Need some carb help
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Senior User
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Denair, CA
Need some carb help
I know that there are probably a thousand of these threads on here but I couldn't quite find what I was looking for when I searched. I'm having some pretty typical issues with the 4180 on my 460 truck and I need a little direction here. First off, the truck is running beyond rich. It blows a bit of black out the tailpipe almost constantly, will barely idle when the choke is on, and belts fireballs out upon deceleration. Not to mention the horrible mileage, my best tank being about 5 and a half mpg. I figure the power valve is probably toast and it's got some fuel seeping through the bottom of the accelerator pump gasket. Now, I'd like nothing more than to toss the 4180 on the garage floor and replace it with a 4160 but I have to pass emissions testing. I live in California but the truck falls under federal emissions so I don't have to have 50-state legal parts on it. It still has to pass a visual and the sniffer though. So to my question, do I have any options other than rebuilding the 4180? Can a 4160 be rigged up to pass? I'd appreciate any info anybody could provide. Thanks ahead guys.
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Senior User
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From: Denair, CA
Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
I think you're on the right track w/ all the symptoms.
Why don't you just rebuild it if the pump diaphram is shot too?
Get the anti blowout PV w/ your kit.
Why don't you just rebuild it if the pump diaphram is shot too?
Get the anti blowout PV w/ your kit.
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
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From: EXTREME southwest CT
What about it do you dislike? It's stone simple and there's plenty of support for it.
Vacuum secondarys are nice and progressive.
You could always mess w/ springs if you want it dump and bog.
I'd imagine you could tune a double pumper past the sniffer but it won't get past the visual.
Would it be OK if you had an aftermarket carb w/ the Cali certification?
I've never had to deal w/ Cali emissions inspections.
You might try searching the fuel delivery board here;
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum72/
Vacuum secondarys are nice and progressive.
You could always mess w/ springs if you want it dump and bog.
I'd imagine you could tune a double pumper past the sniffer but it won't get past the visual.
Would it be OK if you had an aftermarket carb w/ the Cali certification?
I've never had to deal w/ Cali emissions inspections.
You might try searching the fuel delivery board here;
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum72/
Last edited by ArdWrknTrk; Feb 12, 2008 at 05:16 PM.
Thread Starter
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From: Denair, CA
Well, the main thing I don't like about it is the fact that it's basically non adjustable. I'm also having a heck of a time finding a kit for this particular carb. I've tried running the numbers at napa, kragen, and autozone's website and I can't find the right one for it. The numbers I grabbed off of it are E5HE-9510-DD, LIST-50259-3, 3236. If you could point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it.
As for emissions, it's a little tricky with this truck. It doens't use California's strict emissions testing due to it having an 8600 GVWR, instead it falls under federal. I have no doubt I could get passed the more relaxed sniffer but visually it would have to at least look like all emissions equipment is functional.
As for emissions, it's a little tricky with this truck. It doens't use California's strict emissions testing due to it having an 8600 GVWR, instead it falls under federal. I have no doubt I could get passed the more relaxed sniffer but visually it would have to at least look like all emissions equipment is functional.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
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From: Denair, CA
Looks like that kit should fit my carb as well. Thank you very much for your help Jim, as always it's much appreciated.
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From: Virginia
If you keep the air pump system, and the original aircleaner, you might get away with a 4160. It could be tuned probably to pass, and you could leave some of the junk laying on top of the engine. The original air cleaner hides a lot. Most of the mechanics/inspectors in my area do know what all those doodads and hoses are for anyway. It would pollute a lot less with a new carb than what you have going on now.
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pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
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From: EXTREME southwest CT
Sure Breech,
You're very welcome!
Sorry if I've gotten behind on the thread, my broadband has been in and out all day due to the storm.
I'm always glad If I might have some information I can share to help others.
Please let us know how it works out.
I'm a bit at a loss when you say the :edit, 4180 : <correction, 80="" not="" 60=""> isn't adjustable...what do you want it to be able to do???</correction,>
You're very welcome!
