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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 11:39 AM
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Dyna-Cam Engines

Well I had to write a paper about Dyna-Cam engines for my Ag. Mechanics class and I thought I would share with the forum....yall are tech junkies and will probably appreciate it.

Dyna-Cam motors have an axial mounted plate which acts as the cam. The cam is sinusoidal in shape (so it has ridges and valleys). The pistons (usually 1 facing each direction) ride on the axial cam.
The motors are very small and super lightweight when compared to "normal" motors and due to their variable compression ratio they can run any types of fuel from palm oil to JP5.
Since you have 2, 3, 6, etc pistons the engine creates the power of a 4, 6, 8, 12 etc cylinder motor w/the fraction of the motor size. Below are a few pics....

Here is an example of a 4cyl swash plate motor (w/out the sinusoidal cam but it operates on the same principles)
Usually there would be 4 more pistons pointing to the left as well which would produce the power of an 8 cylinder motor.



A few pics where you can see the sinusoidal cam and some of the pistons:

Russian aircraft motor (cutaway)


Cutway where you can see the 2X sided pistons as well as the axial cam:



 
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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 11:40 AM
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The motor was 1st developed back in the early 1900s as an aircraft motor so its almost 100 yrs old.

Here are few more benefits compared to modern motors.
-Is lighter and smaller than conventional engines
-Incorporates approximately 80% fewer parts (300 parts)
-Has a high power-to-weight ratio
-Is less costly to produce
-Is considerably cleaner with fewer emissions
-Is capable of using multiple fuel types, including diesel, JP5 and JP8 fuels, kerosene, bio-diesels, ethanol, and other blends of these fuels, with a special conversion kit available for the combustion of natural gas or propane

A link to the major company who is developing these motors: AVEC | Axial Vector Energy Corporation |



also here a few examples that are on use today
toyota compressors (for use on vehicles around the world)
Mk48 Torpedo
http://www.youtube.com/v/eRCUqcwqu5w
 
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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 12:08 PM
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wow thats really cool. i wonder what the downside is??? longevity? seem like an efficient design to me
 
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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 12:19 PM
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It's one of the original rotary engine designs.
They put it in a few cars a long time ago, but nobody knows how to work on them, so they scrapped the idea and stuck with the tried and true.

The other problem with a motor that works like that is the fact the pistons roll horizontal.
That creates excess wear on the cylinders.
That's why inline motors are generally very long lasting. Less side wear. the V design is to help reduce the horizontal type of wear.

Rotary engines are great things. And I wish they were used more, but nobody knows jack about them, so they don't use them.
It has some good pluses, but with the design, I don't think the durability is there with a standard style engine.

That's my take on those engines.
We need to take technology like this and use it though.
it is good to have options.
 
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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 12:35 PM
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i understand what your saying on that one talyn. but here is the question i pose. what are the chances of using an engine like this one in a vertical application instead of horizontal? the cam, block and pistons would have to go through some redesign but i think it could work. basically what i'm sayin for the cam and and pistons is make them flow through and add a hpop for lubrication of the engine on the top end(it would have a higher tendency for that end to drain oil off fast. and on the bottom end add a flow channel for the excess oil to drain off back to a resivoir instead of building up on the bottom half of the motor. maybe even a lpop to pull that oil off cause the it's gonna be fed in there by an hpop. the flow through would work like the flow through coolant drill bits.what do ya'll think?
 
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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by thumper869
i understand what your saying on that one talyn. but here is the question i pose. what are the chances of using an engine like this one in a vertical application instead of horizontal? the cam, block and pistons would have to go through some redesign but i think it could work. basically what i'm sayin for the cam and and pistons is make them flow through and add a hpop for lubrication of the engine on the top end(it would have a higher tendency for that end to drain oil off fast. and on the bottom end add a flow channel for the excess oil to drain off back to a resivoir instead of building up on the bottom half of the motor. maybe even a lpop to pull that oil off cause the it's gonna be fed in there by an hpop. the flow through would work like the flow through coolant drill bits.what do ya'll think?
cylinders facing down hydro lock when they set, this was the down fall of the radial engine, before starting it you would have to walk it through a couple revolutions by hand.
 
