I think I understood that?? All I know when I put dual ram air in my 86, it diffinetly ran better at higher RPMs!! I've got a question for you Professor...I was reading an article on water injection on a [turbo gas engine] as a cheap version of an intercooler...from what I remember it didn't by any means replace an intercooler but it was effective. After reading that informative thread you wrote, what do you think and how benifical would it be on our IDI's?

 

hmm. well what the water does is vaporize and cools the air. not only does it cool the air, but the water vapor acts as a medium just like the nitrogen. as the vapor temperature increases it increases pressure and expands with a greater effect than nitrogen. it then pushes more on the piston. another way to say it: instead of wasting the energy on expanding nitrogen that forces down the piston, the vapor absorbs some of the extra heat energy and assists the nitrogen in pushing down the piston.

i'm almost positive your exhaust temperature would go way way down. you should see an increase in power. remember this is theoretical. some military aircraft had water injection and/or alcohol injection to provide the extra power needed to takeoff on short runways. the reason they dont carry water while flying is because it would weigh too much. remember water is free. maybe you could rig up a system. i was told it also cleans your engine of the carbon build up.

so yes, theoretically it would work. make sure not to put too much water in that will cause a hydraulic lock and bend your rods or will put out your fuel/air mixture. do everything in proportion. I also believe it will give better mileage because of decreased engine temperatures...but hmmm, our engines need the heat for combustion...hmmm.

only experiments will really answer your question, but i think it water injection would be a good idea.

hope this helps,

jeremy

 

Thank you 2New2Fords, you knew exactly what I was asking. I am also thinking of another idea for an intake. This one is a little complicated so I'll just sleep on it for tonight. A snorkel might not be a bad idea...might look kinda wierd tho. I will look into some more intake ideas and see what I come up with...

-Dave

 

What I'd REALLY like to do is a functional hood scoop. Afraid that might look kinda strange on a plain vanilla 2WD pickup tho....

 

Now...the idea I had was about that down-curve at the very front of the Ford hood. I was thinking that maybe it could have slots cut into it and have the intake piped to that point. Kinda like a firebird hood...


I don't know exact measurments but I think you could at least get a 2-3" tall slot as wide as you want.... Only problem I could see is the intake piece hitting the top of the radiator. I believe that is why the hood has that curve in it in the first place is radiator clearance. But you could do the slots at the edges of the hood with dual intakes. IMO that would be better than hacking up the radiator supports... Just an idea but tell me what you guys think. If I can get some time I will draw up a diagram based on the Ford hood.

-Dave

 

Basically combine twin versions of this.....


....and make holes in the front angled panel of the hood, right?

That's something I was considering too - dunno if there are reinforcements in that part of the hood - or whether they can or can't be cut without seriously weekening the hood. But I like the idea....

 

the only problem is that you would have massave bugs in your setup. then rain would drain stright into your scoop. you would have to have a water/dirt seperator that would cause the air to go through a sharp curve. the water and dirt would be too heavy to make the curve and would get flung out. the reason the stock ford intake was designed behind the headlight was so the bugs wouldn't go directly into the ducting and ultimately the filter. once you get past this problem, i'm with you all the way!

 

If you guys like my intake set up check out my gallery for more picures. The main airflow comes from the grill area, a deflector scoop catches the bug guts and rain hits it, gravity takes over drains water out the bottom, but airflow goes behind the light, top of grill housing(plastic) is cut out, and fiberglass scoop is baffled to keep all the ram air for the engine. The system works much like an aircraft inlet ice/rain deflector on a turbine engine. I've measured the back of the fiberglass air scoop at 2" of positve pressure with a manometer @ 50 mph.

I worked on big radial engines 20 years ago with water/methonal injection systems. The system was to control detonation due to using gasoline at extreme boost presure, like 59" of manifold pressure. On a diesel, I would think all it would do would help cool the combustion chamber if you have a high temp due to over fueling without enough air flow.

 

I see what you guys are saying. That setup would suck the outside elements directly to the engine. I do believe KJLYPW has the right idea as far as intake. Although I would like to see what that chevy intake does for performance on the diesel...

 

Actually the water injection systems on the market can run methanol or water.

Both are sprayed in at high pressure so the drops in the spray are very fine.

The main benefit is the water evaporates before it gets to the combustion chamber.
But as it is evaporating it is absorbing heat, which in turn gives you a denser air charge in the cylinder, Cool air is much better than hot air to make power.

All the stuff about the heat helping to vaporize the fuel is only a kinda thing on a gasser, has no benefit at all on a diesel.

Cool air and lots of it, also you need a good way for it to get out of the engine after it is burnt.

 

Dave, I'm seriously thinking of installing a water/methanol system on my IDI...I seem to be running high EGT, replaced the pyro thought the first one might be faulty but same reading with the second? But I'm wondering after reading the thread about where does the oil go, my high EGT might be excessive oil in the cyclinders??

 

bc6.9 take your air cleaner off and start the truck. you will see inside a bunch of crankcase oil go into the intake. maybe that's your problem. someone said oil had more BTU's than diesel. if you are getting too much oil in with teh diesel, you may be running hotter because of it.

 

2New, thanks for imput, I think it was Dave S that said oil has higher BTU than diesel, I'll check that out.

 

Here's a little reading for you guys thinking about adding some ram air.
http://www.karlsnet.com/mopar/ramair.shtml

 

bc6.9,
Your truck is NA isn't it?
Most of the water injection systems use either EGT sensors or boost sensors to control the water flow. Most have EGT sensors that kick in a second stage when EGT raises to high after the first stage is activated by a preset boost level.

Where I see a potential problem running a water injection system on a NA motor is dropping to idle after pulling a big hill. The EGT may be high enough that the water injection would still be on while the engine was running at idle. That may create more problems than it cures. I would do some serious research before I attempted something along those lines.

Heavier oils contain more BTU's per gallon than the lighter ones.
This also depends on getting the proper amount of air for proper combustion.
Heavier oils need more air to release the stored energy.

I also have to comment on the statement that the oxygen is not burnt as fuel.
This is true, but the oxygen is consumed.
It is combined with the carbon, nitrogen and hydrogen molecules during combustion. Burning of the fuel is also oxidising the fuel. If you add more oxygen, you can also add more fuel and release more power.