Runs rough when cold
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,497
Likes: 7
From: Central, Al
Keep in mind that the engine thinks it is cold any time the engine oil is below 131*F
and ambient temps are below 45*F
This does sound like the problem John7894 and one of our service trucks is having but unfortunately we have not found the issue yet. I have thrown every test i can at it and all pass. Next for me is replacing in injector o-rings even though there are no fluids swapping just to rule that out or hopefully fix it.
Here is John thread it may give you some things to check https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...-for-sale.html
and ambient temps are below 45*F
This does sound like the problem John7894 and one of our service trucks is having but unfortunately we have not found the issue yet. I have thrown every test i can at it and all pass. Next for me is replacing in injector o-rings even though there are no fluids swapping just to rule that out or hopefully fix it.
Here is John thread it may give you some things to check https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...-for-sale.html
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 11,892
Likes: 2
From: Middle Tennessee
Originally Posted by John7894
Alan, What fluids would be swapping if the o-rings were bad? I know I don't have any of that going on since the oil level is always dead on and the coolant still looks nice and green.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 11,892
Likes: 2
From: Middle Tennessee
Well to answer the question, 3 fluids could mix. The injectors have 3 o-rings that seperate the fuel from the HP oil and it is all sealed in the head by the injector cups at the bottom o-ring I think. Any failure gives mixing potential. I don't think you are seeing any symptoms though based on what I have seen. Your situation is a real stumper and I cannot believe it is not solved or at least identified.
Thread Starter
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New User
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11
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The local diesel mechanic here thinks my trucks problem may have something to do with the heating elements on hoses on top of the engine. After replacing all 8 glow plugs and the relay the truck starts easy even when not plugged in. However, it will run very rough until NOT is reached. Doesn't have the power to pull itself forward.
He says maybe getting the 2 other heating parts. Dealer tells me I have to purchase the whole unit, not just the heating pieces. I went to International dealer in town to see if I could purchase just those parts and got sidetracked by them.
One of their mechanics said he thought it might be the fuel pump, then he another mechanic talked and disagreed and the other one said he thought it sounded like a faulty injector. I ended up leaving w/o buying anything.
Any thoughts on what these 2 heating elements could be on top of the engine? Any possiblility these could be the solution? One looks like it goes in where 2 large air hoses come together. The other is a brown plastic piece on the top passenger side of engine, almost in center.
He says maybe getting the 2 other heating parts. Dealer tells me I have to purchase the whole unit, not just the heating pieces. I went to International dealer in town to see if I could purchase just those parts and got sidetracked by them.
One of their mechanics said he thought it might be the fuel pump, then he another mechanic talked and disagreed and the other one said he thought it sounded like a faulty injector. I ended up leaving w/o buying anything.
Any thoughts on what these 2 heating elements could be on top of the engine? Any possiblility these could be the solution? One looks like it goes in where 2 large air hoses come together. The other is a brown plastic piece on the top passenger side of engine, almost in center.
Senior User
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 230
Likes: 0
From: Cheyenne, WY
The "local diesel mechanic" is retarded.
Sorry, but he is. He's talking about the AIH, Air Intake Heater. Screwed into the cold side of the Y pipe. It is there ONLY for emissions. There to keep white smoke down on startup / cold idle.
It honestly sounds like you have a bad injector, or injector O-ring(s) as house mentioned. You need to
1) Find, rent, borrow, steal, or purchas a GOOD, and capable diagnostic piece of equipment. Auto Engenuit will do the trick. ITP diesel sells the Ford bunlde which is exactly what you need.
2) Test the injectors to see what's up with them. I think it has to be somewhat warmed up to do a Cylinder Contribution test, but you could do a buzz test, some data logging, and a cylinder rotational velocity test while cold and then compare when it warms up.
I know this may "sound" like a tough one, but trust me, if you approach it the correct way you can solve it. You will be money, and experience ahead by doing it yourself.
You already see how difficult it is to find a qualified mechanic.
I don't profess to be ANY type of expert, but PM me if you like and I'll help you all I can without BSing you. I also have some pretty diesel-smart friends.
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 230
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From: Cheyenne, WY
Sorry I had a fit of bad spelling and grammar in that last post.
I see ITP is a site sponsor so hopefully I can link you to his site.
Here's Auto engenuity.
http://www.itpdiesel.com/store.php?c...on=show_detail
I see ITP is a site sponsor so hopefully I can link you to his site.
Here's Auto engenuity.
http://www.itpdiesel.com/store.php?c...on=show_detail
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,497
Likes: 7
From: Central, Al
Ditto on Greg
Heres the parameters for the IAH
Intake air heater starting aid system operation.
The system is activated by the PCM when the ambient air temperature is below 0°C (32°F), the engine oil temperature is below 55°C (131°F) and the battery voltage is above 11.7 volts.
The intake air heater will stay on for 30 minutes as long as the engine is idling and the above conditions are met.
The intake air heating system will only activate once per "key on event". If the heater is activated and the vehicle is driven, the heater will not activate if the vehicle is taken back to idle.
The intake air is heated by using a heating element mounted into the compressor manifold.
The intake air heater relay switch, located next to the glow plug relay switch, supplies power to the intake air heater element.
If he thinks this is causing your problem find another mechanic.
Heres the parameters for the IAH
Intake air heater starting aid system operation.
The system is activated by the PCM when the ambient air temperature is below 0°C (32°F), the engine oil temperature is below 55°C (131°F) and the battery voltage is above 11.7 volts.
The intake air heater will stay on for 30 minutes as long as the engine is idling and the above conditions are met.
The intake air heating system will only activate once per "key on event". If the heater is activated and the vehicle is driven, the heater will not activate if the vehicle is taken back to idle.
The intake air is heated by using a heating element mounted into the compressor manifold.
The intake air heater relay switch, located next to the glow plug relay switch, supplies power to the intake air heater element.
If he thinks this is causing your problem find another mechanic.
Thread Starter
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New User
Joined: Dec 2006
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He is a nice guy but I had worried about his knowledge. I believe he was giving it his best (not so good) guess. Anyhow, I will see about getting the remaining injectors and o rings checked and see how it fares from there.
Thanks for the input. I may be in the same boat as John7894 and sell it back to the dealership this summer.
Thanks for the input. I may be in the same boat as John7894 and sell it back to the dealership this summer.
Cargo Master
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,079
Likes: 11
From: LA and CO
Originally Posted by J. Kearney
Just as long as I plug it in.
Sounds EXACTLY like me!!!!!
At what temps do your problems start? Mine starts in the low 50's.....
I'll get it figured out here sooner or later. My next thing is to rotorque all of the rockers and injectors. Kwik did this in a thread he posted and said he noticed a quieter truck after.
My truck is definitely noiser than most. Who knows, maybe the injectors are loose and the cold is really loosening them up??????...........
I also plan to pull the chip out of my truck and drive it to work one day this week. While I'm on the 24 mile bridge to work with the cruise on I'll have my co-worker write down the Predator readings. Then we'll take his stock PSD to work the next day and I'll copy all of the data from his and I'll compare the 2 and go from there...... It's gotta be something simple IMO!
Or, I might see if I can get that Predator to log to my laptop. That would make it easier.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,497
Likes: 7
From: Central, Al
Update on our service truck that is having this issue. Injectors will be pulled and tested next week and all orings replaced. I have checked every system outside of the VC and the UVC ohms out good so we might have something new to check late next week john.