10% ethanol
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New User
Joined: Sep 2006
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10% ethanol
So I have been putting gas in my truck lately, and have noticed the 10% ethanol stickers on the pumps, and i have noticed my mileage has dropped severely it seems. I was getting about 11mpg, when i usually get about 13-14. Could this make this big of a difference?? I have burned almost 1/2 a tank with only 82 miles this week!! Anyone else noticing this?
Tuned
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 464
Likes: 1
From: Bismarck USA
Yeah, that sounds about right. But also realize the mileage will drop if you're in the cold climates. Mine will drop by 2 points from the cold, even if I put in non-ethanol.
Personally, I put it in on purpose in the winter. That way I don't need any ISO-Heat to stop the fuel lines from freezing. That stuff is just iso-alcohol. Why put it in when I can get 89 octane with 10% alcohol already in it?
Personally, I put it in on purpose in the winter. That way I don't need any ISO-Heat to stop the fuel lines from freezing. That stuff is just iso-alcohol. Why put it in when I can get 89 octane with 10% alcohol already in it?
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 303
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From: "Garden State"
I'm in NJ and we have the 10% ethanol in all grades of fuel. And yes when they went to ethanol from MBTE my mileage dropped by about 12.5%. The price for the fuel did not drop. So I'm burning more fuel to go the same distance and ethanol increases the NOX emissions. Wow! what a great government boondoggle. And now I'm reading articles that show that using "biofuels" actually increase overall pollution plus increases the cost of food.
Oxygenators such as MBTE and ethanol were first conceived to reduce cold start up and cold weather running emissions when cars had CARBURETORS! With modern EFI computer controlled vehicles oxygenators are not needed and make matters worse. With "real" gas I would get 21 mpg on the highway. With MBTE I was getting 16 mpg. With ethanol I now get 13-14 mpg. This is doing highway driving in the same manner
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Whimsey
Oxygenators such as MBTE and ethanol were first conceived to reduce cold start up and cold weather running emissions when cars had CARBURETORS! With modern EFI computer controlled vehicles oxygenators are not needed and make matters worse. With "real" gas I would get 21 mpg on the highway. With MBTE I was getting 16 mpg. With ethanol I now get 13-14 mpg. This is doing highway driving in the same manner
. Whimsey
Posting Guru
Joined: May 2006
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From: Iowa
its got to do with the programing of your truck... it slowley adjusts for things like that over a few tanks.... if you want just unhook your batterys for 1 min or so and it should make the computer reconfigure imediatly for the fuel that is in it....
I have never ran anything but 15% ethanol in my truck and i get a steady 14mph in the winter and 17-18 in the summer...
I have never ran anything but 15% ethanol in my truck and i get a steady 14mph in the winter and 17-18 in the summer...
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Senior User
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: "Garden State"
Originally Posted by BURNSTOUGHFORD
its got to do with the programing of your truck... it slowley adjusts for things like that over a few tanks.... if you want just unhook your batterys for 1 min or so and it should make the computer reconfigure imediatly for the fuel that is in it....
I have never ran anything but 15% ethanol in my truck and i get a steady 14mph in the winter and 17-18 in the summer...
I have never ran anything but 15% ethanol in my truck and i get a steady 14mph in the winter and 17-18 in the summer...
Whimsey
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Brett Foote
Posting Guru
Joined: May 2006
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From: Iowa
i know that ethanol has less energy per volume, but i can tell you for sure that its not enough to make large drops in fuel milage... i ran 87 octane regular for 2 tanks in my truck and it started to start hard...norlmally 2-3 seconds of cranking to start on ethanol, but with regular is was like 6-7 seconds... and i got about 2mpg... less, untill i reset my computer and then my miliage went back to what it usually does.
the difference between e15 and regular fuel is minimal, you shouldnt be able to tell a difference in it.
from my experiance the e15 is no different... but the e85 actually contains a signifigant difference in energy content, so you do tend to get less fuel economy.
the funny thing is if somebody made an engine purpose built to run on e85 they could make a much more powerfull/reliable engine than anyone ever could on regular gasoline... you can run much higher compression ratios, in excess of 12:1 vs normal fuel is like 9:1...
just some food for thought
the difference between e15 and regular fuel is minimal, you shouldnt be able to tell a difference in it.
from my experiance the e15 is no different... but the e85 actually contains a signifigant difference in energy content, so you do tend to get less fuel economy.
the funny thing is if somebody made an engine purpose built to run on e85 they could make a much more powerfull/reliable engine than anyone ever could on regular gasoline... you can run much higher compression ratios, in excess of 12:1 vs normal fuel is like 9:1...
just some food for thought
Tuned
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 464
Likes: 1
From: Bismarck USA
Another misconception, ethanol doesn't have as much "energy" as gasoline. Not the whole truth. It just takes higher compressions to obtain the energy than gas. Otherwise funny cars wouldn't be running alcohol. It's not just that they run it because of high compression. The reverse is also true. You need high compression with alcohol to get the power.
