual hub conversion, though I still don't think auto hubs are inherently bad.

I wonder why no one developed an auto with manual option like the newer super duty trucks. Not possible or no market? That would be the a slick part.

Dave

 

I know my personal experience is not that valuable, as I am only one in many many ford owners, but I will say that my last truck came from the factory with manual locking hubs. I wrecked the truck with 230k on the clock and the hubs still worked fine.

I had to replace my factory auto hubs at like 120k. both were 95 with dana44 axle.

 

My factory motor manuals came today, so I looked up maintenance on front bearings/hubs, and it's every 30k. So instead of hearing about countless auto hub failures, I'd be more interested in hearing how many were properly maintained prior to the failure. I never buy into the failure rates on forums, because you really don't know how the person complaining has cared for the vehicle.

I'll say this as well, if Sky's is typical, and auto's fail at 100k+ and that's when they have to be replaced, so be it. If one can't afford the replacements and go with manuals, fine, but it's not that it's a bad part. It's more along the lines of shocks/ujoints, etc.

I have Warn aftermarkets, and when I know for sure I'm keeping the truck long term, I'll put auto's on because of the ease of use for the woman, but also because I think they are a far greater convenience to manuals.

 

I think this is something that there isn't really a right answer to. It's very much like asking "which is better, an auto or manual transmission?" It mostly boils down to preference and how you use your truck. I know there are a lot of people here that love manual trannys, even though clutches have to be changes long before a torque converter will have a problem.

 

i bought my 94 F150 supercab 3 years ago with 180K miles it had auto hubs. my 4x4 did work but the drivers side hub was always locked so the fronts were turning all the time. I replaced the auto's with warn manuals just because i got them for next to nothing from a junk yard. so i had the opposite problem, a the best way for a hub to fail is locked IMHO

 

Probably right about personal choices. Years ago I 'mudded', all I wanted was manuals. Got out of that, and used to newer vehicles and haven't had to lock in a hub in 10 years. I know they engage a bit differently, but in daily driving, never had an issue.