Got a problem I think. Here's the deal.

Took the F250 out last weekend for the first time towing an 8000 lb travel trailer. In "Tow/Haul" mode. On flat to moderate inclines she did great. Good passing ability and cruised real nice. Got to the Grapevine (a steep 3-4 mile grade in So Cal) and she started to slow, naturally. But once I got up a mile or so I was just short of full throttle and 2800 rpm to keep it at 60 mph. If I slowed down to 50 it took a lot to get it back to 60 again. My 03 Expedition w/ a 5.4 did better than this. You can hear the tranny down shift and the rpm's go up slightly but it just wouldn't move in relation to the noise and strain it seemed to be under. After about another mile of this when I would downshift the truck started making another noise that is best described as a fan. Once the tranny shifted again the second noise would go away. Normally I get 16-17 mph combined when not towing. I got 9.3 mpg on this first leg. On the way home I tried it without the "tow/Haul". Seemed to behave a little better; gas mileage went up to 14.5 mpg but it still made that second noise occasionally. Tranny seems to be working real hard for very little result.

This is my first diesel and i got it to tow this trailer but I not very happy with this first performance. 8000 is only half its towing capacity; I can't imagine what towing 16000 would produce. I just need some adivce as what to do next. Is this a tranny issue, engine, is it normal, should I be looking into performance mods or the dealer for warrranty repair.

Thanks for any help.
Miles

 

The "other noise" is the cooling fan and is normal. The fan on these things is huge, and these trucks have a computer-controlled fan clutch. The fan is pretty good, so the computer only lets the fan clutch rev it up when there's a need to really get some cooling done.

I only use Tow-Haul on grades or if the transmission starts to hunt. It's always done fine for me the rest of the time and you get better fuel economy without it.

I've not had mine out in that part of the country. Maybe some SoCal owners can chime in on that one. I grew up around trucks with a lot less power, so I'm not a great judge of what good performance with a trailelr is. I'll tell you that I can hold it at just over 45 going into the Mountains outside of Flagstaff with 10-12,000 worth of trailer and junk in the bed.

 

Something sure does not sound correct; I run at 24K and have no problems with power.
The noise you hear is all correct.
MPG for me at 75 up hills down no matter what...is average at 11.2 to 12.9
See my gallery for trailer and the frontal size, which does make a difference.

 

I've pulled that same hill with 7000# trailer, no problem. I leave tow/haul on when ever i'm towing. and I get about 12 MPG towing.

 

What year is the truck? Problem is we cannot diagnose your truck here on a forum. I would schedule a service visit to your dealer; here are a few suggestions to your loss of power that can be checked.

Fuel
Air in the fuel
Filters- Air & Fuel
Oil Level
Correct API Rated Engine Oil
HP oil pump quick connect fitting
Low boost pressure
Check intake system for leaks
Confirm brakes are not dragging

You mentioned a high altitude / grade towing problem. You could have a torque converter clutch operation concern or Barometric Pressure Sensor concern. The barometric pressure sensor (BARO) is a variable capacitor sensor that creates a signal indicating atmospheric pressure. This allows the PCM to compensate for altitude. The PCM uses this information to calculate injection timing.

 

Thanks everyone. I feel a little better since it doesn't seem to be a major issue.

I will take it to the dealer before the next tow just to be on the safe side.

Maxium: its an 06 with 12k miles.

Miles

 

Did you look at the boost gauge? Sounds like you're not getting proper boost from the turbo. I've pulled the Grapevine 5 times this year towing my 12K toy hauler. My PSD will take it up at 60 to 65 southbound and 65 northbound without planting the throttle. Mine makes 28 PSI boost on those hills.

 

I agree with Kepler4.. sounds like the turbos not kicking in properly..

 

Kepler/Electro
It was up over 20. I was going southbound doing 60 at 2800 rpm and probably 80% throttle. But it was tapped. If i floored it at that point it wouldn't do anything but make noise (fan?). Coming back home and out of tow/haul it seemed faster but like you pointed out that could be due to a slightly less of a grade northbound.

