Trouble starting, smokes before start, electric interference
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 490
Likes: 3
Trouble starting, smokes before start, electric interference
1999.5 F-250, starting to give me a problem.
It started off with electrical noise in the stereo. Chalked it up to a broken wire or a ground loop, rewired and reinstalled everything, didn't fix it. Sometimes I hear whine and interference through the system and then it goes away after 10 minutes or so, comes back randomly. Recently gotten much worse. Now I get noise sometimes with the truck off and the key in the "wait to start" position starting today.
Yesterday the truck was really hard to start, which is unusual. Its not very cold, I use synthetic oil, and its always started really easily in temps 30 degrees colder. I had to cycle the plugs about three times to start it yesterday, maybe four today.
Today I noticed while I'm cranking it over I'm getting a LOT of smoke from the exhaust. Once it starts it stops smoking.
So:
Difficulty starting
Smoking while cranking but not while running
Electrical noise feeding back through stereo
HELP
It started off with electrical noise in the stereo. Chalked it up to a broken wire or a ground loop, rewired and reinstalled everything, didn't fix it. Sometimes I hear whine and interference through the system and then it goes away after 10 minutes or so, comes back randomly. Recently gotten much worse. Now I get noise sometimes with the truck off and the key in the "wait to start" position starting today.
Yesterday the truck was really hard to start, which is unusual. Its not very cold, I use synthetic oil, and its always started really easily in temps 30 degrees colder. I had to cycle the plugs about three times to start it yesterday, maybe four today.
Today I noticed while I'm cranking it over I'm getting a LOT of smoke from the exhaust. Once it starts it stops smoking.
So:
Difficulty starting
Smoking while cranking but not while running
Electrical noise feeding back through stereo
HELP
Hotshot
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,499
Likes: 10
From: Sterling Heights,Mi
1st, Check your glow pulgs, I would expect your glow plug relay will take care of the first two problems.
3rd. Check for loose connections on all of your grounds..
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/7...pr-system.html
3rd. Check for loose connections on all of your grounds..
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/7...pr-system.html
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,144
Likes: 11
From: Rochdale MA
If the smoke is white coming from the exhaust it is unburnt fuel. Pat hit it right on the head, check out your glow plug system and take it from there.
Do check all of your grounds, usually "noise" is from a ground trying to get back to the battery.
Do check all of your grounds, usually "noise" is from a ground trying to get back to the battery.
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 490
Likes: 3
I replaced the glow plug relay. We'll see if that helps.
The stereo is not a simple ground loop or loose ground. I don't see how it can be a loose ground when you can turn the key to "acc" and have noise, turn it again and not.
Both amps and the head unit are firmly grounded to a bolt threaded into a hole in the frame. More importantly it went months with the current wiring with no noise but the noise happening and the starting issues occurred at almost the exact same time leading me to think its one issue.
The stereo is not a simple ground loop or loose ground. I don't see how it can be a loose ground when you can turn the key to "acc" and have noise, turn it again and not.
Both amps and the head unit are firmly grounded to a bolt threaded into a hole in the frame. More importantly it went months with the current wiring with no noise but the noise happening and the starting issues occurred at almost the exact same time leading me to think its one issue.
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,144
Likes: 11
From: Rochdale MA
I did some thinking on this last night. I'm wondering if the GPR had a short to ground in the coil, not enought to blow a fuse but enough to cause current leakage and noise within the sysyem.
Hotshot
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,499
Likes: 10
From: Sterling Heights,Mi
I have seen noise on a scope because of a bad contact, noise is frequency, that was why I suggested it.. not sure it is the case, but just a thought?
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Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 13,144
Likes: 11
From: Rochdale MA
Now that you say that I do remember working on a Reliance Drive many years ago and I did see a lot of noise on the scope. It ended up being an bad set of contacts for a smaller motor on the system.
Good call!!
Good call!!
