oil analysis not great
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oil analysis not great
I got my oil analysis from blackstone the other day. They are worried about my bearings and rings. high contents of iron, copper and lead. Iron content was 196, with universal average being 17, thats over ten times more than normal. copper is 9, a little over twice than the norm of 4. lead is 35 with the same average of 4. What do you all think? I'm going to change the oil and filters and run 3000 miles, and check it again. I had about 5k on this oil, and theres 83k on the motor now. I think the high iron is the block, not rings. Wouldn't a high Molybdenum content show ring wear? That content was 8, with an average of 17. Anyway, let me know what you all think. I'm having thoughts of pulling and rebuilding the motor with a beefy bottom end anyway. But I don't know yet.
Tim
Tim
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From: La La Land
I wouldn't attempt to second-guess Blackstone. Those guys know their stuff. They have SO much experience with these things.
If they say it's rings and bearings, you've got about a 99 percent chance that's what it will be. Think about it, where else would copper and lead be coming from?
With the mods you have listed, do you wonder why the bottom end has high wear? How much horsepower are you making, anyway?
I always have a high moly count, but I use Delo, and that's why.
What kind of lube bypass filter do you use?
Pop
If they say it's rings and bearings, you've got about a 99 percent chance that's what it will be. Think about it, where else would copper and lead be coming from?
With the mods you have listed, do you wonder why the bottom end has high wear? How much horsepower are you making, anyway?
I always have a high moly count, but I use Delo, and that's why.
What kind of lube bypass filter do you use?
Pop
Last edited by SpringerPop; Dec 10, 2006 at 11:55 AM.
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From: North Idaho
Some oils use moly as a friction modifier and it could me mistaken for exess wear. One way to rule that out is to send new oil in for analysis to keep as a reference as long as you always use the same brand and weight of oil year round.
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oil
I understand the lead and copper. That makes sense. I just didn't understand the ring wear being iron. I figured that would be moly. What do you mean when you said you always get high moly, because you use what? I would be surprised if my mods have been the cause. I have the amsoil kit on it, and have had that since I did the mods, which was about 5000 miles ago. But anway, depending on what the next analysis says, I'm wondering if there is a way to prevent further excess wear, and when will the wear become a real problem?
Tim
Tim
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From: In the Georgia Pines
actually Blackstone labs send out a newletter that sort of discribes the same problem.
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/newsletter.html
have you been using any additives to your oil?
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/newsletter.html
have you been using any additives to your oil?
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This is way i am afraid of getting an oil analysis. If it came back and said that they are concerned about my bearing and rings, i would be so scared to drive it because i would not want it to fail.
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John if you went to the doctor and he scanned and found you had cancer would you want to know? Or would you just prefer to die without ever knowing why or having a chance to maybe treat it before it kills you?
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Dont get me wrong, i am going to get one. Ill be nervous until i get it back though. It like that thing when your at the doctors and they say the test results will be back in a couple days we will call you. I am afraid of the doctor too, but i will still go.
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From: Carhenge
Any more background hiflyer? From your signature I deduce you've had the heads off of it before, what exactly is the history of the engine, miles, and do you have any theories as to why wear metals are so high?
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Other questions which could give clues to the readings are
what wa the fuel percentage in the OA?
what were the nit. and oxidation levels?
What was the silicon level?
what was the TBN, if ran?
what was the time interval?
what are the driving usage habits?
Ring wear should have traces of chromium in the levels as well,
lead is from bearings.
with the mods in the sig, either severe fuel dilution or combination of fuel dilution and high power output may be causing the high wear readings. Do you push this engine to the floor alot?
How long of a warmup do you give it before going to max power output? what is the oil in use?
what is the air filtration?
Molbdenum disulfide is a common EP/AW additive these days in a lot of oils, depends which brand you are using.
Looking further I see you say you have an Amsoil kit on it, and assume this means the bypass.
If you are using the dual Amsoil bypass these have been found that this particular setup can lead to oil flow issues and possible oil starvation issues due to the way the bypass is designed. Many oil analysis on this motor have come back looking like yours using this unit.
what wa the fuel percentage in the OA?
what were the nit. and oxidation levels?
What was the silicon level?
what was the TBN, if ran?
what was the time interval?
what are the driving usage habits?
Ring wear should have traces of chromium in the levels as well,
lead is from bearings.
with the mods in the sig, either severe fuel dilution or combination of fuel dilution and high power output may be causing the high wear readings. Do you push this engine to the floor alot?
How long of a warmup do you give it before going to max power output? what is the oil in use?
what is the air filtration?
Molbdenum disulfide is a common EP/AW additive these days in a lot of oils, depends which brand you are using.
Looking further I see you say you have an Amsoil kit on it, and assume this means the bypass.
If you are using the dual Amsoil bypass these have been found that this particular setup can lead to oil flow issues and possible oil starvation issues due to the way the bypass is designed. Many oil analysis on this motor have come back looking like yours using this unit.
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From: iowa
Originally Posted by dsldrvr
Looking further I see you say you have an Amsoil kit on it, and assume this means the bypass.
If you are using the dual Amsoil bypass these have been found that this particular setup can lead to oil flow issues and possible oil starvation issues due to the way the bypass is designed. Many oil analysis on this motor have come back looking like yours using this unit.
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oil report
Ok, I'll try to answer all the questions. . . first here is all the results:
aluminum-3
chromium-5
iron-196
copper-9
lead-35
tin-3
molybdenum-8
nickel-3
manganese-1
silver-0
titanium-0
potassium-3
boron-2
silicon-11
sodium-4
calcium-3451
magnesium-10
phosphorus-1240
sinc-1434
barium-1
Viscosity was good, flashpoint good, fuel % is .5, no antifreeze, no water and .5% insolubles. I warm it up to the normal range before I even get on it everytime. I let er cool down below 350 degrees everytime i shut down. I hardly ever floor it, but I am on it quite a bit. What is TBN? They wrote" The TBN read 9.5, plenty of active additive left, we did find soot in the oil. i am using Rotella T 5W40 synthetic. There was somewhere around 5k on the oil, and i have a stock airbox with a napa filter, the good filter not the cheap one.
Tim
aluminum-3
chromium-5
iron-196
copper-9
lead-35
tin-3
molybdenum-8
nickel-3
manganese-1
silver-0
titanium-0
potassium-3
boron-2
silicon-11
sodium-4
calcium-3451
magnesium-10
phosphorus-1240
sinc-1434
barium-1
Viscosity was good, flashpoint good, fuel % is .5, no antifreeze, no water and .5% insolubles. I warm it up to the normal range before I even get on it everytime. I let er cool down below 350 degrees everytime i shut down. I hardly ever floor it, but I am on it quite a bit. What is TBN? They wrote" The TBN read 9.5, plenty of active additive left, we did find soot in the oil. i am using Rotella T 5W40 synthetic. There was somewhere around 5k on the oil, and i have a stock airbox with a napa filter, the good filter not the cheap one.
Tim
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From: North Idaho
Originally Posted by Hiflyer746
I understand the lead and copper. That makes sense. I just didn't understand the ring wear being iron. I figured that would be moly. What do you mean when you said you always get high moly, because you use what?
Tim
Tim
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/moly.html
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2005
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From: 21791
Aside from all other things, dude it's time to upgrade the intake. You have a H2E that pulls so much more air than stock, through that small panel filter. Its a wonder that it doesnt just suck the entire airbox in. Considering you have those mods, a 6" exhaust, i dont think you would be annoyed by the sound of a Homemade tymar/6637.