Hey I guess my memorey is not as bad as I thought it was.

 

I second that.

 

Glad you agree.


LMAO ROF


Old guys are like old hard drives.
The information is still there, the retrieval time is just slower.

 

Don't worry Dave, we got your back.

Half the time I can't figure out which way is up or down. Come to think about it, up is down where I am.....

 

I hate slow retrieval times. Seems that most of time the only things I can remember fast are the trivial things like who did a song and stuff. Takes a while longer to remember the gap setting on a set points for old 302 lol.

 

When all else fails use a match book, if you can find book matches today.

 

LMAO the day of the matchbook, bailing wire and duct tape is limited.
It's been awhile since I have thought about a match book the strike strip would get you out of a bind too. the free multitool.

 

Ok I have two suggestions we get Joe to send his spare hammer assortment to Dave so he can get the forge out and fit a 892 blower to the 6.9 along with the turbo. Now we have a custom intake.

Dyoung where can we get the info on those sleeves.
It is not that sleeves will not work it is that are not as tough as a non sleeved block.
But I hear they failed miserebly at the Dave S. Virginny test track, I have even seen a write up on it.

 

some more info on sleeves, there is a part number for some high strength sleeves for our motors i dont have it on hand but i can get it if someone wants it, now to keep them from walking down when you have the block machined you have to leave i forget the amount but leave so much at the bottom of the bore that you dont machine, then press the sleeve in and surface the deck to make it all flat then you may have to re sink the valves in the head depending on how much or any has to be taken from the deck surface to keep the clearences right between the pistons and valves, a motor sleeved like this will not drop sleeves down and wont crack the block like dave s sleeved motors did

 

The problem is my engine had the shoulder left at the bottom of the cylinders.
And when you put head gaskets on the fire ring rests right on top of the sleeves, not the block.

The sleeves are glued in with glorified Locktite.

So now you run the engine, the sleeves get hot, the Locktite gets soft, the fire ring presses the sleeve down, and the block cracks since the small shoulder at the bottom is the only thing holding them up.

Remember, 17 head bolts torqued to 100 foot pounds has a lot of clamping force.
All that pressure is pressing on a 1/8" thick sleeve.

Figure 4" bore, 4 sleeves and only 6.28 sq. in. is all that is supporting that pressure.

Nope, I have seen more than enough sleeve damage looking at 4 engines, one of which I tore down before it was ever fired.

The machine shop I used will not touch a 7.3 because of the thin cylinder walls and the sleeve issue, and 70% of what he does is race motors with the other 30% being diesels.

You can see the sleeves in the picture, you can tell they are both dropped down and you can see what I saw three times in 28,000 miles with a 6600 dollar complete drop in 7.3 turbo.

I know the sleeves were flush with the block deck when they were installed, you could see the tool marks lined up on the sleeve edge and block deck where they surfaced the deck after the sleeves were installed.



7.3 is a fine engine, right up till it needs rebuilt.
Then it is time to find a 6.9 to rebuild.

Cylinder taper in a high mileage block is going to be outside the specs, you have to do something so new rings will seat, there is nothing left but sleeves or bore a block that is already to thin in the cylinder walls.

Remember you are going to be gambling with about 4000 dollars if you rebuild one and it goes south.
First engine failed at 2700 miles.
Second one failed at 9700 miles.
The third one almost made 17,000 miles before it died.
All that in about 16 months.
No truck for almost 8 weeks out of 16 months.

You can't pay me to install a sleeved engine in my truck again after that.

The only thing that saved me was the warranty and the fact I talked them into a buyout after the third one failed and the sleeves were dropped in the fourth engine while it was still bolted to the shipping pallet.

Maybe I work them to hard.
But if the engine is not capable of work, what good is it?

 

i know that you have had bad luck with sleeved engines, and im not sure why yours was so bad but there is a couple people that i know of that are running sleeved problems with no problem, but that dont mean it couldnt happen

 

There are enough people that have had bad luck with them that I wont be using them until all the 6.9 blocks are gone.
Mine see's no hard service anymore so I think one would work for me, but You never know that may change and I would rather have one that I know will stay together.
Why is it if you have both that you choose the 7.3 for what you want larger head bolts or what.

 

Sleeved engines do work if they are done right and many have them from factory. The only thing I can think of is the bore was too loose. That diesel ranger I mention so often has a mitsubishi diesel (based on the astron engine) and it is a factory sleeved iron block. Rebuild kits come with new sleeves depending on how involved you want to get. They are installed with a hydraulic press, then borred and honed to spec. Those sleeves are much thinner though, and the fire ring was almost completely supported by the block, not the top end of the sleeve.

Something I heard is that some will bore the cylinder right out of the block in the case of a badly cavitated engine, and then install the sleeve so that it is only supported on the top and bottom of the bore. When the sleeve is interference fit on its entire outer surface area, it is far less likely to fail than one thats glued in at the top and bottom.

Having said all that, its probably cheaper to start off with a 6.9 block anyway even if sleeving was idiot proof.

And furthermore, since we know that cylinder wall flexibility plays a big role in how prone an engine is to cavitating, I would prefer to sleeve a 7.3 down to a 6.9 bore diameter (assuming the method was reliable).

But again, its still easier to start out with a 6.9, bore the minimum and run it. I've been amaized to see how long a 6.9 can go even if its neglected. Take good care of it, and one rebuild should be all you ever need. Although I do regret not balancing mine.

 

There is a world of difference to a sleeved block that was designed to be sleeved and boring abd dry sleeving an engine. Even the cat nonsleeved engines earned the nickname throw away engine.

 

I second that.

The Cat, Cummins and other large diesels have a very good sleeve system.

The block has a shoulder the a lip on the top of the sleeve rests on to support the sleeve.

O rings seal the cooling system from the crankcase.

When you install the sleeve, you measure the height above the deck and add or subtract shims between the lip and shoulder to adjust it to spec.

The IDI sleeves are coated with glue then pressed in.
Next they surface the block deck to cut the extra sleeve flush with the deck.

Using that process, there is no way the top can support anything.

I gambled and lost four hands in a row.
That was more than enough for me.

It's about like picking up a piece of hot steel.
After you do it a couple times, you finally figure out if you pick up hot steel you will get burnt.

That 24 cubic inches may give you an extra 10 HP.

But is 10 HP worth 4000 dollars if it blows?

If it is, a new ATS kit for the 6.9 that can give you 80 HP would be a deal at 30,000 dollars.