How many
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How many
Hello,
I have another question. It regaurds a 1948 ford F-1
I was told that there were only a small number of early production trucks that had the incorrect model engine in them (V8). Mine came stock with a 1947 V8 Flathead. I was told that in mid year they changed over to what became the standard 48-51 block.
My question is how many of the 1948 trucks came with the old block. Is this rare? I have had a number of F-1er argue with me when I explain this freak motor.
Is there any truth to the fact that Mercury, aviation, and tractor style blocks were commonly used in the early 48's as they were cleaning out the old line of flatheads?
I have another question. It regaurds a 1948 ford F-1
I was told that there were only a small number of early production trucks that had the incorrect model engine in them (V8). Mine came stock with a 1947 V8 Flathead. I was told that in mid year they changed over to what became the standard 48-51 block.
My question is how many of the 1948 trucks came with the old block. Is this rare? I have had a number of F-1er argue with me when I explain this freak motor.
Is there any truth to the fact that Mercury, aviation, and tractor style blocks were commonly used in the early 48's as they were cleaning out the old line of flatheads?
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 16,867
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From: SE Wisc. (the Rust Belt)
AZT,
Welcome to the forum. I don't have your answer but I am sure someone will come along soon with an answer.
My main reason to reply to your post is to encourage you to make a gallery. We want to see your truck, especially if it's a panel. I have a '48 panel that I bought without an engine so I can't help with any first hand knowlegde. I also have a '49 panel I just bought. That one also didn't come with an engine. I bought a complete chassis for the '48 which I have swapped under the '49. I don't know what I am going to do with the '48 now, maybe rod it out, I have an extra flattie I could stuff into with a T-5 behind it.
Welcome to the forum. I don't have your answer but I am sure someone will come along soon with an answer.
My main reason to reply to your post is to encourage you to make a gallery. We want to see your truck, especially if it's a panel. I have a '48 panel that I bought without an engine so I can't help with any first hand knowlegde. I also have a '49 panel I just bought. That one also didn't come with an engine. I bought a complete chassis for the '48 which I have swapped under the '49. I don't know what I am going to do with the '48 now, maybe rod it out, I have an extra flattie I could stuff into with a T-5 behind it.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 7,493
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From: Erie, pa
AZT
I don't know just when the engine change over was completed. What I have always heard was that "Some of the early 1948 Ford Trucks had the 59A style engines from the Factory".
Most likely, Henery cleaned out the running gear wharehouse, before the "Standard" 48 model came down the line.
I'm surprised by how many Old Gearheads don't know that the 8BA/RT block actually started in 48.
I don't know just when the engine change over was completed. What I have always heard was that "Some of the early 1948 Ford Trucks had the 59A style engines from the Factory".
Most likely, Henery cleaned out the running gear wharehouse, before the "Standard" 48 model came down the line.
I'm surprised by how many Old Gearheads don't know that the 8BA/RT block actually started in 48.
Lead Driver
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,765
Likes: 547
From: Kalispell, MT
Hi AZT, welcome! I've heard the early 48 used the 47 parts until the F series debuted. Engines and sheetmetal.
I'd love to see pictures of your truck and I'm sure Carl will too.
I'll ask for him - what is your vin #? Does it follow the older pattern or the new one?
899C-12345 or 88RC-12345 respectively.
Is your sheetmetal the new model (beginning 1/16/48) or does it look like the 42-47's?
To be honest I've not seen a date when the 8RT engines began, but figure they began pretty close to the new truck date.
Dick is right, the old gearheads that don't know about the engine are all car guys. They can't imagine the trucks got anything first
I'd love to see pictures of your truck and I'm sure Carl will too.
I'll ask for him - what is your vin #? Does it follow the older pattern or the new one?
899C-12345 or 88RC-12345 respectively.
Is your sheetmetal the new model (beginning 1/16/48) or does it look like the 42-47's?
To be honest I've not seen a date when the 8RT engines began, but figure they began pretty close to the new truck date.
Dick is right, the old gearheads that don't know about the engine are all car guys. They can't imagine the trucks got anything first
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Originally Posted by mtflat
Hi AZT, welcome! I've heard the early 48 used the 47 parts until the F series debuted. Engines and sheetmetal.
I'd love to see pictures of your truck and I'm sure Carl will too.
I'll ask for him - what is your vin #? Does it follow the older pattern or the new one?
899C-12345 or 88RC-12345 respectively.
Is your sheetmetal the new model (beginning 1/16/48) or does it look like the 42-47's?
To be honest I've not seen a date when the 8RT engines began, but figure they began pretty close to the new truck date.
Dick is right, the old gearheads that don't know about the engine are all car guys. They can't imagine the trucks got anything first
I'd love to see pictures of your truck and I'm sure Carl will too.
I'll ask for him - what is your vin #? Does it follow the older pattern or the new one?
899C-12345 or 88RC-12345 respectively.
Is your sheetmetal the new model (beginning 1/16/48) or does it look like the 42-47's?
To be honest I've not seen a date when the 8RT engines began, but figure they began pretty close to the new truck date.
