15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
Elder User
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 513
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From: Lincoln NE
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
I've read several posts about 15W-40 Shell Rotella being a good kind of oil to burn pickups. Do all these people bragging it up use it in there diesel engines?
My question is: Would this be a good oil to burn in my '85 351W w/112K, or should I use something like Valvoline 10W-40 (I'm pretty much "pro-Valvoline"). My old man used this stuff (Shell Rotella) in all his semi's, and he has a point, he never had any motor problems due to what kind of motor oil he used. He claims this stuff would be perfect for my pickup. Does anyone out there use this "diesel recommended" Rotella for thier gas engines? I've only had this pickup for about 3 months and would like to use a motor oil that doesn't burn so fast. I've tried using "Engine Restore" which seemed to work until about 1800 miles on it and I've noticed it's starting to burn oil again.
Your wisdom is greatly appreciated.
My question is: Would this be a good oil to burn in my '85 351W w/112K, or should I use something like Valvoline 10W-40 (I'm pretty much "pro-Valvoline"). My old man used this stuff (Shell Rotella) in all his semi's, and he has a point, he never had any motor problems due to what kind of motor oil he used. He claims this stuff would be perfect for my pickup. Does anyone out there use this "diesel recommended" Rotella for thier gas engines? I've only had this pickup for about 3 months and would like to use a motor oil that doesn't burn so fast. I've tried using "Engine Restore" which seemed to work until about 1800 miles on it and I've noticed it's starting to burn oil again.
Your wisdom is greatly appreciated.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,228
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From: Running Springs CA
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
>Does anyone out there use this "diesel recommended"
>Rotella for thier gas engines?
Yes, I use diesel-rated 15W-40 Chevron Delo in my gasoline powered cars and trucks. U-haul runs 15W-40 in everything, diesel and gas. I feel that these oils give near-synthetic protection at low cost.
Rotella or Delo are perfect for your truck. You will probably find that you will be adding less 15W-40 than 10W-40 because it does not thin out with use.
If you are loyal to Valvoline, try the "Maxlife" and see if it works for you. Valvoline also makes All Fleet and Premium Blue 15W-40, but they may be hard to find.
Jim
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 8,238
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From: Oregon
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
I've been thinking about making this switch for awhile now, and I know your a staunch advocate of the 15-40 diesel oil, Jim. I just keep thinking that there must be a con to using this otherwise more people would be doing it. Most everybody sticks with 10-40 in their older engines but I've learned enough now to want to get away from that. Right now something like the Rotella is looking real good to me, but I was hoping to hear some more thoughts from folks. I just got done going through all the threads in this forum and consistently see you casting your vote "for", but nobody against. Anybody want to chime in?
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 13,873
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From: Atlanta GA
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
I tried it, though it was more expensive than 10-40. Then I tried 20-50 for my leaker/burner and it seems to do better. If I had a truck with no problems I would probably go with 15-40 diesel on an older truck.
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2002
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From: On the farm near Loveland
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
> I just keep thinking that there must be a con to using
>this otherwise more people would be doing it.
There is a *potential* downside to using diesel oil in gassers, the anti-acid compounds that increase the TBN for diesel use create higher amounts of abrasive ash deposits. Usually, higher TBN=More ash deposits. Just compare ash deposit specs of diesel oils to automotive type oils. Diesel oils seem to have a lot of extra gunk in them that seems of little benefit in a gas engine.
I say potential because I don't know how much ash gasoline engines can tolerate before it becomes detrimental.
Diesel oils also tend to be higher detergent than gasser oils, this creates more foaming, but diesels carry huge amounts of crankcase oil so more foam and more ash shouldn't be as much of an issue- in a diesel.
I'm not saying that over the road diesel oil is necessarily bad for a gasser, I am saying that there might be better choices. It's just too easy to say there is a single motor oil perfect for use in everything from motorcycles to diesel locomotives. I don't think there is.
-Bill
>this otherwise more people would be doing it.
There is a *potential* downside to using diesel oil in gassers, the anti-acid compounds that increase the TBN for diesel use create higher amounts of abrasive ash deposits. Usually, higher TBN=More ash deposits. Just compare ash deposit specs of diesel oils to automotive type oils. Diesel oils seem to have a lot of extra gunk in them that seems of little benefit in a gas engine.
I say potential because I don't know how much ash gasoline engines can tolerate before it becomes detrimental.
Diesel oils also tend to be higher detergent than gasser oils, this creates more foaming, but diesels carry huge amounts of crankcase oil so more foam and more ash shouldn't be as much of an issue- in a diesel.
I'm not saying that over the road diesel oil is necessarily bad for a gasser, I am saying that there might be better choices. It's just too easy to say there is a single motor oil perfect for use in everything from motorcycles to diesel locomotives. I don't think there is.
-Bill
Postmaster
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,532
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From: Trussville, Alabama
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
It's just too easy to say there is a single motor
>oil perfect for use in everything from motorcycles to diesel
>locomotives. I don't think there is.
>
>-Bill
Bill,
I think you nailed it. Look at all the different oils we are running here. And i don't remember a single first hand recount of an engine that failed due to the oil (not counting "sludge").
I still believe: Pick an oil, run it, and change it at reasonable intervals.
But, gosh I enjoy the discussions!!!
Brian A
>oil perfect for use in everything from motorcycles to diesel
>locomotives. I don't think there is.
>
>-Bill
Bill,
I think you nailed it. Look at all the different oils we are running here. And i don't remember a single first hand recount of an engine that failed due to the oil (not counting "sludge").
I still believe: Pick an oil, run it, and change it at reasonable intervals.
But, gosh I enjoy the discussions!!!