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Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 490
Likes: 3
The GPR fixed the starting problem, we'll see about the noise.
I mis-typed up above about the "acc" position and noise. What I meant to say was if the key is put in the "wait to start" I'll have noise but if you rock it back past off to the "acc only" position there is no noise.
No noise at all last nigh, but the noise was intermittant so I'm not declaring victory just yet. If it still makes noise the only thing I can think of is fuel pump.
Thanks for all the help. The GPR was a simple fix. I've working with a broken right hand right now and even one handed I got it done in less than 30 minutes. Probably a 10 minute job with full use of both hands.
I mis-typed up above about the "acc" position and noise. What I meant to say was if the key is put in the "wait to start" I'll have noise but if you rock it back past off to the "acc only" position there is no noise.
No noise at all last nigh, but the noise was intermittant so I'm not declaring victory just yet. If it still makes noise the only thing I can think of is fuel pump.
Thanks for all the help. The GPR was a simple fix. I've working with a broken right hand right now and even one handed I got it done in less than 30 minutes. Probably a 10 minute job with full use of both hands.
Hotshot
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,499
Likes: 10
From: Sterling Heights,Mi
The GPR fixed the starting problem, we'll see about the noise.
I mis-typed up above about the "acc" position and noise. What I meant to say was if the key is put in the "wait to start" I'll have noise but if you rock it back past off to the "acc only" position there is no noise.
No noise at all last nigh, but the noise was intermittant so I'm not declaring victory just yet. If it still makes noise the only thing I can think of is fuel pump.
Thanks for all the help. The GPR was a simple fix. I've working with a broken right hand right now and even one handed I got it done in less than 30 minutes. Probably a 10 minute job with full use of both hands.
I mis-typed up above about the "acc" position and noise. What I meant to say was if the key is put in the "wait to start" I'll have noise but if you rock it back past off to the "acc only" position there is no noise.
No noise at all last nigh, but the noise was intermittant so I'm not declaring victory just yet. If it still makes noise the only thing I can think of is fuel pump.
Thanks for all the help. The GPR was a simple fix. I've working with a broken right hand right now and even one handed I got it done in less than 30 minutes. Probably a 10 minute job with full use of both hands.
Good Luck!
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 490
Likes: 3
No difference in the stereo noise. After about 10 minutes it started again. Lasts a few minutes, goes off, repeats.
I can hear a difference in the noise when I wiggle the key. Its still driving me nuts. Plus trying to troubleshoot 1 handed is a pain. Like typing one handed.
I can hear a difference in the noise when I wiggle the key. Its still driving me nuts. Plus trying to troubleshoot 1 handed is a pain. Like typing one handed.
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 337
Likes: 0
From: West cental Texas
Fuel pump is your noise source. As a ham I hear about Amateur radio operators that are always dealing with noisy electric fuel pumps. It explains the noise in relation to key position. You could try to replace it to ensure the pump isn't faulty (expensive, no guarentee) or build an RF choke assembly on your fuel pump wires. Ford knows about it and has service procedures, though they aren't the only car maker with problems. RF filter is just several powdered iron choke cores that have the fuel pump leads wrapped around them. Just do a google search for noisy electric fuel pump and see what you come up with. With hams we will get that noise in our receive audio and occasionally in our transmit audio as well.
Chad
Chad
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 337
Likes: 0
From: West cental Texas
Didn't know it doesn't stop. Is it variable with engine speed or constant hum? It does sound like an interference from a motor though. Maybe vacuum pump under the hood is causing RF interference? I say that since I remember mine stays on whether the engine is running or not. May try to take a transistor AM radio and "sweep" your vehicle with it looking for the highest noise level. I've used that before to find power line interference that is causing too much noise for me to operate my ham radio at the house. You know what static sounds like, RFI is very self evident on an old AM radio, it sounds horrific. Keep in mind everything makes electrical noise. Look for the largest offender based on sweeping radios distance from source and volume level.
Chad
Chad