Hi...
Newbie here...
My 2001 (179,000miles) E350 just developed a problem.It will start fine...run for a few minutes...then shut down abruptly.
It won't restart right away but after 20-30 min wait, it'll start up again, run fine for 2-3 min, then shut down again. I had it towed to the local dealer for the cam sensor recall but that didn't fix the problem. Now, after about an hour of checking for codes, (didn't find any) and fuel pressure check (OK), they want to start tearing into the engine because they think it "might" be an injector problem. I don't particularly trust them, so I'm looking for suggestions & advice.
It was looww on oil when this started, but I brought it back to full and the problem persists. (coincidence?)
Thanks in advance......

 

It sounds like an oil problem to me. Since the injectors are driven by oil, if you're truck was really low on oil, the injectors probably weren't able to run properly. I'm thinking there is enough oil in the HPO system to run the injectors for a bit and then the level drops low enough that the injectors are out of oil and the engine shuts down.

If your oil level was really low, you've likely gotten some air in the oil rails whch are located in the heads. From here, I would first make sure your HPOP res is full of oil, and try to purge all of the air from the HPO rails. Keep in mind it can take up to 100 miles of driving to get all of the air purged from the system. When you topped off the oil level, how many times did you try to start it and let it run?

If that doesn't fix the problem, you might have a low pressure oil pump that has gone bad. The symptoms would be very similar, because the LPOP could not supply the HPOP with enough oil to run the injectors. Have you done any kind of oil pressure checks on the HPOP res when you can get the engine to fire? I would definately do that as well to see what's happening to the oil pressure when the truck suddenly quits running. Does the oil pressure light on the dash come on at all, especially right before or when the truck dies? It's also possible that the extremely low oil level caused damage to the LPOP and it can't supply the proper amount of oil now.

Hopefully that will give you a few places to start.

 

Welcome to FTE.

What else can you tell us? Any unusual dash lights when it stalls or won't restart? When it dies does it kind of sputter first or just simply cut off like someone turned the key? When it does run is it fine or real rough?

The mechanic should be able to do an injector buzz test and cylinder contribution test before they start tearing into the engine looking for parts to throw at it.

 

I think Jeremy may be right. I also think you are correct not to trust the dealer. It should not ever take an hour to check for codes. Oil should have been on of the first things they checked. You may even want to double check them on your fuel. Let it run until it cuts off, turn key to off and open fuel bowl and make sure you have fuel. Are you getting and SES lights when it dies?
When did you last change your oil?
When did you last change your fuel filter?
Way to many things could cause your problem that needs to be looked at before you tear into the engine.
Welcome to the site and we will get you running again if at all possible.

 

The Fuel filter was changed a couple of months ago because the o-ring started leaking....the oil is probably due for a change. When it sratrs up, it runs fine..just like the good old days....when it stalls it shuts down very quickley. It might start to run rough, but only for a second or two, and then it just stops...and won't restart or even feel like it's about to fire.


Thanks for all the suggestions...I'm off to the dealer (stealer?) with my arsenal of questions. I'll let you know any additional info I get.

 

"If your oil level was really low, you've likely gotten some air in the oil rails whch are located in the heads. From here, I would first make sure your HPOP res is full of oil, and try to purge all of the air from the HPO rails. Keep in mind it can take up to 100 miles of driving to get all of the air purged from the system"

Will just driving it purge the air?

Here's the latest from the $#$^@*&%friggin dealer/stealer.....I never was able to talk to the guy who was actually working on my van. First there was the consultant who had me talk to the service manager who really wasn't a "Diesel guy" but had another "guy" working on it. The actual mechanic was always on a test drive, lunch, visiting Never-Never land, you name it. When they told me it was doing the same thing as before they changed the cam sensor, they were either outright lying to me or just plain incompetent. Before, it would run fine for 2-3 min and shuts down...now it keeps running, but sometimes with a slight miss. (I'm hoping it's just some air not quite purged as Jeremy suggested) I just drove it home, about 8 miles, where before I couldn't drive it 2 blocks. (Excuse me while I scream......IDIOTS!) I couldn't get it out of there fast enough!

Am I glad I didn't just say "go ahead and do what you need to do"......thanks mainly to the help I got here!

 

If it's running better and longer now, air in the rails seems to be a likely suspect. At this point, driving it will be the best way to purge the rest of the rails. Be sure to keep an eye on the oil level too.

 

Ding, ding, ding, we have our answer. I hope that's got it fixed. Might be a good time for an oil change. Like Jermemy said, watch you oil level and make sure you're not loosing too fas.
That Jermemy's a smart feller ain't he. Kinda handy to have around.

 

Hi Guys. Im new here and have a problem. I bought an 85 ford f150 4x4 not running. It has the 5.0 with the efi. I changed out the fuel pump in the tank and then found it was not getting any fire to the pump. Im an old feller and never worked on these newer rigs. Can you tell me where to start and how? Thanks a million.

 

Welcome to FTE. I can't help you but if you want to post on thread for that year and model, I'm sure someone there can help. Here's the link. https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum37/

 

Check all your fuses first, then post your question again in the link provided above.

 

after reading my last post again...

My humble apologies if I've offended anyone with my "dealer/stealer" remark.

I was only refering to the local dealership and not to any honest (and extremely competent) Ford techs that might post here. I shouldn't have used such a broad brush in my tirade. I'm old enough to know better than to stereotype based on a few bad examples.

....and I really do appreciate all the help

...and I've gotten religion on the oil changes

 

I'm not so sure that it's an oil related problem. Usually a fluid loss problem results in a "tapering down" type of stalling rather than a sudden shut-off like is described here.
But the fact that the oil was low and now it runs for a longer period of time would support the oil theory.
I don't have any answers, so am just going to listen for now.

 

Dan, I've got a theory as to why the truck will suddenly shut off if it's an oil related issue, and it has to do with our HEUI injection system. Specifically the injector itself. The way I understand the inner workings of the injector, it has a poppet valve in it that releases the oil pressure to the plunger assembly. That poppet valve has a specific VOP (valve opening pressure) so it will not release any oil pressure and the resulting fuel until the VOP has been reached.

My theory is that if the oil level was dropping low enough to drop the HPO pressure, that pressure might drop slowly until it's below the VOP level of the injectors. Once it drops below that VOP, the injectors won't work at all. I theorize that they might be able to stop suddenly once the pressure drops. It's kind of along the lines that we need a certian HPO pressure to even get the truck to start that has me thinking this.

The only part that kind of confuses me is why it would have to sit for 20-30 minutes before it would restart. The only thing I can think of is a low oil level was causing the HPOP to aireate the oil severly enough that it could not create pressure in the rails. After 20-30 minutes, the air bubbles would find their way out of the rails, or at least not aireated enough to keep the truck from starting.

 

Jeremy, would oil foaming cause the same issues? Maybe the 20-30 minutes would allow enough time for the foam to settle out. He said it's better since he has added more, fresh oil, but if the old is still foaming, just not as bad.