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Old Oct 26, 2009 | 02:11 PM
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mazda rx7's had rotary engines
 
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Old Oct 27, 2009 | 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by don77
mazda rx7's had rotary engines
I had one and loved it. The problem, as stated above, when I blew it up I didn't know how to fix it.
 
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Old Oct 27, 2009 | 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by helifixer
cylinders facing down hydro lock when they set, this was the down fall of the radial engine, before starting it you would have to walk it through a couple revolutions by hand.
what about a two speed pony motor in addition to it? low speed to roll it over a couple times and then high speed to spin er over. could give the large motor a massive compression ratio to get more performance out of it. and by using the pony motor to start it would eliminate the need for large clunky expensive starter. but thats another motor to maintain, very small and inexpensive though.

i bet you could put undersized pistons in there with full size rings to prevent that from happening. but there's a possibility of oil running down past the rings if any excess is left sitting on them. and the piston slap would take a toll on the cylinder walls over time and score em pretty bad. it would sound mean as all get out though like that

would using forged pistons in it make any difference? in my experience with forged pistons they shrink slightly after the motor shuts down and they cool. and on startup there's a little piston slap on start up til they warm up and expand back out. its a possibility i think
 
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Old Oct 27, 2009 | 10:38 PM
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I'm having a problem with some of the listed "problems" Boxer type engines have been used successfully for years, i.e. Volkswagen, Porsche, Aircraft, Subaru etc. I recently owned a Subaru with over 200K on the clock. The engine was pulled and opened up for an unrelated problem. I observed the "Cross Hatching" on the cylinder walls to still be present. So much for excessive wear caused by horizontal pistons. I too had a Mazda Rotary engine in the 70's, great engine until a larger vehicle literally "Ran over it". Beyond an engine repair problem.

I'm also having a hard time accepting that these engines were halted because nobody knows how to repair them. If the engine is efficient and cost effective to produce.....mechanics will be trained, applications will be found and dealerships will be established.

There must be other factors that halted the use and production of these engines.
JMHO

Rog
 
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Old Oct 27, 2009 | 11:23 PM
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Interesting stuff!
 
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Old Oct 28, 2009 | 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by kawa
I'm having a problem with some of the listed "problems" Boxer type engines have been used successfully for years, i.e. Volkswagen, Porsche, Aircraft, Subaru etc. I recently owned a Subaru with over 200K on the clock. The engine was pulled and opened up for an unrelated problem. I observed the "Cross Hatching" on the cylinder walls to still be present. So much for excessive wear caused by horizontal pistons. I too had a Mazda Rotary engine in the 70's, great engine until a larger vehicle literally "Ran over it". Beyond an engine repair problem.

I'm also having a hard time accepting that these engines were halted because nobody knows how to repair them. If the engine is efficient and cost effective to produce.....mechanics will be trained, applications will be found and dealerships will be established.

There must be other factors that halted the use and production of these engines.
JMHO

Rog
My best answer for any of this is.
If its is that GREAT of a motor, then it would be in production today.
Just like since Inline motors are so great, everything would have them as well.
But they don't.

And why would everyone get trained on a rare motor back then? Of course they woudln't. 99% of everything was like our current standard. Thats probably the main reason it was not continued. What we think and what happens is never what works.
Look at our government. Minorities get laws passed that screw the majority. Why? We don't have a clue.
Same thing with electric cars and stuff. They have successfully built good electric cars the testers were not willing to give up because they were so nice. What did GM do with the cars?
They didn't even research them, they took them right to the scrap yard and had them shredded. Why? I have no idea.
So why do we not have this style rotary engine?
Who knows. Just like everything else.
 
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Old Oct 28, 2009 | 09:26 AM
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That's easy to explain, the oil companies told GM to crush them.Who's in control, MONEY!
 
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Old Oct 28, 2009 | 10:38 AM
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There is everyones answer right there. Thank you glenn.
 
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