Head Gaskets and Smog Test
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Head Gaskets and Smog Test
I have a 1991 4.0 4Wd Aero, My question is what effect will a (very slight) head gasket leak have on a smog test.
I have had outstanding clean results in prior years, I'm not sure it will change at all but I don't want to throw my money away either.
I have had outstanding clean results in prior years, I'm not sure it will change at all but I don't want to throw my money away either.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,720
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From: Washington state
do you have antifreeze in the cooling system, ethylene glycol?
is the coolant leaking into the combustion chamber and going out the exhaust?
if so, kills the cat. converter and O2 sensor very quickly....silica and other chemicals contamination
what are your leakage symptoms?
is the coolant leaking into the combustion chamber and going out the exhaust?
if so, kills the cat. converter and O2 sensor very quickly....silica and other chemicals contamination
what are your leakage symptoms?
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The only signs are bubble in the cooling system, not a lot.
When driven around 10 miles the overflow is filled and leaking from the vent, No vapors out the exhaust and it still runs like a champ. I know it got real hot when my wife was driving it and the Block heater fell out, she got off the freeway after about a mile
.
When driven around 10 miles the overflow is filled and leaking from the vent, No vapors out the exhaust and it still runs like a champ. I know it got real hot when my wife was driving it and the Block heater fell out, she got off the freeway after about a mile
.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,720
Likes: 5
From: Washington state
only guarentee is that the small leak will get larger and head gasket can blow out any time
low cost temp. fix short mileage ....go to GM Chebby dealer and get some of their Sealer Tabs or your local parts store and get Bars Leak Gold powder.....DO NOT use any other stop leak product
these 2 will plug the leak if it can be stopped and do NO harm in the process
$10
high cost fix.....
engine pull and rebuild
block tanked and magnafluxed for heat cracks and block head surfaces planed for flatness and warpage
2 rebuild heads with new valves and new rocker arms
16 new roller lifters and cam, always new with new cam/lifters
rebuild parts
or rebuilt long block
shop labor
$3,000 installed
$1,000 your labor DIY if block is good add $300 for new block
if you are going to keep the van?
change the tranny fluid completely NOW
ATF cooked, will ruin tranny quickly
search forum for complete 10 qt. gentle filter change, flush and new ATF
low cost temp. fix short mileage ....go to GM Chebby dealer and get some of their Sealer Tabs or your local parts store and get Bars Leak Gold powder.....DO NOT use any other stop leak product
these 2 will plug the leak if it can be stopped and do NO harm in the process
$10
high cost fix.....
engine pull and rebuild
block tanked and magnafluxed for heat cracks and block head surfaces planed for flatness and warpage
2 rebuild heads with new valves and new rocker arms
16 new roller lifters and cam, always new with new cam/lifters
rebuild parts
or rebuilt long block
shop labor
$3,000 installed
$1,000 your labor DIY if block is good add $300 for new block
if you are going to keep the van?
change the tranny fluid completely NOW
ATF cooked, will ruin tranny quickly
search forum for complete 10 qt. gentle filter change, flush and new ATF
Last edited by 96_4wdr; Sep 10, 2006 at 07:42 AM.
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I don't have the time or money to do a major O/H and for that matter it's not worth the time or trouble.
I just hate to see a reletively nice vehicle go to the bone yard for pennies.
My main concern is passing the Ca Smog test, what would change with a slight H/G leak? Registration is due...
I just hate to see a reletively nice vehicle go to the bone yard for pennies.
My main concern is passing the Ca Smog test, what would change with a slight H/G leak? Registration is due...
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7,015
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From: SoCal
It would be hard to get the engine to normal running temperature with a leak like that. IF the engine is running cold, the emissions will be high. If all you're interested in now is to pass smog, you might try one of the temp fixes that 96 suggested. However, the stop-leaks that you dump into the radiator will usually only work if it's where the coolant is leaking out. But in your case, you are getting combustion pressure from the cylinders, which, even if the sealant goop manages to get into the leak, will be quickly blown out. I do not believe the goops will work in this situation.
It seems like a cheaper long term solution than to rebuld your engine is to buy a used engine from a salvage yard. There are guys on this forum who have yanked the engine out the front of the van; they can give step by step instructions on what you need to do.
It seems like a cheaper long term solution than to rebuld your engine is to buy a used engine from a salvage yard. There are guys on this forum who have yanked the engine out the front of the van; they can give step by step instructions on what you need to do.
