Quote F-250 WARHORSE : I got a guarantee with a 460 that was guaranteed to be 500 hp.

If it's guaranteed to be 500 hp and it ain't - make the builder prove his worth.

It takes an engine builder that has BBF specific knowledge AND experience to build a reliable 500+hp engine. It sounds as if a bit more research into engine builders would have paid off. Zero decking the block (shaving the top off the block so the pistons are flush at TDC), a port job done by a competent and experienced porter (with a flow bench to prove his expectations), the correct pistons (forged or hyper, the right shape and volume dome or dish matched with the combustion chamber to give the best CR for your build, along with a mating surface to maximize the effect of the quench pads on the heads), valve train geometry, cam, intake, timing curves and carburetion all have a major part to play in getting there. Matching the hundreds of variables to each other is the key to any GOOD builder. You have a good foundation in your build. Some thing or things just aint gelling - that's all. Knowledge and experience are the key. Rob has an abundance of both... Listen and learn. I did and i have a stump pulling 460 that scares the smiles out of me every time i drive it with a dyno proven 442hp and 536ft lb at the crank. The tires are the expensive bit...

No-one is against you here - Rob especially. He wouldn't be doing this (moderating) if he didn't like what he does. Good luck finding the problem... please let us know what you find...

 

Nah, Rob is an ***. There is no reason to be that snarky and rude to people trying to find anwers. If we were all experts on 460 Fords, (and why should we be?), why would anyone need to come here and ask? If you don't like the job, quit.

OP, the biggest mistake you made was taking that 460 to a machinist that doesn't have a lot of experience with 460's. It sounds like HE didn't do a lot of things right. You payed him for his expertise and he didn't have it.
With that paper you have stating that it will be a 500 hp motor, it sounds like you have a winnable case in small claims.

 

Cam is fine New flat tops Headers Kick the timing UP when you degree the cam it is off a tooth. My 2c

 

Sweet. I read a engine building manual last night and found some answers an degreeing in a cam, and that makes a lot more sense on finding the problem now. I would sure like to see the machinist help me fix it, but I don't see it coming into play here. I will take the truck up to him this week and see if he has anything to say, but it costs quite a bit of money to go to small claims here in CO. I just opened up a case from someone that didn't pay me for some custom machine hire on their farm and that is costing about $200-$300 dollars, so far. I get that back if I win, but if I lose, that money would go quite a ways towards a new set of pistons and a cam. I might get a guilt trip on the guy, but I think anyone who takes your money, then takes 5 years to build your engine isn't a reputable machinist, I know that now. I saw a good number of small block chevys and a few big block chevys that this guy built and they ran awesome, but they are very simple to build I guess. I also know, from being a farmer, that he does all of the machine work on all of the diesel engines for all of the 3 local farm equip dealers. I thought he was reputable, but my brother built his 390 from this website and had the neighbor bore the block, then spent like $400 on new parts and that engine is perfect, it is exactly what he wanted except for the bad fuel mileage, which he is trying to improve. I know noone is against me here, and I was also a little angry the last few weeks over a $6000 engine that was a waste of 5 years and a lot of money, but it is only money and I am kind of glad in isn't 5 0r 600 horsepower because at 23 years old, I would keep my tire supplier real happy and my wallet real empty. I have a wholesale account for tires but they still aren't cheap. As far as the cam, do you guys think the chain is off a tooth or the sprocket isn't bolted in the right set of holes?

 

Wrong cam timing could be an issue. I know I've been ******* you on these multiple threads, but it sounds like you're ready to follow some diagnostic leads, and that might be a good place to start.

