hi group. This is my first post. Longtime reader though. I have a 90 f150 5.8 auto trans with od. What problems would i have with running e85 ethanol? Its a higher octane than gas and some cars came equiped to run on this. I know back in 19 80,81 i used to run a mixture similar in my 77 mustang and had no problems(but that was b4 all this computer and sensers crap). Any ideas? I just had a half tank and filled up the rest of the way with it and it seemed ok except at idle it was a little rough so i switched it over to a full tank of GAS. I though mixing it with a half tank should help minimize any problems and it is 100 or more octane so i thought it could help boost/clean engine,fuel injectors etc. Any help/ideas will be greatly appreciated. Thanks

 

it is higher octane. but dont confuse higher octane with higher in energy. you need to use more alcohol to get the same power output.

 

unless your vehicle is set up for it than it is not recommended to use it.

ford has vehicles that can use it called variable fuel vehicles if i remember right.

 

that is right and even if your car will run on it your mileage and power will go down.

 

thanks guys. I also read (after i put it in my tank) that you actually get WORSE gas milage with it than with gas. Probably bcuz you need more of it to create the same amount of power. Will i be ok to run the tank till its like half full again and fill up with gas? or should i run it almost empty first? or should i drain it all out and NOT run it at all ? thankx.

 

I got the honor of doing a report on E85. To keep it short, you do NOT want to run it in any vehicle that it is not designed to run off of. Properly designed (not a flex-fueled car), you will receive an increase in power and keep the same fuel economy as gas, but that is a completely different story.

 

just keep diluting it with regular gas and you should be OK just dont put it under a heavy lode. it will help to clean out the systome some.

 

Don't use E85 in a vehicle that does not have an E85 compatible fuel system. It will damage the hoses and connections, possibly causing a leak and/or a fire. That's why there are specific E85 fuel vehicles, because the fuel system is designed to handle that type of fuel - not so much the engine.

 

I use e85 all the time in my 95 302 4x4. I put in about 40% e85 and 60% gas. It wakes my old 302 right up. e85 is already 15% gas so its actually like 33% or somthing after i mix it. If I mix it any stronger than 40/60 my check engine light comes on when I accelerate because its fooling the oxygen sensor. The power peaks out anyway it seems at 40/60 ratio. I have 218,000 on my motor and have pulling trailers since 200,000 using e85. I notice nothing in mileage. But for me, I'd rather pay $2.05 for e85 than 2.85 for regular.

 

I'd like to offer some corrections to some of the posts I have read here. E85 has less energy than gasoline, but a higher resistance to auto-ignition (that's all the octane rating is, it's not some magical power adder). Long term E85 use can possibly damage natural rubber, whether it is in the form of o-ring seals or fuel line itself. I have had rubber, stainless steel, mild steel, aluminum, various injector parts, and a piece of carbon fiber soaking in E85 for a few months now, and there is no evidence of any degradation of anything yet. Much of the corrosion problems associated with E85 come from ethanol's hydroscopic nature, and it's actually the water that the fuel has absorbed that leads to a lot of the corrosion.

Stoichiometric ratio for E85 is around 9.7:1, whereas gasoline is around 14.7:1. Where this causes a problem is in the engine computer on these trucks. The computer is commanding a programmed injector pulse width, but on E85, the mixture is quite lean, even at the same 14.7:1 air/fuel ratio. This is the reason for the O2 sensor code; E85 will not "foul" an O2 sensor. The computer is able to adjust a certain percentage based on O2 sensor feedback, but once that percentage is reached, the O2 sensor code is generated because it cannot richen the mixture any more, and the decrease in power you've noticed (alstieg) is likely due to the engine running too lean.

On a side note, O2 sensors do not read actual air/fuel ratio, but actually work on the principle of lambda, which is actual air/fuel ratio over stoichiometric air/fuel ratio. For example, a lambda reading of 1 for gasoline is 14.7:1 while lambda of 1 while burning E85 equates to an air/fuel ratio of 9.7:1. The sensor itself doesn't care what fuel the engine is burning, but simply the amount of oxygen present in the exhaust (it is also influenced by the amount of other molecules too, but the difference is not very substantial). So a ratio of 14.7:1 actual air fuel ratio while burning E85 would give a lambda reading of 1.5, which is very lean. The truck computer then tries to richen the mixture back to lambda of 1, and depending on the limit of adjustment built into the computer, it probably can't adjust more than about 20 or 25% while it needs a 50% enrichment to even get back to stoichiometric ratio, thus throwing the O2 sensor code for rich adaptive limit reached, sensor still lean.

The engine can burn E85 just like it can burn straight gasoline, it's getting enough fuel to the engine where the problem lies on a non-flex fuel vehicle. If you can tune the computer to deliver the required fuel for stoichiometric ratio, power output will be very similar to gasoline, but fuel economy will decrease. To get the fuel economy, the engine needs to have a higher compression ratio which will increase the overall thermal efficiency of the engine. I would be very wary of running E85 in a non-flex fuel vehicle because of the danger of running extremely lean.

Before I get too many "you don't know what you're talking about" replies, I have been tuning a turbocharged 600cc motorcycle engine running on E85 for the past few weeks and researched E85 for several months before that.

 

EPNCSU2006 is entirely correct with what I skimmed through, I just didn't have the dedication to type all of that up .

 

well said Eric all facts and no fiction there. thanks

 

I heard on here that 100 dollars worth of parts will do the conversion. So what do these 100 dollar E85 conversion kits consist of? 100 dollars seems kinda cheap for something that will make these rigs run on ethenol and run properly (cylinder pressure, AF ratio etc).

 

thanks guys for the responses. I am just going to finish burning this tank out and NEVER put e85 in it again. I have been running it today and it runs good,a little miss at idle and i can feel the power loss at speeds but other than that she is running ok. Its not worth the fear of damaging something to save a few bucks at the pumps. Again thanks to all and this forum ROCKS!