i was talking to a friend the other day and he told me that the 351m, 351c, and 400m or big blocks and i told him no they are not, and i told him i have done all of the research. So who is right?

 

ford never categorized small blocks and big blocks....that's a chevy term. Ford had the Windsor series, 335 series(your engines in question) and the 385 series. Now strictly going by size, the 335 series is small compared to the 385 series. And the windsors are smaller than the 335 series except for the 351W. Not much difference there, some, but not much. So I'd say you're right for sake of arguement.

 

As havi said, but for the sake of arguement, the FE motors and 385s would be considered "Big Block" and the 335s would be "Small Block" (It even says big block on the FTE forums for those engines).

 

Saying small block and big block makes it sound like there are only two choices. For ford, that's simply not the case.
The 351W, 302 block is not the same as the 351C 351M 400 Block is not the same as the 429 460 block.

If anything we should call the 351C 351M 400 block a "medium" block.

 

Very good point you have there. I hadn't thought of it that way.

 

Sorry, but that is such a bull**** magazine term. The 351W/351M/400 all use 3" main bearings. The 351W has a 9.5" deck hieght while the 302C/351C have a 9.2" deck hieght. The 351W dizzy will swap with the C/M/400 IF you change the gear. All W's from the lowly 221 to the final 351W and all 335s from the first 351Cs and 400s to the last 302C made in 1983 have the same bore spacing of 4.38". In full trim, the 351W is a hair taller and just about identical in width to a 351C. Finally, the NHRA factors Cs as small blocks and even factors the rare 400FMX blocks (400 with W/C bellhousing) as small blocks.

 

I like to think of the Cleveland as "The Cleveland" not big or small block. Its in a class of its own baby

 

bottom line, neither the 351W, 351M, 351C, or the 400 are "big blocks".

also, the 400 does not get an "M". the letter designations are to distinguish the different 351 engines, the 400 is not a 351, so it doesn't need to be distinguished. there is only one Ford 400 engine, and it came before the 351M. the 351M is a factory destroked 400. both the 351M and 400 can be / are commonly refered to as "M blocks" when a displacement is not specified, they do indeed share the same identical block and heads.

basically the 335 family is a mixed bag, but there is definately not a single piece of "big block" anywhere to be found. the only similarity i can think of is that the M block has the same deck height as the 385 engines do, this may continue to general specs such as connecting rod length, stroke and piston compression height but that's as far as any similarity goes, general specs.

you're right, buddies wrong.

 

Actually, the dizzy is a direct bolt in

 

If you are not confused already, the 400 is 402 cubic inches.

 

Correct you are and Ford NEVER built a 351ci motor but they did build 4 different 352ci motors: 352 FE, 352W, 352C, 352M. Got into an arguement with a GM nut that just would not do the math for himself and instead wanted to argue that Chevy built a 350ci motor....of course engine math was possibly too complicated for him or he would have known that they only built 349ci motors. BTW, was it Pontiac that built a 350 that was actually something like 354ci?

--J

 

351.8592ci are all of the ford 351's.

 

I have kinda "Modified" my thinking on this neverending discussion. Since ford only made 1 400 cu. in. motor, I dont really give a rip what anyone calls it . My personal opinion is that it is 351M/400. Some have seen references to the "M" and "C" for the 400. From what I read, they were cast at a "Michigan" and "Cleveland" foundry. So if you mention a 400 by any other name, thats O.K. Thats my story and I am stickin to it!!

Actually, the "Ford Racing Catalog" (SVO) printed by Ford---(I think they printed it) refers to the 289/302/351W/351C/351M/400 as "Small" blocks". The 385 series are called "Big" blocks. I dont know how they refered to the FE's. Cube wise, the 332 would be small and the 428 would be big----except same (basically) block.

As long as you call it "Ford", I'll accept whatever---.

What I really care about finding, is someone who has actually put W heads on a 351C/351M/400/400M/small/medium/big block, as is mentioned in the "SVO" catalog. Tim mentioned he had looked into it, but decided too much trouble--TX! The 400 w/CHI heads and intake adapters is a little trouble-----but look at what you wind up with.

Now leave me alone and let me go back to "dreaming" . Sure as hell aint gettin anything else done today--so far!

 

haven't heard of anyone putting windsor heads on a C,or M block but have heard of Cleveland heads of windsor block. windsor heads are 2 brl correct??

 

Factory 'Wheezer' (Windsor) heads are not suitable for use on a Cleveland motor. They suffer severly in the breathing department. There are some decent aftermarket Windsor heads, that would be OK to use on a Cleveland block, but with CHI and AFD, and Edelbrock and other true Cleveland heads available, why would anyone do that unless the W heads were very cheap.