MANUAL tranny swap
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From: Kent WA
MANUAL tranny swap
There have been a lot of threads lately about swapping automatics, so I thought I'd start one to ask a couple of questions about manual trannys.
The 86 F250 4x4 I just bought has a pretty serious growl in the tranny in 1st-3rd gears but not in 4th. From that symptom and what I've read around here I'm thinking that the bushings on the counter-shaft (a.k.a. jack-shaft or lay-shaft) are toast.
Soooooo, I'm looking at either tearing it down and replacing the bushings, swapping in another used T-19, OR attempting to upgrade the tranny.
So, I'm wondering, how hard would it be to install the 5-speed from a 1990 F250 7.3L? Will it mate to my t-case? Or would I have to get the t-case off the donor as well?
Anybody know what the ratios would be in a 5-speed from a 1990? I'm assuming 5th would be an overdrive.....
The 86 F250 4x4 I just bought has a pretty serious growl in the tranny in 1st-3rd gears but not in 4th. From that symptom and what I've read around here I'm thinking that the bushings on the counter-shaft (a.k.a. jack-shaft or lay-shaft) are toast.
Soooooo, I'm looking at either tearing it down and replacing the bushings, swapping in another used T-19, OR attempting to upgrade the tranny.
So, I'm wondering, how hard would it be to install the 5-speed from a 1990 F250 7.3L? Will it mate to my t-case? Or would I have to get the t-case off the donor as well?
Anybody know what the ratios would be in a 5-speed from a 1990? I'm assuming 5th would be an overdrive.....
Last edited by CheaperJeeper; Dec 15, 2006 at 12:23 PM.
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From: Delta B.C.
I swaped a ZF gas in behing my 351W in my bronco... it was an AMAZING upgrade... I have a T19 with 3.55s and 315/75/R16s and still find my self looking for 5th almost every time I drive it...
Your T case will bolt up to the ZF...
The only issue I ran into in my swap was the ZF was 2.5" longer than an AOD... because of my lift this was perfect for the rear as it gave me more spline length in the drive shaft to work with, but caused me to need my front drive shaft to be lengthened...
You will also need to figure out what clutch setup you are going to run....
Your T case will bolt up to the ZF...
The only issue I ran into in my swap was the ZF was 2.5" longer than an AOD... because of my lift this was perfect for the rear as it gave me more spline length in the drive shaft to work with, but caused me to need my front drive shaft to be lengthened...
You will also need to figure out what clutch setup you are going to run....
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From: KY
If you are putting the ZF behind a 6.9. You will have to run a damped 7.3 disk with the 6.9 pressure plate and you will have to build up the fork for the bearing. The ZF has a deeper flywheel housing because of the dual mass flywheel. You have to use a 7.3 disk because the input shaft won't work on a 6.9 disk. The ZF is different then the Borg Warners.
I was told there is a kit to make this conversion now but I would say it is expensive. I think it has the whole 9 yards. Flywheel,clutch,fork ect.
My brother and I put a 6.9 in a later model truck a few years ago and there wasn't a kit then. All we were told is that it wouldn't work. Well it does.
Hope this helps.
I was told there is a kit to make this conversion now but I would say it is expensive. I think it has the whole 9 yards. Flywheel,clutch,fork ect.
My brother and I put a 6.9 in a later model truck a few years ago and there wasn't a kit then. All we were told is that it wouldn't work. Well it does.
Hope this helps.
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From: Kent WA
So if I'm reading/understanding you guys right, I'd have to go to a dual-mass flywheel to do this conversion? If that's the case forget it. Too expensive and I've read about too many issues with them. I suppose the ZF is the only 5-speed that will fit, eh?
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From: KY
No. You use your 6.9 flywheel and pressure plate. You have to use a 7.3 dampened disk because of the ZF input shaft. You will have to do some fork modification to make up for the flywheel housing depth.
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From: Kent WA
Originally Posted by catfish101
No. You use your 6.9 flywheel and pressure plate. You have to use a 7.3 dampened disk because of the ZF input shaft. You will have to do some fork modification to make up for the flywheel housing depth.
