Well I blew up my free 360 this winter, and I'm throwing another one together out of parts I have around. It's just stock bottom end, I didn't even replace the bearings, just emery cloth'd em. No new rings either.

Comp cam .519"/232 duration (Lifters won't be in original bores, not sure how this will work out????)
matching valve springs
Early C2 2bbl intake
A set of D2TE heads a ported, got some killer numbers on the flowbench, only really taking material out of the roof, valve guide, and bowl

I also made an oil restricion for the rockers, used a 3/32....which should be .094"

Chamfered the main bearing oil holes so they line up better, cleaned up all the oil drain back spots in the lifter valley/heads

Melling HV oil pump

This is sort of more an experiment, I really want see what my port job did, and I won't really have any more than $75 invested in the motor, and probly won't run it for long before I have money to build something better. Just looking for anything you guys think might not work, or work well

O, and Milled .020" off the heads, and running a shim head gasket .020" compressed to help compression a little bit...lol

 

First off the intake ports are larger than the head's ports, which is backwards to what you want. I'm sure it will run but the 2 barrell is gonna strangle the motor before anything else and without enough carb the rest of it just doesn't mean much.

 

actually when I ported those heads, I based the intake runner off the early intake port. The only 4bbl intake I have kickin' around is a later truck one and the ports won't match my heads, as they are a much smaller later design.

The whole point of this build is to see what these heads do to the motor.

wish I had a 4bbl worth runnin, but I don't

 

Even though I know what you are doing, and why, I can't begin to describe how I feel about it, but it's not good. Putting in old rings, presumeably without deglazing.......Yikes.

However, it may work fine for your testing. I am too cheap to spend the money on all the gaskets to make such a trial (Are you re-using cyl head gaskets too?).

There's an old joke (riddle really):

Q/ How did copper wire get invented?

A/ Two lawyers fighting over a penny

Or you could substitute "Scotsmen" for lawyeres. Or you could substitute me........LOLOLOL

 

"I didn't even replace the bearings, just emery cloth'd em"

Why would you want to emery cloth a set of used bearings? (or any bearings for that matter) They're already worn, sounds like you may have not checked the actual clearance, and you're making the clearance bigger by sanding on them? I'm afraid you may end up severely hurting for oil pressure. If you don't have mics, Plastiguage is cheap and a whole lot better than nothing. Might want to check them out before buttoning it up.
Smaller ports in the intake are not a problem, the 428 Cobra Jet came that way, the bottom area of the ports on the early heads is pretty much a "dead" area, the smaller, higher port flows just as much air with better velocity- like a medium riser 427 head. The CJ intake is like a PI manifold, except with the shorter ports, and actually flows a little better than the PI. Most of the modern intakes, Streetmasters and such, have the high, short port- bigger hole downstream isn't a problem. Trying to use an early, long-port manifold like a C2 on a later, short-port head would be a problem. If you ground out the bottom of a later set of heads to match the early port, you did a lot of work for nothing- the ports are shorter for a reason

 

I cant believe I just read "Emery Cloth" for a bearing clean-up ? Thats one for the books ! and running a 2bbl instead of the proper 4..makes any port work even if it good work "Mute"....and if your running stock logs instead of headers...Ya cant get in what you cant get out..

 

alright, you guys are being completely rediculus. I can build a motor, I have before. I broke my arm, so am out of work, trying to keep myself occupied. never heard of running ememery cloth over new bearings?, so you get the first layer off, less to break in. I've done that on the motor in my car, and that motor frequently sees 7,000+ RPM, and has 80 PSI oil pressure, and it's been together for 2 years now. I'm not stupid.


As far as heads, I KNOW the earlier ports flow better than the smaller one....I've flowed them on a flow bench. the small ports are good for 212CFM @.600", the larger ones are good for 250CFM if I remember right.

got to take this for what it is. I know it's not considered acceptable. I have no cash flow right now, and am literally just throwing this together with what I have laying around. I would love to buy a 4bbl intake, get the crank turned, new bearings, new rings, possib;y even needs to be bored .030.....but it's either build it like it is, or just sit around doing nothing.

BTW, yes it has headers, I figured that was always a given w/ these motors.

forget I asked.....