Dick is right, the old gearheads that don't know about the engine are all car guys. They can't imagine the trucks got anything first
The truck has 88RC-12345 Style vin. Was this old or new??
Did the numbers start at 88RC00001 ?
What was the differance between the sheet metal styles?
The truck look like a 48 f-1, not a 47-older.
I do not have any shots of it right now. I am working to get the orignal motor restored and the truck has a later merc flathead in it now!! I wanted a fun motor and the orignal motor will be restored stock and kept as a show piece. I plan to use this truck as a low mileage daily driver.
Thanks for your help. If I am able to get some shots I will!
Lead Driver
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,765
Likes: 547
From: Kalispell, MT
The 88RC prefix was the new vin. The serial numbers started at 101 according to the 'old ford truck club'.
If it looks like the F1's it was produced after Jan 16, 48.
If it had a 59 series engine originally, you should be able to find the vin stamped on the bellhousing above the access hole. If not, there's always the possibility it had an earlier engine swapped in. A lot could have happened in the past 58 years.
If it looks like the F1's it was produced after Jan 16, 48.
If it had a 59 series engine originally, you should be able to find the vin stamped on the bellhousing above the access hole. If not, there's always the possibility it had an earlier engine swapped in. A lot could have happened in the past 58 years.
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Yes it has the orignal engine when I got it. The numbers matched up. So I am sure this was the oringal block. It was driven little in its years and only had one overhall. Which was within the last 15 years.
I wanted to ask another question.
Were the number based on total Ford production or plant production?
I wanted to ask another question.
Were the number based on total Ford production or plant production?
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Lead Driver
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,765
Likes: 547
From: Kalispell, MT
Original engine: so your vin is stamped on the transmission bell housing? I'd love to see that just out of curiosity because of it's uniqueness.
Production numbers were based on total Ford production. Carl has been compiling vin stats here (sticky at the top of the forum page) and we've come to the opinion that Ford assigned blocks of serial numbers to each plant. If you haven't already done so, please enter your vin info there.
Production numbers were based on total Ford production. Carl has been compiling vin stats here (sticky at the top of the forum page) and we've come to the opinion that Ford assigned blocks of serial numbers to each plant. If you haven't already done so, please enter your vin info there.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,858
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From: Friendswood, Texas
Or enter it here.
Can we have your VIN #. Yours would be of particular interest because of it's uniqueness. Pictures would be great also, expecially of the VIn #'s on the VIn Tag's Frame and especially on the bellhousing.
Carl
Can we have your VIN #. Yours would be of particular interest because of it's uniqueness. Pictures would be great also, expecially of the VIn #'s on the VIn Tag's Frame and especially on the bellhousing.
Carl
Last edited by texan2004; Sep 4, 2006 at 09:12 PM.
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I am a little confused but this may be because I do not have it right infront of me. Some are saying that the number for the motor is on the bellhousing.
I maybe wrong as I am not looking at it, but I remember having the number on the top of the block next to the intake manifold and a letter casting on the bell housing only. Is this right??
This motor was an early motor with the crab dist. and the center spout heads. Also it had a 3 speed on the floor. For what ever that is worth.
Also is there anyone that knows how many of these FREAK MOTOR F-1's were produced. I would also like to know how many 88RC's there were. For those of you that like to have homework.
I maybe wrong as I am not looking at it, but I remember having the number on the top of the block next to the intake manifold and a letter casting on the bell housing only. Is this right??
This motor was an early motor with the crab dist. and the center spout heads. Also it had a 3 speed on the floor. For what ever that is worth.
Also is there anyone that knows how many of these FREAK MOTOR F-1's were produced. I would also like to know how many 88RC's there were. For those of you that like to have homework.
Cargo Master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,858
Likes: 3
From: Friendswood, Texas
[QUOTE=AZT]I am a little confused but this may be because I do not have it right infront of me. Some are saying that the number for the motor is on the bellhousing. Being confused is OK. Most everyone else is on this board also. If you have the old style engine, the bellhousing is cast into the block and the VIN # is supposed to be stamped into the top of the bellhousing.
I maybe wrong as I am not looking at it, but I remember having the number on the top of the block next to the intake manifold and a letter casting on the bell housing only. Is this right?? The 8BA's and 8RT's and I suppose the later EAB engines had a date code stamped onto the block where you are suggesting. This was not a VIn # or ser. #. I don't know if they did this on the earlier engines or not. In any case it would only be a date code and not a ser. # at the top of the block next to the intake.
This motor was an early motor with the crab dist. and the center spout heads. Also it had a 3 speed on the floor. For what ever that is worth.
Also is there anyone that knows how many of these FREAK MOTOR F-1's were produced. Damned few, if any. Tht's why we VIN # goobs are so interested in your truck. We've heard of this being the case but we've never seen one. Until you showed up here I thought they were just an urban myth. We would really like to get you VIN # so that we can ascertain how early your truck is.
I would also like to know how many 88RC's there were. For those of you that like to have homework. Nobody really knows for certain. The 87HC #'s stopped somewhere close to 167,000. The 88RC's stopped somewherejust beyond 132,000. They did not run a seperate set of sequence #'s for each engine. My guess is that 167,000/2 = 83,500 +/- 88RC's maybe a few thousand more.