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Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 5,242
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From: Kiev, Ukraine
Matt.... Was your engine rebuilt? If yes, may be it was not torqued well.... Try to retorque cyl. heads before and try to pass test again, but it is difficult to do it on aero. You have to carefully remove air intake, remove intake manyfold and retorque cyl. heads, but don hurry to assembly all the engine, remove stark plugs and check gaskets with compressed air, if everething is ok, drive and enjoy, not ok - so replace gaskets, but use new cyl. head bolts bolts....
To be sure remove spark plugs and look at them carefully... You will see what cylinder antefreeze comes in...
96 4wdr is right, as ususally, this leakedge kills the cat. converter and O2 sensor very quickly, but it is just the begining, more then 30 gramm of antifreeze may damadge pistol and rod...
To be sure remove spark plugs and look at them carefully... You will see what cylinder antefreeze comes in...
96 4wdr is right, as ususally, this leakedge kills the cat. converter and O2 sensor very quickly, but it is just the begining, more then 30 gramm of antifreeze may damadge pistol and rod...
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The Engine has a lot of miles on it (200K+) and runs great. the headgasket will get worse but for now it needs a smog check. I will non-op it until I can dig into the engine, I can't do it right now - had shoulder surgery.
Thanks for suggestions
Thanks for suggestions
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,818
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I'm not sure about California, but Colorado's emissions testing permits a free repeat test if you fail on the first pass through and have to do adjustments, modifications, etc. If your state is set up similarly, you could try the Sealer Tabs on the second go round if the first pass is unsuccessful.
Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 5,242
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From: Kiev, Ukraine
Matt! Have a good health!
Aerocolorado! Here I easily pass emission test if I have not too much antifreeze ore water in exhaust.... Water is not concidered to be harmfull.... And this test is valid for one year here, so I have to pay for repeat test if I did any ajustment ore modifications...
BTW... My test results: CO - OK, NOx- OK, CH - OK (new spark plugs), but noise is near limits (old muffler), and policeman tells me every year, that my catalistic slowly goes out and I have to replace it next year... And he tells me every year that I will not pass emission test next year, catalistic converter will be out of norma next year, but lust 3 years it still ok..... It is original, made in 1988!
Aerocolorado! Here I easily pass emission test if I have not too much antifreeze ore water in exhaust.... Water is not concidered to be harmfull.... And this test is valid for one year here, so I have to pay for repeat test if I did any ajustment ore modifications...
BTW... My test results: CO - OK, NOx- OK, CH - OK (new spark plugs), but noise is near limits (old muffler), and policeman tells me every year, that my catalistic slowly goes out and I have to replace it next year... And he tells me every year that I will not pass emission test next year, catalistic converter will be out of norma next year, but lust 3 years it still ok..... It is original, made in 1988!
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Thanks Pablo, I didn't think of that (water instead of Coolant).
It make sense and I will do it tomorrow.
If there is no coolant getting into the exhaust I'll still be better off with water instead of coolant. What about Water Wetter? will that harm the Cat or 02s??
It make sense and I will do it tomorrow.
If there is no coolant getting into the exhaust I'll still be better off with water instead of coolant. What about Water Wetter? will that harm the Cat or 02s??
Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 5,242
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From: Kiev, Ukraine
Theoreticaly no, becouse water is always in exaust... But coolant kills cat and 02 sensor. Look, how your problem may progress... Now coolant leak is not so serious, but a bit later exhaust gas will come to radiator, ant it may blow up! Yes! I sow it (topaz '93), but it is not the most expensive result.... water may come into cylinder, and when both the valves will be closed and piston will move up, hydro-impact may broke rod and piston... and it may damadge krankshaft.
Former ******
Joined: Nov 2004
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From: Salt Lake City, Utah
I would seriously doubt you can get enough compression on the affected cylinder(s) to pass emissions. You can try it if you want. Sorry to hear about your shoulder, hope you heal up well. But for any reasonable length of time, this problem will either need to be fixed, or the vehicle sold to either a wrecking yard or someone who is willing to fix it. If the body and interior are in good shape it would be a shame to scrap it.
Pablo, catalytic converters are designed to las tthe lifetime of the vehicle, so as long as it is not damaged, it will continue to function year after year.
Pablo, catalytic converters are designed to las tthe lifetime of the vehicle, so as long as it is not damaged, it will continue to function year after year.
Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 5,242
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From: Kiev, Ukraine
There are many refinery plunts, that use ferrum adds to gas, and this gas is goos for cars w/o catalistic converter (Euro-II emission standard), but in case of use this gas every day it slowly kills converter.... 100-150 K and you need a new converter!