 

I think so. That would make a big difference if it is off, but what kindof power could I expect out of this set up? If I get good headers, make sure the cam is degreed in, and don't tear the engine down, leave the pistons and balanced crank, and the cam and all in it. Will it make decent power? I jetted on the carb some tonight and it got some more rpm but no more power or acceleration. I will keep tinkering for now. The heads have to come off to degree in tha cam, correct? Also, are PN 924-16 valve springs good for the cam/rocker/pushrod setup? I think I am getting some valve float at about 5000-5500rpm. rockers are 1330-16 comp part. I'm sorry if i offended anyone previously, I came here for help and I'm glad to get it. I hope I can get off to the right start now, hope everyone had a happy thanksgiving.

 

Beats me on the power. The link I posted showed some combo's good for a certain amount of power, and there were some differences between those and what you posted.

IMO, item one here is to see if what you were TOLD is in the engine is, in fact, in the engine. Did you see the parts prior to installation? A roundish stock cam and some 7.something : 1 pistons will make a pooch out if an engine.

Thus the advice in prior postings everywhere to do a teardown and review the components and their installation. (such as cam timing)

 

Just keep telling your self that


Do they let you open carry in Colorado Holy **** $6000
If you shot him they would let you get off for insanity.

Have someone else degree the cam 5 years is a little long to wait I might think. 6K for that is a total nice thing for you to do for a guy who clearly needed the money for other things than your build. Sue the **** out of him

 

better Monster

 

I really wish people would quit linking to or posting that list. Yes there are some good engine builders on that site but that list is BOGUS.

Show me ANYONE that has an actual dyno engine producing 1.15hp per cid using a mild flat tappet cam and an edelbrock performer rpm intake. Then using 1-7/8" headers on a 500hp+ build.

it's just a read out of a catalog what parts add for hp and puting on the list. example difference between 300-325 and 325-350 engine build is headers, difference to next engine build (350-375) is intake. sorry switching from to the rpm intake and a set of headers is NOT going to gain you 75hp it doesn't work that way. oh and the next difference difference to 375-400 is 1 step up in cam.

Hey if you add BF Evans racing sticker your engien will magically gain 100hp.

That list has caused more people to be disappointed in their engines then about anything else I can point to. My guess is warhorses machinest took his build right off that list thus the claim of it making 500hp.

 

I like the broncoholic, he thinks just like i do. I saw in the 460 ford site that those pistons are a 10.5:1 with 76cc heads. Mine are ~92cc I guess. Is this close to right? I thought that the 500 hp build looked a little weak in my eyes, but I guess I am not smart enough to pass that judgement. I could kill the engine builder but I would still have an engine that needs work and I don't think I would get my money back. I will see how my current court case goes and then if it goes well, i might sue the ***** out of him. I think I will drive the truck up to him this week and see what he says. I will let you guys know. I didn't see the parts he put in the build, and if I did, I wouldn't know anyway.

 

500 horse out of a stock stroke iron headed 460 is a very tall order to begin with. I'd have laughed at him on that one.

 

Ya think????

 

take the truck and have it dyno tuned with a wide band O2 readout... at the speed shop i work at ive seen a bunch of motors in various brands of vehicles that were built right but not tuned in properly....had one guy with a 383 chebby come in thinking his motor needed rebuilt after 20 hours of running time, he thought it needed rebuilt cause it was a $5000 shiney turd...we put it on the dyno and found it was running way too lean....after going over everything we found that the brand new 750 Holley street avenger was over tightened and had a crack in the baseplate....i put a dirty old holley out of the closet on it to check, and BAM that little mouse put down 495HP at the wheels...talked to the customer, sold him a 750 Demon, installed it, and it made 525HP at the rear wheels after an hour of tuning.... but from the sounds of it the machine shop built u a 350HP motor, and now it needs tuned on a dyno....

 

I am kindof thinking that I do have a 350 hp engine, I guess I am tied up this week, so i don't have time to monkey with this much but as soon as I do, the builder and me are going to sit down and have a discussion. I will post the results. Five years for one engine is rediculous, especially when it isn't even what i ordered and paid for. What is the advantage to aftermarket heads? Mine have matched ports and big valves, other than being cheaper in the end than what I paid for my heads out the door, what is the main advantage?