Brian A
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Junior User
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From: naples usa
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
Like Jim, I am a big fan of diesel oils for my 351W gas engine. I am not an expert, rather, just a parrot of a friend who is a STLE tribologist. Diesel oils will reduce start-up wear due to the high TBN, for the acids generated from the byproduct of combustion while your vehicle is not running are negated. This is the major cause of start-up wear, not dry starts. Phosphorus and its effect on cat converters has been raised as an issue. There are good phosphorus and there are bad phosphorus, depending on which brand you use. There hasn't been a link to any detriment on the cat for the brands that use the good phosphorus. Personally, the stats aren't very good for Rotella regarding Falex and TFOUT numbers, as well as cold pumpability. There are other brands of 15W-40 that perform/protect much better.
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Postmaster
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 4,532
Likes: 5
From: Trussville, Alabama
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
>Personally, the stats aren't very good for Rotella regarding
>Falex and TFOUT numbers, as well as cold pumpability. There
>are other brands of 15W-40 that perform/protect much better.
Which ones??
thanks,
Brian A
>Falex and TFOUT numbers, as well as cold pumpability. There
>are other brands of 15W-40 that perform/protect much better.
Which ones??
thanks,
Brian A
Junior User
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 54
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From: naples usa
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
Hi Brian,
Here is some examples of TFOUT/Falex that I've recently acquired:
Mobil Delvac 258/18
Chevron Delo 342/fail (Jim, any comment?)
Shell Rotella T 163/fail
Castrol Super Fleet 243/16
Shell Rimula Super 227/13
Pennzoil Longlife 331/17
Valvoline Prem. Blue 361/16
Eric
Here is some examples of TFOUT/Falex that I've recently acquired:
Mobil Delvac 258/18
Chevron Delo 342/fail (Jim, any comment?)
Shell Rotella T 163/fail
Castrol Super Fleet 243/16
Shell Rimula Super 227/13
Pennzoil Longlife 331/17
Valvoline Prem. Blue 361/16
Eric
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,228
Likes: 5
From: Running Springs CA
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
[updated:LAST EDITED ON 16-Dec-02 AT 11:31 AM (EST)]>Here is some examples of TFOUT/Falex that I've recently
>acquired:
>Chevron Delo 342/fail (Jim, any comment?)
>Eric
Just what is "TFOUT/Falex" ? I have not seen this until now. Can you give me a specification reference such as SAE or ASTM? Thanks.
Bill,
Diesel oils foam less than automotive oils, not more. This is a big issue with the PowerStroke due to the injection system design. Ash is the potential downside, but only if you are burning oil. I would not use it in a real "smoker". Straight SAE 40 non-detergent would be the ticket there, as I did with an old Toyota.
Jim
>acquired:
>Chevron Delo 342/fail (Jim, any comment?)
>Eric
Just what is "TFOUT/Falex" ? I have not seen this until now. Can you give me a specification reference such as SAE or ASTM? Thanks.
Bill,
Diesel oils foam less than automotive oils, not more. This is a big issue with the PowerStroke due to the injection system design. Ash is the potential downside, but only if you are burning oil. I would not use it in a real "smoker". Straight SAE 40 non-detergent would be the ticket there, as I did with an old Toyota.
Jim
Junior User
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 54
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From: naples usa
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
Hi Jim,
I didn't mean to draw your wrath, especially since we're such proponents of 15W-40 oil for our engines, but in a nutshell:
TFOUT (Thin Film Oxidation Uptake), ASTM D-4742 is an oil test to measure the oxidation resistance of oil. It uses standard Rotary Bomb Test Equipment. Falex, ASTM D-2670, is a test using pin and vee blocks under pressure that measures wear very accurately down to .0000556. In searching for an oil through these specs, it's best to look for an oil with the highest TFOUT (measured in minutes) in combination with the lowest Falex score.
I didn't mean to draw your wrath, especially since we're such proponents of 15W-40 oil for our engines, but in a nutshell:
TFOUT (Thin Film Oxidation Uptake), ASTM D-4742 is an oil test to measure the oxidation resistance of oil. It uses standard Rotary Bomb Test Equipment. Falex, ASTM D-2670, is a test using pin and vee blocks under pressure that measures wear very accurately down to .0000556. In searching for an oil through these specs, it's best to look for an oil with the highest TFOUT (measured in minutes) in combination with the lowest Falex score.
Junior User
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
From: naples usa
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
Premium Blue seems to be the best one overall with very high oxidation resistance. However, the Rimula would produce lower wear. With Rimula's relatively low TFOUT numbers of 227 minutes for a 15W-40 oil, you might ask if this makes it a bad oil. Really not though, cause dino gas-rated oils typically have a TFOUT that's lower than the 15W-40'S. For instance, the numbers some dino 10W-30's are as follows:
Exxon Superflow 178 (fail)
Quaker State 167 (22)
Motorcraft 144 (fail)
Castrol GTX 114 (26)
It's really a judgement call in this case Stab.
Exxon Superflow 178 (fail)
Quaker State 167 (22)
Motorcraft 144 (fail)
Castrol GTX 114 (26)
It's really a judgement call in this case Stab.
Elder User
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 513
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From: Lincoln NE
15W-40 Shell Rotella Question
Well, I used some Valvoline 10w-40 since it will be getting cold here and I had some to use up in the garage. I guess I was kind of sold on the shell rotella until y'all started talking about how rotella doesn't pass some specs/tests and the ash deposits. Would these ash deposits really harm my motor. Like I said, 112k on the motor and it burns the oil very slowly, it's not like I''m dumping oil in it every time I drive it, I guess every 750 miles or so I've gotta add a quart, but that was with the 5w-30, which I won't go back to. But like someone said, I've probably gotta just try it and see.
