View Poll Results: Will it or won't it?
It will (I am a licensed pilot)
5
11.36%
It will (I am not a licensed pilot)
24
54.55%
It will not (I am a licensed pilot)
5
11.36%
It will not (I am not a licensed pilot)
10
22.73%
Voters: 44. You may not vote on this poll
Poll: Will it or Won't It
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,043
Likes: 4
Originally Posted by Beerstalker
Dang it, I just watched the episode and found out it didn't air. I checked out the Mythbusters site and rumor is they did it with an ultralight on a 1/4 mile conveyor runway. People are thinking that they may have decided to hold onto it and keep it for the next season's premiere, or the next viewer special that are both coming up in Jan (assuming the writers strike doesn't screw them up too).
Anyway in the forum at the Mythbusters site I found a link to this video (sorry if it was posted in here earlier I haven't watched them). A guy uses his sons remote control plane taped to the top of a matchbox car to show that the plane accelerates forward at the same rate no matter what the speed of the treadmill is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EopVDgSPAk
Anyway in the forum at the Mythbusters site I found a link to this video (sorry if it was posted in here earlier I haven't watched them). A guy uses his sons remote control plane taped to the top of a matchbox car to show that the plane accelerates forward at the same rate no matter what the speed of the treadmill is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EopVDgSPAk
Yup. It's here. Post #3.
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
Can a plane take off from a treadmill?. Is this a trick question? The answer is yes. If the treadmill is long enough and can generate enough speed. Just turn the plane around so the treadmill propels the plane to generate lift. Visit your local aircraft carrier courtesy of the Navy for a demonstration.
A treadmill simply turning the wheels will not generate lift. Kind of like a dyno won't make my truck go 60 mph. The wheels spin but the truck would just sit there.
A treadmill simply turning the wheels will not generate lift. Kind of like a dyno won't make my truck go 60 mph. The wheels spin but the truck would just sit there.
Thread Starter
|
Postmaster
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,004
Likes: 1
From: North of Boston MA
How would a treadmill generate airflow? The treadmill would only make the wheels spin faster. The thrust of the aircraft engine pushes against air only which causes the aircraft to move forward (action=>reaction). The freespinning wheels have no ability to slow or stop the aircraft. When the plane moves forward fast enough, it flies.
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,043
Likes: 4
Originally Posted by bf250
if the treadmill is going so fast backwards that the plane can not overcome the reversed air flow then it will not take off.
How would the treadmill keep the plane from moving?
Why didn't the treadmill keep the plane from moving in the video in post #3?
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,110
Likes: 0
how will it generate airflow?
easy, put the plane on a treadmill going 45mph and the plan sitting on the treadmill will be going 45mph through the air.
now, if you have the plane tied up where it won't move backwards with the treadmill but just spin the wheels, then the treadmill would have no effect at all, leaving out of course the "can the tires take it?" argument.
easy, put the plane on a treadmill going 45mph and the plan sitting on the treadmill will be going 45mph through the air.
now, if you have the plane tied up where it won't move backwards with the treadmill but just spin the wheels, then the treadmill would have no effect at all, leaving out of course the "can the tires take it?" argument.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,110
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 76supercab2
Wrong answer, wrong reasoning.
How would the treadmill keep the plane from moving?
Why didn't the treadmill keep the plane from moving in the video in post #3?
How would the treadmill keep the plane from moving?
Why didn't the treadmill keep the plane from moving in the video in post #3?
because the plane was tied up for one, put that plane on a mile long treadmill doing 50mph and do not tie it up and i bet the plan won't ever take off.
the plane was tied up thus not creating any reverse airflow over the wings for it to overcome. untie it and it will first need to over come the reversed air flow then gain anough speed to take off, the question of if it will take off or not depends if it has enough power to overcome the reversed air flow and get enough speed for lift.
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
Top 6 Best Deals Available on New Fords & Lincolns Right Now
Brett Foote
This Hennessey Takes the Expedition Tremor's Off-Roading Capability to the Next Level
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Fords at 2026 Carlisle Ford Nationals
Joe Kucinski
3 Best / 3 Worst Parts of Modern Ford Ownership
Brett Foote
10 Amazing Upgrades That Solve Common Ford Truck Owner Headaches
Pouria Savadkouei
Every 2026 Ford Engine Explained
Brett Foote
10 Ugly Ford Trucks That We Still Kinda Love
Joe Kucinski
10 Things Every Truck Owner NEEDS (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
Rezvani's Latest Post-Apocalyptic Monster Is a Ford F-150 Raptor Underneath
Verdad Gallardo
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,043
Likes: 4
Originally Posted by bf250
because the plane was tied up for one, put that plane on a mile long treadmill doing 50mph and do not tie it up and i bet the plan won't ever take off.