Modifying the TOB fork doesn't sound too bad. Anything else?
i ain't rite
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From: Marlboro Mental Hospital.
yea, you can use the ZF 5 speed, and a LUK clutch assembly for the ZF. the LUK setup is around $600 complete. flywheel, disc, pressure plate, throw out bearing, everything you need to take the dm crap and make a boat anchor out of it.
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From: Monroe, WA
Going back to the 4 spd...
It's my guess that you just need an input bearing. That usually makes them noisey in the low gears and quiet in 4th cuz it goes straight down the mainshaft instead of side loading the front bearing going thru the cluster gear. That would be a pretty CHEEP fix in my book.
The only strange part is that you mention 1st and 3rd, what does 2nd do?
It's my guess that you just need an input bearing. That usually makes them noisey in the low gears and quiet in 4th cuz it goes straight down the mainshaft instead of side loading the front bearing going thru the cluster gear. That would be a pretty CHEEP fix in my book.
The only strange part is that you mention 1st and 3rd, what does 2nd do?
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From: Kent WA
Originally Posted by Spectramac
Going back to the 4 spd...
It's my guess that you just need an input bearing. That usually makes them noisey in the low gears and quiet in 4th cuz it goes straight down the mainshaft instead of side loading the front bearing going thru the cluster gear. That would be a pretty CHEEP fix in my book. The only strange part is that you mention 1st and 3rd, what does 2nd do?
It's my guess that you just need an input bearing. That usually makes them noisey in the low gears and quiet in 4th cuz it goes straight down the mainshaft instead of side loading the front bearing going thru the cluster gear. That would be a pretty CHEEP fix in my book.
The only strange part is that you mention 1st and 3rd, what does 2nd do?
When I wrote "1st-3rd" I meant 1st through 3rd (including 2nd), not just 1st & 3rd. So yeah, its noisy in 2nd too - 4th is the only quiet gear right now....
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From: Monroe, WA
Oh, that makes more sense then.
The input bearing is usually the first to go, they spin all the time at engine speed and are the the furthest from the oil. With that turbo'd engine the oil's probably always jammed up in the back of the case anyway.
The input bearing is usually the first to go, they spin all the time at engine speed and are the the furthest from the oil. With that turbo'd engine the oil's probably always jammed up in the back of the case anyway.
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From: South Dakota
Originally Posted by tjc transport
yea, you can use the ZF 5 speed, and a LUK clutch assembly for the ZF. the LUK setup is around $600 complete. flywheel, disc, pressure plate, throw out bearing, everything you need to take the dm crap and make a boat anchor out of it.
i ain't rite
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From: Marlboro Mental Hospital.
the pros of the LUK setup is that it is a much better unit than the DM setup, the flywheel is one piece instead of two, and the complete setup can be bought for less than a DM flywheel alone costs.
and the cons of the swap are the same. the LUK is better, and costs less. so you will never hear a ford dealer make mention of it.
and the cons of the swap are the same. the LUK is better, and costs less. so you will never hear a ford dealer make mention of it.
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From: Kent WA
Originally Posted by Spectramac
Oh, that makes more sense then.
The input bearing is usually the first to go, they spin all the time at engine speed and are the the furthest from the oil. With that turbo'd engine the oil's probably always jammed up in the back of the case anyway.
The input bearing is usually the first to go, they spin all the time at engine speed and are the the furthest from the oil. With that turbo'd engine the oil's probably always jammed up in the back of the case anyway.
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From: South Dakota
Originally Posted by tjc transport
the pros of the LUK setup is that it is a much better unit than the DM setup, the flywheel is one piece instead of two, and the complete setup can be bought for less than a DM flywheel alone costs.
and the cons of the swap are the same. the LUK is better, and costs less. so you will never hear a ford dealer make mention of it.
and the cons of the swap are the same. the LUK is better, and costs less. so you will never hear a ford dealer make mention of it.
-Dave
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From: florida
i replaced my clutch and flywheel completely for 250.00. the clutch that came out of my 91 7.3 was also a one piece flywheel. i bought the entire setup at napa. it was made in china and worked like a charm. my clutch was making noise, it was not slipping. i think the flywheel was not true.