 

"Just looking for anything you guys think might not work, or work well"
You got honest opinions from 4 people with some experience, which is what you asked for. Just consider that we are here in the first place because we love FE engines, they're getting a little scarce, and we hate to see a good block that could become a 390, 410, 445, whatever, get grenaded when it's not necessary.

 

my car had new bearings that I scuffed, this motor has whatever bearings were in it before. It's not like they were down to copper. I would love to plastigage, but even if it's not what I'd like to see, theres no way I can afford to tighten up any clearances.

I wasn't looking for opinions on whether or not stuff would wear, I already knew that would be an issue. and the block and heads are the only thing I really want to keep, once I'm working again I wanna build a 410. I just need to get a motor in this chassis, and try it out. kinda like a mock up. I don't plan on leaving the motor in any longer than this winter.

I was looking for opinions on the relation of heads/intake/cam.

 

Well just on a short note.... the heads will only flow what your intake will let them flow...on the intake..and the same with the exhaust..what ever the headers and mufflers will flow..that what the exhaust will flow...

I guess maybe I just think of engines in another way ? My Bad !! I damn sure wouldnt build something just for a couple months just to take it out and do it right ? But thats just me... Not working either right now.. Having an operation monday...But if I all I had was a broken arm...not saying thats good .....But I'd be collecting beer cans to get some scratch up for bearing and a used 4bbl intake ..but thats just me ...

No pun intended...Happy Building !

 

I wouldn't worry about the bearings for your "budget" engine. Many of us have large bearing clearances purposely for high performance engines. Plus, a lot of engines have bearings much worse than what yours sound like, but were torn down due to rings, etc.

Mixed up the lifters? Might be all right, might not. That ones a chance. I have used new lifters with a used cam, and it was fine.

Rings? I don't know about, but I suggest you remove them and clean the grooves well, and any crud/carbon on the oil seperator ring.

But I see you only want the engine to last over winter and also so you can check some porting. I suspect it will last much longer, but you will burn a fair amount of oil. MAybe deglazing it yourslef and new rings might not break your budget (another $25 for rings and you're still only at $100)

But why not do it? As long as you are having fun and not spending too much money.

Cheapest rebuild I ever did was a 289. Total cost me $500 and it included:

hot tanking block and heads and new cam bearings put in
all new bearings
gasket kit
rings
timing gears and chain
oil pump
1 new pushrod
few spray cans of engine paint

I remember dissasembling the lifters and sequentially putting them through about 5 types of different cleaners to get the varnish off just so I wouldn't have to buy new ones. I used a couple of egg cartons to keep them in order.

Did the valves by using lapping compound and spinning the valves with an electric hand drill. Used rubber tubing that slipped over the valve stem with the other end slipped over a piece of rod chucked in the drill. Kept the valves in order by storing them in a peice of 2x6 spruce with holes drilled in it and marked with a black magic marker.

I had measured the bores and found 0.003" taper, not great, but low enough I opted to de-glaze vs overbore.

I did this back around 1991 or 92. I later sold the car (66 Mustang) and the current owner still has my cheapie re-build going strong.

ps: try not to take offense....I realize what you're up against, but keep in mind, not that many of this forum of enthusiests would want the end result you are looking for. Good luck.

 

I did clean up the ring grooves, and run a hone down through some, and lapped the vlaves in. so hopefully it seals......okay.

My biggest concern is wiping out cam lobes. not sure if I just keep the R's up when I first fire it like I'm breaking in a new cam, or if it would even help me. maybe if the lifters are in spot thats worn close to what it needs it may all work, maybe...well i dunno.
I do like the egg carton thing. could probly use those to seperate other things too.

Well I should be firing the motor up within the next couple days. as long as it has oil pressure, I'll be happy

 

Well I've got my motor running.....runs good and smooth. has 35 PSI oil pressure at idle-ish, (haven't got the carb set up....won't idle yet).

got a leaky freeze plug, and what looks to be water coming from where the head gasket is......ever had problems w/ steel shims not sealing well? should I torque the heads down to more than 90lbs?

 

I always torque my head to 105 ft/lbs like is recommended for the CJs. But re-torquing will not, in most likelihood, stop the leak.

 

I'm glad it is running for you, but I don't think you can get good data from the head work you have done on this motor. What are you comparing from your old motor to this build with the re-worked heads?Do you have a horse-power base line, 1\8 or 1\4 or top speed data to compare to?What data will you use to know if you have improved your performance, I would like to know?