I'd take that bet.
Originally Posted by bf250
the plane was tied up thus not creating any reverse airflow over the wings for it to overcome. untie it and it will first need to over come the reversed air flow then gain anough speed to take off, the question of if it will take off or not depends if it has enough power to overcome the reversed air flow and get enough speed for lift.
2. Once the motor/propeller was turned on, the model had not troble what so ever moving forward against the motion of the treadmill.
3. The speed of the treadmill -- 0mph, 4mph, 10mph -- made no difference what so ever in the speed that the model was able to traverse the length of the treadmill. IE the treadmill had not effect on the model. Period.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,110
Likes: 0
well, then why did aircraft carriers have to turn into the wind and go flank for the airplanes in ww2 in order for the airplanes to take off? if it did not matter they could just go slow and not turn all the time to save on fuel.
but if they went with the wind, especially a strong one and went flank, most likely those poor airplanes would have not ever taken off but just crashed into the water.
i do not see how if a plane needs to go 100mph airspeed to take off and it has 200mph airspeed going opposite over its wings and the top speed of the plane airspeed wise is 150mph how it would get the extra 50mph to take off.
the plane needs a a certain airspeed to take off, if the treadmill creates more reversed flow airspeed than the plane has power to overcome, it will not take off.
it does not matter if it is a treadmill, a carrier or just a very windy day.
but if they went with the wind, especially a strong one and went flank, most likely those poor airplanes would have not ever taken off but just crashed into the water.
i do not see how if a plane needs to go 100mph airspeed to take off and it has 200mph airspeed going opposite over its wings and the top speed of the plane airspeed wise is 150mph how it would get the extra 50mph to take off.
the plane needs a a certain airspeed to take off, if the treadmill creates more reversed flow airspeed than the plane has power to overcome, it will not take off.
it does not matter if it is a treadmill, a carrier or just a very windy day.
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
Originally Posted by 76supercab2
Right answer. Wrong reasoning.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,110
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 76supercab2
'splain to me again how the treadmill 'creates reverse airflow over the wing'.
same with the treadmill, if you sit on a treadmill and travel down it, lets just say it is a huge treadmill like 10 miles long, and you are traveling 50mph, you will have a 50mph wind just as you do in a car, a zip line, parachuting or whatever.
so, if the plane is facing one direction and the treadmill is going another and lets say the treadmill is 10 miles long, so whatever speed the treadmill is traveling will also make the plane move through the air at that speed creating air speed across its wings, but in the opposite direction the plane needs for lift.
now, if the plane has the power to overcome that and to get to its air speed it needs for take off, than no problem. but if the plane does not have enough power to over come the air speed coming from the treadmill moving it backwards through the air and still gain enough forward speed for lift, the plane will not take off.
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,043
Likes: 4
Originally Posted by F350-6
I didn't watch the video. If your allowed to use the thrust of the airplane engines then it's basically relative to ground speed. Enough forward momentum and lift will be created. If the plane engines are turned off then the plane will get thrown backward, or if tethered and the tread mill is fast enough, bounce up and down just before the wheels explode. But no lift = no flight.
So, does the plane take off?
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,043
Likes: 4
Originally Posted by bf250
well, like this.....if you drive down the road at 50mph and put a wind speed meter out your window, it will register 50mph, assuming there is no wind that day.
Originally Posted by bf250
same with the treadmill, if you sit on a treadmill and travel down it, lets just say it is a huge treadmill like 10 miles long, and you are traveling 50mph, you will have a 50mph wind just as you do in a car, a zip line, parachuting or whatever.
Yes
Originally Posted by bf250
so, if the plane is facing one direction and the treadmill is going another and lets say the treadmill is 10 miles long, so whatever speed the treadmill is traveling will also make the plane move through the air at that speed creating air speed across its wings, but in the opposite direction the plane needs for lift.
No. The plane's wheel bearings have infinitely less frictions than my fat butt sitting on a treadmill belt.
The only force the engines have to overcome is the rolling friction in the wheel bearings. That force doesn't add up to a rounding error compared to the tens of thousands of pounds of thrust the engines will develop.
Originally Posted by bf250
now, if the plane has the power to overcome that and to get to its air speed it needs for take off, than no problem. but if the plane does not have enough power to over come the air speed coming from the treadmill moving it backwards through the air and still gain enough forward speed for lift, the plane will not take off.
Again, the wheel bearings near zero friction effectivley negates any actions by the conveyor belt.