Thanks

 

I can pull from 50 to 60 up a hill here at 7-8K altitude pretty quickly. I keep it in T/H all the time, mostly because I need the help coming down. I just get into the pedal a little and get a lot of response. My boost is right around 20 or a little over. I also have TC and I'm not sure if it change boost or reponse yet, but it might.

 

Woodys06- I have the same kind of deal with my 05. It seems llike there is not much power while towing. I also discovered from my dealership that the tranny wont downshift while coming up a hill if the boost is past 20psi. They said that it was normal and designed to do that. I'll be taking mine in for some regular service in the next few days and see if they come up with anything and report back to ya.

 

I have towed grapvine with my 7K TT but only to Gorman, not beyond. I had no problems doing 65. I pull Cajon Pass regularly and it does take 80% + throttle to maintain ~62-66 on the steep part. Stomping on the pedal does seem to make more heat and the fan kick on more which dosent seem worth it, the fan seems to suck some noteable hp. I use tow/haul up and down grades and not for the most part of 395 unless hunting.

That being said, my 5.4 F150 Screw had much more trouble pulling a 4.5K trailer up the same grade.

 

Woodys'06: I have an '05 with 22k miles that was reflashed by Ford during their recall. The truck was a dog after that reflash. A few months back I pulled my 4.5K, 25' TT from Long Island to Elysberg, PA, about 220 miles, and I experienced loss of power, turbo noise, check engine light on, oil leak, etc. After returning I scheduled a "Fix my Truck, again please" at the dealer. They tightened the clamps on the intake tubes; no more oil leak, they replaced the EGR valve, they said it was coked, and cleaned the EGR cooling tube, they replaced the BackPressure Sensor (BPS) as well. Just got back from another trip to Elysberg pulling my TT and it was like a totally different truck: quick acel, powerful on hills, no turbo growel. I had to resist trying to keep up with trucks on IS 80, they doing 80 mph me being prudent at 65; the TT manual cautions not to exceed 65. I can also hear the tubo spool up a lot sooner and turbo boost can climb near 30 now where before 20 was a maximum. I guess you need a trip back to the dealer

 

I pull over the grapvine with a 4500 lb trailer twice a month in the summer. Before that we used my buddies 5.4l to do it. Southbound, he would gun it on the approach and 90% of the time got caught and would bog down to 45-50 mph with little chance of regaining speed. He would go easy otherwise it starts to hunt for gears and heat up.

I have done it twice with my 06 since I bought it. Both times was able to easily keep 65 mph. First time got caught right at the start in the turns and slowed down to 50, passed em and got back up to 65 and still had pedal left. Yes the fan was blowing hard, it's supposed to. Similar results the second time during that climb. I could probably get up to 70-75 if I pushed it. That hill is tricky southbound. If you lose your momentum early it takes alot to get it back especially through the first steep tight turns.

I used tow/haul on the hill, seemed to be fine. I try to use my foot a bit to prevent gear searching and will let it slow down after a downshift and wait a bit to upshift. I have a hard time thinking that your 5.4 could be that close in power, I have driven both and it's somewhat night and day on the pass. K80 might be right on with his post. If your turbo is not getting up to ~28lbs you are missing some boost that will be the difference on that hill. you may need to have the turbo, valves, and sensors inspected. I would take it into the dealer and talk to them about it. You MPG seems alright to me. I get 12 towing 4500 lbs with that pass in the way from both sides.

 

Thanks everyone lots of good info and reassurance.

Flux
That's what happened. Southbound and got pinched off on a semi by some knucklehead so I had to slow down to about 50 and it took a while to get back up to 60+.

2005 Ford
Let me know what the dealer says. I'm curious.

I use the truck daily to commute into LA (over the vine) and I have had no issues under no load. Even posted my best tank of gas today at 18.87 mpg.

Given this and all the responses I think I will hold off on the dealer for now as they are a pain in the #$% to deal with. Side note never buy from Jim Burke Ford unless you're a masichist. I'm going to do a test tow up the vine and pay closer attention to exactly what's going on and try a few of the suggestions.

I'll let you know how it turns out.