Remember, Ford only expected 50K miles or so from these engines and the 8BA/8RT's had a real problem with cracked blocks, especially in warmer climates. While we have plenty of good sheetmetal around here, it's nearly imposible to find a flathead down in Houston or anywhere south of I-20 in these warmer climates that isn't cracked. Meanwhile the guys up north have all the engines and no good sheetmetal. Some swear that these cracks in the blocks had Ford part #'s assigned to them.
It is not unreasonable to expect that somebody overheated the original engine and replaced it with an older style flathead. It would have been a very straightforward replacement only requiring new radiator hoses and the tranny form the replacement engine. Not saying this is what happened, but I've seen 51's with older style engines, so I know that folks did this.
Again, it would be abig help to get photos and the VIN #. Also, take a look on the firewall in the engine compartment and see if you can find any #'s stamped into the sheetmetal (not the VIN TAG). These #'s contain paint codes, Assembly Plant, and build date information. The assembly plant may also be found on one of your BIN TAG's. Some had them on the VIN TAGs and some did not. Also, some had the firewall stampings and some did not. It was not done on many of the 48's and seems to have been a late 48 or 1949 model year practice.
We sure would appreciate any information you can provide.
Thanks,
Carl
I maybe wrong as I am not looking at it, but I remember having the number on the top of the block next to the intake manifold and a letter casting on the bell housing only. Is this right?? The 8BA's and 8RT's and I suppose the later EAB engines had a date code stamped onto the block where you are suggesting. This was not a VIn # or ser. #. I don't know if they did this on the earlier engines or not. In any case it would only be a date code and not a ser. # at the top of the block next to the intake.
This motor was an early motor with the crab dist. and the center spout heads. Also it had a 3 speed on the floor. For what ever that is worth.
Also is there anyone that knows how many of these FREAK MOTOR F-1's were produced. Damned few, if any. Tht's why we VIN # goobs are so interested in your truck. We've heard of this being the case but we've never seen one. Until you showed up here I thought they were just an urban myth. We would really like to get you VIN # so that we can ascertain how early your truck is.
I would also like to know how many 88RC's there were. For those of you that like to have homework. Nobody really knows for certain. The 87HC #'s stopped somewhere close to 167,000. The 88RC's stopped somewherejust beyond 132,000. They did not run a seperate set of sequence #'s for each engine. My guess is that 167,000/2 = 83,500 +/- 88RC's maybe a few thousand more.
Remember, Ford only expected 50K miles or so from these engines and the 8BA/8RT's had a real problem with cracked blocks, especially in warmer climates. While we have plenty of good sheetmetal around here, it's nearly imposible to find a flathead down in Houston or anywhere south of I-20 in these warmer climates that isn't cracked. Meanwhile the guys up north have all the engines and no good sheetmetal. Some swear that these cracks in the blocks had Ford part #'s assigned to them.
It is not unreasonable to expect that somebody overheated the original engine and replaced it with an older style flathead. It would have been a very straightforward replacement only requiring new radiator hoses and the tranny form the replacement engine. Not saying this is what happened, but I've seen 51's with older style engines, so I know that folks did this.
Again, it would be abig help to get photos and the VIN #. Also, take a look on the firewall in the engine compartment and see if you can find any #'s stamped into the sheetmetal (not the VIN TAG). These #'s contain paint codes, Assembly Plant, and build date information. The assembly plant may also be found on one of your BIN TAG's. Some had them on the VIN TAGs and some did not. Also, some had the firewall stampings and some did not. It was not done on many of the 48's and seems to have been a late 48 or 1949 model year practice.
We sure would appreciate any information you can provide.
Thanks,
Carl
Lead Driver
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 6,765
Likes: 547
From: Kalispell, MT
Originally Posted by AZT
I am a little confused but this may be because I do not have it right infront of me. Some are saying that the number for the motor is on the bellhousing.
I maybe wrong as I am not looking at it, but I remember having the number on the top of the block next to the intake manifold and a letter casting on the bell housing only. Is this right??
This motor was an early motor with the crab dist. and the center spout heads. Also it had a 3 speed on the floor. For what ever that is worth.
Also is there anyone that knows how many of these FREAK MOTOR F-1's were produced. I would also like to know how many 88RC's there were. For those of you that like to have homework.
I maybe wrong as I am not looking at it, but I remember having the number on the top of the block next to the intake manifold and a letter casting on the bell housing only. Is this right??
This motor was an early motor with the crab dist. and the center spout heads. Also it had a 3 speed on the floor. For what ever that is worth.
Also is there anyone that knows how many of these FREAK MOTOR F-1's were produced. I would also like to know how many 88RC's there were. For those of you that like to have homework.
Therefore vehicles that used the 59 series engines (45-48) should have the vin on the transmission half of the bell housing - stamped in by the inspection cover. Reasoning was that engines would be replaced frequently and if the vin was on the engine, DMV records around the country would be all screwed up.
So if it is an early engine F1, look at the transmission where it bolts to the half bell of the block. I'm not saying it will be there, but it should be. As Carl said, we're all learning about these together. Thanks for hanging in there.
Tim
