1997 - 2006 Expedition & Navigator 1997 - 2002 and 2003 - 2006 Ford Expedition and Lincoln Navigator Discussion

Sludge or not?

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Old

Aug 8, 2009 | 02:19 AM

#1

DKdude

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Sludge or not?

Ok.....Checkout the pics from my 06 Expy 5.4. Tell me what ya think.

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Stick Out Tongue

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Old

Aug 8, 2009 | 12:10 PM

#2

alloro

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I think you need to change the brand (or type) of oil that you're using.
What have you been using?

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Old

Aug 8, 2009 | 11:54 PM

#3

DKdude

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Penz 10w30, Jiffy lube regular service intervals

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 07:47 AM

#4

tseekins

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Quote:

Originally Posted by DKdude

Penz 10w30, Jiffy lube regular service intervals

That's your problem, you engine calls for 5w-20 oil. What ended up happeninhg that caused your engine to have to be torn down?

I've been using Penzoil 10w-30 in my '88 for ever and never had any ill effects.

Tell us what happens between you and Ford and or you and Jiffy Lube.

Tim

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 10:23 AM

#5

ExpySport

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Joined: Jul 2004

Posts: 637

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From: Media, PA

Wow, that doesn't look good at all. What happened that made you feel something was wrong and the engine had to be taken apart? This could get interesting. You'd think these quick oil change places would know what grade oil to put into vehicles, but guess that's not always the case. Keep us posted!

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 11:28 AM

#6

alloro

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Quote:

Originally Posted by DKdude

Penz 10w30, Jiffy lube regular service intervals

You need 5W-20 and if you want to clean-up the inside of that engine real nice, make it 5W-20 synthetic.

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 02:23 PM

#7

DKdude

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How this all started.....I noticed a rattling noise at low speeds and at startup. It eventually goes away. Took it into ford since its still under warranty. They said the timing chain and tensioners need to be fixed. Then they say wait, an inspector needs to send digital images to Ford for approval. Well guess what? Denied

Well of course they say wheres all your service records. I have some but not all, and I did some on my own. They want exact receipts for that vehicle. I have oil and filter reciepts from stores i pushased from. they say thats not good enough!
Ive had five fords in the last 25 years....Ive never been treated like this ever until now. As soon as this is resolved. That dealership is history with us.

This car has been a nightmare. Less then 60K and here's what has gone bad with it:
1. Entertainment System broke. Replace Warranty item
2. Left front air suspension broke. Fixed warranty item
3. Transmission rebuild. warranty item.
4. Timing chain & tensioners? Warranty denied

I think I have what you call a "Pig in a poke"

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 04:28 PM

#8

ExpySport

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From: Media, PA

Is the engine still torn apart and the Expy sitting at the dealership? May be a longshot, but maybe try taking it to another dealership and see if they will work with you on this.

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 04:36 PM

#9

tseekins

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Quote:

Originally Posted by DKdude

How this all started.....I noticed a rattling noise at low speeds and at startup. It eventually goes away. Took it into ford since its still under warranty. They said the timing chain and tensioners need to be fixed. Then they say wait, an inspector needs to send digital images to Ford for approval. Well guess what? Denied

Well of course they say wheres all your service records. I have some but not all, and I did some on my own. They want exact receipts for that vehicle. I have oil and filter reciepts from stores i pushased from. they say thats not good enough!
Ive had five fords in the last 25 years....Ive never been treated like this ever until now. As soon as this is resolved. That dealership is history with us.

This car has been a nightmare. Less then 60K and here's what has gone bad with it:
1. Entertainment System broke. Replace Warranty item
2. Left front air suspension broke. Fixed warranty item
3. Transmission rebuild. warranty item.
4. Timing chain & tensioners? Warranty denied

I think I have what you call a "Pig in a poke"

Your vehicle has definately been more problematic than most but you did use the wrong motor oil.

I think I would head back to J-lube and find out why they used 10w-30 unless you specified that they use that oil.

I will admit that in past I've always blown off the dealer when it comes to oil changes. This is a case where you would have had an engine replacement for free.

Good luck,

Tim

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 04:51 PM

#10

97ExpGuy

Senior User

Joined: Feb 2009

Posts: 491

Likes: 4

From: Southern Illinois

Quote:

Originally Posted by tseekins

That's your problem, you engine calls for 5w-20 oil.

Tim,

I don't mean this in any ill manner when I ask this, but what makes you think the slightly heavier weight oil is the problem? I can see the brand being the problem, just not weight since its only a grade higher. I mean if he used 5-30 instead of 10-30, the flow rate is still 30 weight when hot. The only difference is that the flow rate for 5-20 is slightly less.

I may be totally wrong though. I am no expert on mod motors

Tom

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 06:02 PM

#11

alloro

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It's more than one grade difference. He had 10W-30 in there, when it should've been 5W-20. The thicker oil is more problematic with a cold engine. It takes longer for the oil to circulate when cold, and the result is faster wear and tear.

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 06:26 PM

#12

tseekins

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Quote:

Originally Posted by 97ExpGuy

Tim,

I don't mean this in any ill manner when I ask this, but what makes you think the slightly heavier weight oil is the problem? I can see the brand being the problem, just not weight since its only a grade higher. I mean if he used 5-30 instead of 10-30, the flow rate is still 30 weight when hot. The only difference is that the flow rate for 5-20 is slightly less.

I may be totally wrong though. I am no expert on mod motors

Tom

Tom, I'm no expert either. However, Ford recommends 5w-20 oil and motor craft oil is a semi synthetic oil. If I'm not mistaken, he used 10w-30 penzoil regular oil. There have been plenty of posts on here in the past about motor oils and the general concensus is that the mod motors are built with such tight tolerances that a thinner oil is absolutly necessary to prevent this type of damage.

I have been using Mobil 1 full synthetic for 15 years and have never had an issue on the three new Fords that I've used it in. According to Mobil 1's website, sythetic oils are less prone to slugding then conventional dino oils.

I'm personally more inclined to believe that the problem is not so much the oil as it may be a lack of maintenance, poor filtration, poor quailty oil and or all of the above. Then again, the possibility remains that his engine could be a POS and totally helpless.

Tim

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 07:15 PM

#13

mvoeller2

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Joined: Jan 2003

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Oil sludge like that comes from a couple of things. One is not changing oil frequently enough. Or from a lot of short trips where the engine doesn't warm up to operating temp. Another reason would be too cold of thermostat in engine. All of these things can cause excessive wear on timing components along with other engine wear.

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 09:41 PM

#14

DKdude

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Thanks guys for all your input good or bad. The dealership said they "flagged" the VIN # so I couldn't take it anywhere else for that specific warranty work.

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Old

Aug 9, 2009 | 09:47 PM

#15

ExpySport

Elder User

Joined: Jul 2004

Posts: 637

Likes: 4

From: Media, PA

Quote:

Originally Posted by DKdude

The dealership said they "flagged" the VIN # so I couldn't take it anywhere else for that specific warranty work.

Guess that's their way of ensuring that they get the repair job, huh? Hope things work out for you. Keep us posted and let us know how you make out.

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