Ok let me explain the situation as best I can.
We have an oil burner steam heat system that has a separate Amtrol Hot water maker tank that is not the same as a hot water heater like youd get in Lowes. I can post pics if you want.
A few days before Christmas we started getting banging in the pipes in the rear of the house. We called in our oil heat guy and he said that water had gotten into the pipes and had lowered the water in the boiler and the banging went away
A couple of days later on Christmas eve I hear this beeping noise and I go in the basement and the Amtrol hot water tank has a code flashing ER2 and its beeping. My wife also informed me we had no hot water so I called back our oil repair guy and he sends this clueless guy in who plays with buttons on it and gets the code to stop flashing and the thing to stop beeping but it doesn’t really do the trick and he says don’t worry about it meanwhile the hot water came back on its own
The Monday after Christmas we get the third guy in from the oil heat place and he fools with it. Meanwhile I got hold of Amtrol on the phone and the man there tells me that ER2 Means the water in the Amtrol unit is over 155 degrees. He states that either there is a defective thermostat on the Amtrol, there is a check valve that is bad or there is a problem with the water circulating through the coil
He replaces the electronic thermostat and control valve on the unit and still the problem exists
Third guy comes back with the boss on 12/30 the Amtrol has been beeping for days now and he states that the problem is that the cold water feed is hooked into the domestic coil of the boiler. This water is over 200 degrees and that once this goes into the Amtrol tank that the water is unable to cool hence the problem with the error code . He is right in the fact that the water entering the tank seems to be incredibly hot as you cannot touch the pipe feeding the Amtrol. He wants to cap off the water feed to the Amtrol from the domestic coil in the boiler and run it to a cold feed so that the water going into the Amtrol tank is regular cold water as it enters the house from the water main.
I don’t think this is a good idea because the thing worked for over 25 years as it was and the plumbing has not changed. Something is definitely wrong in the boiler or the piping.
This guy also checked some kind of a flow valve check valve that is on one side of the loop from the boiler that runs through the loop that allegedly heats the water in the Amtrol and that check valve is allegedly OK
So I call in this guy who my buddy knows. He comes in last night and he shuts the whole system off and he drains all the water out of the boiler and the water tank to see what happens and nothing happens to alleviate the problem. He Also looks at the Aquastat on the boiler which is set to 150 degrees and backs it down to 120 degrees meaning that the water coming out of the boiler and its coil is supposed to be 120 degrees. He also ( does not have his electrical tester with him) states that he cannot hear the circulating pump for the water that heats up the water in the Amtrol running and cannot confirm that the pump is actually working.
His idea is he wants to clip the lines for the feed to the Amtrol, and out of the Amtrol to the house hot water faucets as well as another hot water line either going to or from the Amtrol and installing temperature guages it it. He wants to add some kind of expansion tank to the system and change the Aquastat and the circulating pump on the boiler to the tune of $750.Im thinking this guy is doing over kill and replacing everything.
Does anyone else here have any ideas as to what we should check or if this all sounds logical or plausible?
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Did the service tech pull and check the fuses on the Smart Controller?

.

 

Couple of ideas as I'm not there to hear it or chk with my testers. Aquastat could be bad. Several issues arise here...overheating, not pulling in the Circulator.....
Circulator bad. Amtrol is only fed by expansion as the boiler water is heated(causing the hammering as hot water hits cooler water) and becomes.. for lack of a better term..bound up. I assume you have a Taco 007 cartridge type circ. otherwise the tech would know right away if it were engaging. You can see the motor shaft turning on the big circs.

My last check would be the circ relay..often wired from Amtrol control to the Aquastat(so the boiler fires) and circ. so it engages.

 

Steam boilers get an powder additive for the hammering is called Squick or Quick Silver....

Have never seen a Steam boiler with an indirect hot water heater, however the heat sink for the aqua stat after 25 years could be coated with mineral deposits which in turn don't allow the aqua stat to work to the temp that it is set for , you could pull and clean the heat sinks......

btw steam boilers in a house is uncommon , is it possible you old technology the steam boiler mix with new technology the hot water heater,,,,, just never seen or heard of a system like yours...

 

Jaaaak....you apparently don't live in the northeast. We have thousands of just the heating systems you claim you've never seen.
As a licensed Plumber-Heating Tech in the northeast, servicing these conversions....the steam section for house heating is well separated from the water heating aspect and steam is not uncommon in a retro. We keep the old and Upgrade it..steam is part of that.