Awhile back, I saw a V8 Mustang in a magazine that made something like 400hp on 92 pump gas. But made 450 on 85% ethanol. Why? Because they can run the super charger at higher PSI and obtain the energy of the ethanol.
Since most of us aren't running turbo/superchargers, the only way to get some of that HP back would be to change the engine timing to utilize the ethanol a bit. At best though, I see that as a wash. Getting your truck back up the mileage you used to have.
Awhile back, I saw a V8 Mustang in a magazine that made something like 400hp on 92 pump gas. But made 450 on 85% ethanol. Why? Because they can run the super charger at higher PSI and obtain the energy of the ethanol.
Since most of us aren't running turbo/superchargers, the only way to get some of that HP back would be to change the engine timing to utilize the ethanol a bit. At best though, I see that as a wash. Getting your truck back up the mileage you used to have.
Moderator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 22,436
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From: Louisville,Ky.
Winter blends of fuels always provide less MPG than summer blends. The additives are different to prevent freezing and to burn faster for better cold starts. In the spring, when they go back to the summer blends, your mileage will return.
My county also uses that reformulated garbage. It goes bad sitting much faster, gets worse mileage and causes my Mustang (high miles) to burn oil. Luckily, I'm about 12 miles from the county line and always drive to the next county and fill my vehicles with real gasoline.
Yes, E-85 is higher octane and unless your engine is designed for higher octane ( high compression or forced induction) it will make less power because it burns slower.
I proved this theory with the Mustang by running it on 93 octane at the track
Without NOS 8.40 in the 1/8 mile.
With no other mods than 110 octane racing fuel it dropped to 8.60. I only have 9.0 to 1 compression, and do not need the higher octane.
Now the new experimental BOSS engine that will be coming out in the trucks by 2010 in the 6.2L form is in a 7L form In a Roush drag car. It runs no power adder and E-85 and is making about 800hp. So E-85 can be a good thing as far as power goes, if the engine is actually built for the higher compression and the fuel system is set-up to handle the corrosive fuel.
My county also uses that reformulated garbage. It goes bad sitting much faster, gets worse mileage and causes my Mustang (high miles) to burn oil. Luckily, I'm about 12 miles from the county line and always drive to the next county and fill my vehicles with real gasoline.
Yes, E-85 is higher octane and unless your engine is designed for higher octane ( high compression or forced induction) it will make less power because it burns slower.
I proved this theory with the Mustang by running it on 93 octane at the track
Without NOS 8.40 in the 1/8 mile.
With no other mods than 110 octane racing fuel it dropped to 8.60. I only have 9.0 to 1 compression, and do not need the higher octane.
Now the new experimental BOSS engine that will be coming out in the trucks by 2010 in the 6.2L form is in a 7L form In a Roush drag car. It runs no power adder and E-85 and is making about 800hp. So E-85 can be a good thing as far as power goes, if the engine is actually built for the higher compression and the fuel system is set-up to handle the corrosive fuel.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,920
Likes: 2
From: Carson City, NV
Here in ct we have 10% ethanol gas as well, personally I do not like it one bit. It is supposed to be better for the environment but when you have to increase fuel consumption, then what good does it really do in the end? I noticed one time in my taurus, that i filled up at a station out in the Midwest without 10% ethanol and I ended up getting 32mpg highway with the 3.0 v6. I usually get about 29 highway, thats an increase of about 10%.
Freshman User
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 49
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From: Iowa
ive never seen too much difference in my mpg from switching from regular gas to 10% ethanol and ive always been told that ethanol will keep the engine cleaner then regular gas. so ill take the 10cent cheaper gas and hopfully my engine will stay cleaner
Junior User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 59
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Ah ethanol, perhaps one of the greatest scams to hit the fuel industry since time. Only the governments would mandate a fuel that you have to burn more of to get you the same distance.
I'm getting an 08 for work that runs on E85, I will let you know how that works out.
I'm getting an 08 for work that runs on E85, I will let you know how that works out.