Hi All

1989 3.0L Shorty...

I get, what I thought was tire vibration in the steering wheel, and sometimes a "thump thump" sound - rotated the tires, and I still have it as bad...

how can I isolate this problem without putting new tires on the van? - the tread on them is still very good, but they have been on for a while - they are some off brand that I bought when I was broke, and figured I'd be ok with 4 brand new tires...

the front end is tight, but this slight problem has been driving me crazy - it seems to happen more on dry roads than snow/rain, etc - but if it was a Tire, wouldn't it seems better, if it was rotated?

I had them all re-balanced, but it didn't seem to help...

Ideas? - if this was a front end alignment problem, would it present like this with the sound? - I seem to hear it more on turns, like coming off the hwy, etc... The wheel does shake a bit sometimes at higher speeds (like at 70)

 

I would say it is not your tires.

I would ASAP look at your front suspension. It sounds like a ball joint, tie rod, or wheel bearing issue. Jack up the front end and pull on the tire at 3 and 10 position see how much movement there is, then the 12 and 6 position and look for movement.

I would also visually inspect the components for breaks, wear, ect.

 

Front end is tight - that's the thing - in fact, it just passed MA inspection, and they checked it too :-)

I forgot to mention that if you drive slow, sometimes you can feel the van move very slightly from side to side... as I say, very very slight...

I almost wish it was a wheel bearing in the front, since I can do those, and have many times - I would repack the bearings as part of a front brake job, and always had a nice set of rotors handy, since the Aeros like front brakes!

The front wheels both seem tight left to right, and at 12 and 6 oclock - first thing I thought of... and also, cuz I didn't want to fail the inspection - they even do the pry bar test - jack up the wheel, and then lift the wheel a touch with a pry bar, and see if there is play (looking for bad lower ball joints) - I checked sway bar linkage, etc...

I'll try some more tests, and see... wish I could rule out the tires somehow...

 

I did something like this before, but you have to be very careful. Install the suspect tire and wheel on the rear, leave it jacked up, and run it in gear through some speeds up to about 60 mph. Look for things like out-of-round or side-to-side motions. These usually indicate shifts in the tire core, and there's not much you can do about that.

Again, be very careful if you want to do this; chock the front tires, and do not get under the car when you take it to speed.

 

my moms car recently had a problem like this... not sure if it is your problem, but what happened to her's was the same thump thump feeling and the van rocking back and forth. turns out the rear tires both had broken belts, causing them to have bulges in the tread. couldn't really see it, but you could sure feel it. i'd check that imo

 

You say you got them rebalanced? Was it a standard balance, or was it a road force balance. A road force balance measures how far out of round the wheels and tires are, and then instructs the installer how to remount the tire so that the road force balances out. I have a tire that is outside spec on road force even after being remounted. It makes a noise, and a bit of vibration. All the other tires are perfectly smooth.

 

They just took them off, and respun them - Tire Warehouse - They used to really take care of you there, but lately, I just don't know - guess it's tough to find even the ex convicts they hire to work for Min wage - but the managers are usually ok.

yeah, if I had to guess, I'm thinking it's a belt in one of them myself - what's strange though, is when I rotate both sides, the problem seems like it's still there, and the same exact thing...

Whats a good tire to put on the aeros - I used to only use Mich's but, they are really expensive now, and I heard not as good as they used to be either. I need something good in snow too, and as you know, the 2wd aeros are not great in snow, so any help there is a bonus.

 

I was going to suggest a road force balance too. If you go here you can find one near you

 

Thanks VanGO - that is helpful, and ironic that the place where I bought the tires is listed as having the machine - maybe it's new for them?

I'll have to check them out, and see if they can do this for each tire, and print me out a reference sheet for each then... this would rule out the tires, but I really hope it is what this is... Haven't had a front end alignment done on her in a while though either, but I don't drive it much either...

 

I would agree, your tires are likely the problem, the belts can shift & this creates out of round problems & also side to side runout. Jack up the wheel & spin it freely, watch the tire tread with something fixed to monitor roundness & wobble. A good tire will do neither appreciably. Anything which is more than about 1/16" will have an effect. I had this (steering wheel rattle) problem & it turned out to be a bulged REAR tire! The van has been smooth ever since I had the tires changed. The trick is you need to get the tire problem diagnosed by a pro tire/ underbody specialist, I went to Firestone, they have not let me down yet. They also sorted my front tire wear problem which no-one alse was able to sort out,

Good luck, Aeroman.

 

A road force balance, also known as tire pull balance, measures the tire for out or round, the rim for out of round, and also the side to side movement or pull. If it is not perfect, the system will tell the mechanic how to remount the tire to try to cancel the forces out. No tire is ever perfectly round, and no rim is perfectly round. So if the tire is not mounted properly, and the tire is either wearing strange or was unusually out of round to begin with, you will get more vibration. If you mount the high spots on the tire into the low spots on the rim, you will minimize or even completely cancel out the vibration, and the weights do the rest.

 

I prefer Goodyear tires. I am running Goodyear Regatta 2's on my Aero for the last year and a half and it runs through snow and ice like it is nothing. I am not sure how well they would work in snow on a RWD rig. You might want to look at the wrangler series with mud/snow in mind. It will be a harsher ride but you will have the traction you need.

As for tires to stay away from. Do not touch Kelly tires with a ten foot cattle prod. When I bought my Aero it had two new Kelly tires and two slighty used Kelly Tires on it (about 90% tread.) After a year the used ones were weather checked and cracking to heck (with about 75% tread left). I replaced them with Kelly tires again. Then after another year the other ones were weather checked and cracking too (again at about 75% tread left.) The new ones I had bought were also showing signs of wear. I was not hauling anything heavy and only put about 8k mi on them. They are semi-cheap POS tires in my opinion. Not worth what little money they are asking for them if they are only gonna last a couple years.

Cooper is another brand I would stay away from. I had a set of them on my Ford Contour. Light car and I thought that 60k mi tires would, well, last 60k mi. I was wrong. The first rotation the fronts were already down to 50% and the back was down to 70%. By 12K miles they were down 40%. When 18K mi came around they were pretty much toast. My alignment, suspension, ect were in great shape, just shoddy tires. I would never use them again.

 

I'll have to see what they are on there now - I honestly don't even know - I think it was Tire Warehouses brand, and as I recall, they were made by Cooper for them... They sell a lot of these, because I think they are 1/2 the price of "real" tires... I think I paid like $200 for the 4, brand new 5 years ago, but they only have like 10K on them ( I work at home, so I don't drive her every day...)

When I have some time, I need to bring it down to TW, and see if they can do that Road Balance, since they claim to have the machine, etc - but it's a hassle - and I got to be sure the lug nuts aren't frozen, or the idiots there will break another stem, like they did last time...

 

One other quick one...

does everyone run 215/R70/14's on the aero? - I have the stock 14 inch wheels, but would a lower tire be better/worse, etc... I want the best compromise of Ride/vs traction...

What do you all run?

Thanks

 

opps - 215/70/R14 I meant :-)