I've no clue where you practice....but you're wrong that steam is uncommon

 

Lenny1carl if you go to photobucket and look on BobNYState that is my page on there I have pictures of my system there for this.
The second guy i brought in here wastalking about that circulating pump on there which is the red pump on the pipe to the Amtrol Im not sure how the thing flows and the first guy ( from my oil company)took apart the other side of that pipe and stated that was the check valve opposite the red pump and it was ok.. they said all that junk on the floor was the crap that leaked outta the pipe there. Are those the pumps and flow valves im looking at or are there others on the boiler itself or somewhere else in the system
It is a peerless boiler model JOT -4H-S or 5
Serial JOT BB 207
the Amtrol is a WA -7L 7P

 

Also the second plumber who wants to replace everything states that the hot water to the tank has to come from the boiler so that the burner works less in the summer when we dont use heat?

 

Lenny I am 35 miles south of Albany and 1986 to the present I have worked for home heat oil companies as service and a driver steam iun residential IS RARE down here been there seen that............

Fill Ranger in on the Squick treatment I am sure your up on it and it is a annual,,,,,,,

Just trying to help,,,,,,, no BS here,,,,,,,,,,..........

 

I'm north of you Jaaaaaak and have been working on these systems since the '70's.
I didn't work as a driver for "home heat oil companies" as you did.

I was turning wrenches, changing nozzles, aligning electrodes replacing draft controls, testing Cadcells and the relays.....

I took the NYS test and passed it in 1985, serviced and installed all types of heating/cooling systems, passed all the Honeywell-WhiteRodgers classes, Taco-WeilMcClain, AO-Smith, Miller, Trane....

I've been doing this for 30 yrs. I've worked on coal conversions in upstate NY making them Propane or NG, or oil compatible.

No offence Jaaaak but I've been in the field and been tested. I have a base of happy people that I've repaired for over a 30 yr period.
Not one was concerned about a delivery of fuel when they were out of heat. It was a mechanical issue.
I do mechanical/diagnostic/repair/installation...

you do fuel delivery.

 

Believe me i was a celler dweller too, aka Soot Sucker been there too tanks , boilers in stalls service calls you name it been there

 

Actually steam systems are still pretty common in these parts, I have seen a few back in my tin wackin days. I recently ripped out my own Slant Fin Gas boiler Galaxy GX225PZ (Steam only) system which was installed in 96', and retrofitted a forced air system ,the boiler is still sitting beside the new furnace.

 

Geezeeeee, was just trying to help out and I get hammered for , thanks fellas........

Here is a link for Squick check it out maybe it will help maybe not just and idea for Ranger it may help take the hammering out of the pipes and maybe not..... the few steam boilers we did always got the squick treatment during the annual cleaning and it kept our customers happy

SQUICK Steam Boiler Cleaner/Inhibitor

And for what its worth a fuel oil driver is pretty much a seasonal job during the off season April- Oct we install boilers, furnaces , oil tanks, do annual cleans , service calls and attend training courses ......

Good luck

 

RangerBob , Found your post with pics over on the Chevy board , ya might want to link the pic over here too....... Ironic were almost neighbors I am in the Catskills too east side plenty cold and not much steam heat.......

 

Third guy comes back with the boss on 12/30 the Amtrol has been beeping for days now and he states that the problem is that the cold water feed is hooked into the domestic coil of the boiler. This water is over 200 degrees and that once this goes into the Amtrol tank that the water is unable to cool hence the problem with the error code . He is right in the fact that the water entering the tank seems to be incredibly hot as you cannot touch the pipe feeding the Amtrol. He wants to cap off the water feed to the Amtrol from the domestic coil in the boiler and run it to a cold feed so that the water going into the Amtrol tank is regular cold water as it enters the house from the water main.
I don’t think this is a good idea because the thing worked for over 25 years as it was and the plumbing has not changed. Something is definitely wrong in the boiler or the piping.



RangerBob,



I agree with your serviceman, the Amtrol should be piped with domestic cold water NOT water that first passes through the domestic coil ,,,,,,,,,,,,, figure this most lokely you want or have your Amtrol set in the 100-125 degree range however its winter right now and last week was mega cold so your boiler is running hard to heat the house and the domestic water passes thru the coil and gets heated to quoteing you 200 degrees then it enters the Amtrol setting off the high temp (Amtrol alarm 155 degrees) alarm,,,,,,, What is the temp set on the Amtrol control?

If that were my unit bypass the coil on the boiler go straight to the amtrol and let the Amtrol and the boiler do the job...

BTW you got old technology and new technology like I said in my first post and to thro in to the mix its piped wrong, do as your sevice man suggest and I think you will b happier......

Also the hammering problry has nothing to do with the Amtrol, ask your service man about Squick treatment.....

 

Sorry you feel that way Jaaaackman, was never any intention of mine to " hammer" you, was making a simple point that Steam boilers are in fact very common.....