I was givin a 78 er 79 F150, with what I was told was a cleveland motor. I know that the clevelands didn't come in this year truck, but wanted to know if indeed it was a Cleaveland or not. I thought I heard before that the 351M and Cs have different number valve cover bolts. Is that true? The valve covers have 8 bolts.

Thanks for any info.

Mike

 

351m/400 will have 8 valve cover bolts, it most likely isn't a Cleveland anyways in that truck. Also the label on front of the valve color will tell ya if it is an M or a 400 (if it is there) If that isnt there we could get into some other numbers and nail it down pretty quick as long as things are clean. You won't find too many Clevelands in full size pickups, although I know it has been done. You can also look at the top of the timing cover and see if it looks like it is nearly the same level as the bottom of the intake manifold. If it is close to being flush then it is a 351C, if the base of the intake manifold is about 3/4" above the timing cover it is a 351M/400.

 

Well Mike,
If you are in Australia or New Zealand, it could be a 302C or a 351C but I'd bet you're in North America. So, if the truck is original and has not been tampered with too much, then it is most likely a 351M. The last post should give you a good idea what to look for to identify the motor.

 

OK, thanks for the replies and info. I'll check again. The label is still there on the valve cover, but all it said was 351. It didn't say C or M. I was thinking it was probably a M motor too, just thought I might get lucky. Hell, if it's a M, it'll be a good spare motor for my 69 4x4 camper special that has a 400 in er.

Thanks again
Mike

 

Are you talking about the label on the side of the valve cover? Or is there one on the front? You have a 400 in your 69?

 

Yes, the label on the side/top of the driver's side valve cover. Pretty close to brake booster.

Yes, when I bought my 69 F250 4x4 camper special 4spd. 3.73 D60 posi rear it had a 400 in it. I realize it proabably came with either 360 er 390, but someone stuck a 400 it in. I only paid $500 for this truck about 6,7 years ago and love the crap out of it. I've always been an FE man, but I am pretty impressed with the 400 in this truck. It's basically my wood hauler and play toy on the farm. She revs higher than my FEs and sounds good.

Mike

 

Yeah, those FE's were pretty common back then. 400 is a good low-end torque engine though, and wont weigh in like an FE will. So there is some trade off. Thats pretty cool.

 

If it has a 2v or a 4v on the drivers side front upper corner of the head, its a C. If it doesnt, than its a 351m or 400m.

 

Not neccesarily true, some of the 400s expecially the early ones had the 2 on the heads just like the cleveland, remember the 351M/400 head is for all intents and purposes the same as the 351c 2v head.

What do you mean won't weigh in like a FE, why is it that all the 400 fans keep bragging about light weight, they are not that light, the 390 is approx 40lbs heaver at most, and I hear the weight issue as a reason to not run a 460 instead of a 400, well the truth is a 400 weighs 575 bare, a 460 weighs 720 according to the listings but that is with ALL ACCERORIES actual weight on a complete 460 is under 650 more like 630 by my weighing up all the parts and pieces, I did the swap one time from a 400 to a 460, and weighed the truck the empty weight before and after was 20lbs different. for reference a 400 is almost physically the same size as a 460, the deck hieght on a 400 is 10.297, a 460 is 10.300 big difference there.

As to the original question, rchewitt50 has it right, look at the thermostat housing for the hieght in comparison to the intake manifold, cleveland equals same hieght 351M/400 intake sits higher. valve cover bolt count will not help you on this because they use the same heads and valve covers.

 

ok, i see, ive never seen a 400 or 351m with the 2v, but i suppose they could have come if they were early enough.

 

actually it goes both ways, I had a 74 montego with the original 351c 2v in it, and it didn't have the 2 cast into the heads, I also had a 79 F150 with what I am 99.5% sure was the original untouched 400 in it, one because the the paint on the valve cover bolts didn't have any wrench marks on them even though some had flaked off, secondly because when we tore it down it had from what I could tell the original ford gaskets, and lastly because the farmer I bought it from was the original owner, and he stated that the engine had never been touched not even a water pump or even bothered to do a tune up with new plugs or wires, which is why he thought it was missing, well one head had the 2 cast into it, the other didn't.
The numbers cast into the corners seems to be a crap shoot, I have even heard but never verified myself that some of the 4V heads didn't have the 4 cast into it, and last even though I am real sure it's very rare as in maybe only one ever, I actually saw pictures of a 4V head (verified by the exhaust port shape amoung other things plus becuase of the engine it was attached to) that had a 2 cast into the corner, like I said probably very, very rare and just a mistake when they put the mold together but wierder things have happened at Ford.

 

Swapping 351m to 429 in a 77 added 120 lbs. in my book on the scale.

 

This thread was not about 460's, 429's or even FE stuff. The guy has a 351m. Have fun with that!

 

Does this help any? I found it on the valve cover sticker....

D9TE-9C485-_____

I can't deciphere the rest. There's a photo in my gallery if any of you want to take a stabn at it. I'm not familiar enough with the number as most of you probably are.

Thanks,
Mike

 

Well assuming it's the original valve cover, and it's actually a 351, then you do know for a fact it's not a cleveland as they quit producing them in the US in 1974, and that number would indicate 1979 (D equals 1970s, and the 9 equals 79, the T indicates Ford truck, and the E means engine part.), you can have casting numbers for earlier years than what your looking at, IE my transmission is a 77 but the park pawl part casting number is C6 something indicating 1966 but those numbers do NOT mean it was made then just revised that year.