Sorry if I've gotten behind on the thread, my broadband has been in and out all day due to the storm.
I'm always glad If I might have some information I can share to help others.
Please let us know how it works out.
I'm a bit at a loss when you say the :edit, 4180 : <correction, 80="" not="" 60=""> isn't adjustable...what do you want it to be able to do???</correction,>
Last edited by ArdWrknTrk; Feb 12, 2008 at 09:11 PM.
Moderator
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From: Virginia
Originally Posted by Franklin2
If you keep the air pump system, and the original aircleaner, you might get away with a 4160. It could be tuned probably to pass, and you could leave some of the junk laying on top of the engine. The original air cleaner hides a lot. Most of the mechanics/inspectors in my area do know what all those doodads and hoses are for anyway. It would pollute a lot less with a new carb than what you have going on now.
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 2004
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From: Niceville, FL.
Sounds like your 4180 has a bad power valve which makes it run rich. If you contact the Holley Technical Services website and give them the numbers you quoted they can tell you the proper power valve, jet sizes, overhaul kit, etc. If you get a Walker kit, I'm pretty sure it will work on any 4180. Just make sure you use the gaskets that exactly match the ones you remove from your carburetor. If your truck backfires through the carburetor then you should get a power valve protection kit. There are several different manufacturers and they are inexpensive (especially on ebay). It is important to get the right power valve for your carburetor for best performance. It is also important to get the fuel level adjusted properly (both primary and secondary) because it seems to affect how rich/lean it runs. Click this link: http://www.powervalveshield.com/
Last edited by Piffery1; Feb 12, 2008 at 09:55 PM.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Denair, CA
Originally Posted by ArdWrknTrk
Sure Breech,
You're very welcome!
Sorry if I've gotten behind on the thread, my broadband has been in and out all day due to the storm.
I'm always glad If I might have some information I can share to help others.
Please let us know how it works out.
I'm a bit at a loss when you say the :edit, 4180 : <correction, 80="" not="" 60=""> isn't adjustable...what do you want it to be able to do???</correction,>
You're very welcome!
Sorry if I've gotten behind on the thread, my broadband has been in and out all day due to the storm.
I'm always glad If I might have some information I can share to help others.
Please let us know how it works out.
I'm a bit at a loss when you say the :edit, 4180 : <correction, 80="" not="" 60=""> isn't adjustable...what do you want it to be able to do???</correction,>
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Denair, CA
Originally Posted by Franklin2
Correction; The above should read " Most of the mechanics/inspectors in my area don't know what all those doodads and hoses are for anyway."
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 191
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From: Denair, CA
Originally Posted by Piffery1
Sounds like your 4180 has a bad power valve which makes it run rich. If you contact the Holley Technical Services website and give them the numbers you quoted they can tell you the proper power valve, jet sizes, overhaul kit, etc. If you get a Walker kit, I'm pretty sure it will work on any 4180. Just make sure you use the gaskets that exactly match the ones you remove from your carburetor. If your truck backfires through the carburetor then you should get a power valve protection kit. There are several different manufacturers and they are inexpensive (especially on ebay). It is important to get the right power valve for your carburetor for best performance. It is also important to get the fuel level adjusted properly (both primary and secondary) because it seems to affect how rich/lean it runs. Click this link: http://www.powervalveshield.com/
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
Likes: 40
From: EXTREME southwest CT
Originally Posted by Breech
No problem Jim, I'm no stranger to connection issues myself. As far as it being non adjustable, I was refering to the A/F mixture screws being sealed. I've always believed that for a carburetor to stay as effecient as possible it has to be recalibrated for the weather. Unlike EFI that can compensate for changes on the fly a carb has to be tweaked manually. I don't like the fact that this thing basically has one setting that has to be used year round but I'm not totally opposed to leaving it on there if I can get it running right.
Unless you're up in the mountains I can't imagine the weather/ temp in California changes so much You'd need to seasonally adjust the mixture to have it run right. Maybe you'd have to 'clock' the choke housing.