I'm trying really hard, but when the subject of oil prices comes up, the line has sort of been crossed already and I bite.....sorry mang...

 

Yes... although I'm a newbie to this forum. Take it easy on me
BTW... I'm no hot shot, I'm a workin' slob that don't like the high cost of gas more than anyone else. Especially with ~60 mile commute each day.

The reason diesel is now more expensive than gas is because most of the developing countries (China, India, & Africa) are using more diesel than gas vehicles. Same reason that steel prices shot through the roof not so long ago.

What many folks don't understand about these proposed boycotts, companies trade product. So even though one company might not get any sales at 'their' stations in a given day... others stations will be selling 'their' product. Usually only the premium grades are differentiated.

If you look at snopes.com it will give you a brief summary about why this type of plan wouldn't work.

The only way to make an impact is to NOT BUY ANY FUEL!! The only problem is that between delivering goods to market and daily commerce there are plenty of people willing to buy (it's a commodity) it.

I personally don't believe the prices will stay at this level for a prolonged time (but the days of $1.50/gal are gone).

The scary thing is we all get upset when we see close to $3/gal for gas... yet in most convienience stores bottle water sells at over $5/gal and no body bats an eye (bottled water is about $1.20/bottle around here).

If supply rates for crude are increased (middle east produces more or other sources are tapped) it will help some... also more refinerys are needed. For years the margins on gas were not that great. So companies closed many aging refineries that needed $$$ to meet environmental requirements, retooling, etc.

Know it's probably not the news ya wanted to hear but, it's the most accurate view I could give ya.

Respectfully,
Automatic

 

automatic your correct boycotting one company or another means first you would have to totally research all the corporate connections and every station that buys gas from that particular company, plus every supply line to make sure that company wasn't selling fuel into a conglomerate tht in turns sells fuel on an open market system-what I am saying is they are all tied into each other, and you can't truly boycott one oil company, it's physically not possible so the only solution is not buying any gas at all thus my suggestion of staying home on a holiday weekend which is the big time to sell gas (note this is not diesel so much for big rigs delivering products thats another discussion) but not buying or even burning gas during a peak weekend, and thus not contributing to tourism you will put a hurt on things, will it shut them down? No. Can they make it up? Yes. but it will cause enough damage overall that someone will have to make changes in order to stay in business.
Another thing is EPA mandating rules, this is a fancy name for making Laws which is illegal since they are not elected nor do they represent anyone, and there is no means by which we can recall them or repeal the "laws" that they pass so most of hte really bad laws in this country are passed by people that have zero accountability to the american public, yet do the most damage to the US economy (please note, this is different then enviromental issues cause there are many, many depts that do this such as NTSA, DEA, EPA, ESA, HUD, etc, etc)

 

With the current demand (this includes overseas) you would have to get more people than you think to buy into the proposed boycott for it to even make a blip on their radar.

As I mentioned before... I don't like these prices but, we in the US have the cheapest gas world wide (that means everyone else pays MORE than we do) and yet the demand in other countries is growing. As a nation we're not going to get any sympathy from others regarding what we pay for gas. So, it would be very hard to get buy-in from those folks.

I agree with your assessment of the EPA's mandates. IMO.. they have in the past chosen to ignore things like the Small Business Regulatory Enforcement Fairness Act of 1996 as well as others, in their policy making. An agency that is basically allowed to run unchecked in their discretionary rule making. The EPA was formed with the best of intentions... however they can no longer justify their huge budgets and staffing if they don't have newer and more stringent codes to enforce. (emission controls for weed wackers & leaf blowers, etc). Therefore we pay for it with increased prices at the pump and when purchasing new products.

Respectfully,
Automatic

 

It will never work, any of this face it. Say, hypothetically there was a boycott, and the price of fuel went down say 30 cents. people would start driving more, so the costs would just come right back up. People want cheaper fuel, so then they can drive more, and it starts the loop all over again.

I agree something needs to happen, I dont have an answer as to what, but no one has spoken of lowering the almost 50 cent tax on fuel either have they??? Greed comes from every direction. All we can do is cut back, and make fewer trips. Will it ever lower??? Back in the 70's-80's people didnt think so, but it happened. It may never go back to 99 cents, but im sure after we are out of the middle east, and China/India's growth has slowed down, that prices will ease.

Media....there is a 10 per gallon increase. I read an article from a refinery in Texas, and the spokeswoman said daily she recieves calls from the major networks asking info. They give it out, and the media starts the wave. Problem is I hear today that there is a fuel shortage scare...yet that was the same reason they gave to get it to 55 per barrel. If it was really a shortage scare....it would be daily news, everyday. Not just every couple weeks when they need a new reason.

 

Yes I do work for an oil company. I make a damn good living too! I work at a refinery and I can't fill my truck up for free. I get to see hundreds of thousands of barrel of fuel made everyday and they don't give me any.

The point I'm making as well as others is boycotting won't do anything. You would have to find other means of transportaion to really drop the prices. It would take millions of people to do this before you would see a difference in price. Boycotting one oil company wouldn't work, because that oil company will sell their product to another company, the one you didn't boycott. The world uses a certain amount of oil each day, and right now we can't refine enough oil to keep the price down. If you want to complain, talk to the EPA. They're the ones that are keeping the prices up. The last grass roots refinery built in the US was in 1977, I think. (Marathon Refinery in Garyville, La.) Since then no company has built another refinery to raise oil production capacity because the EPA won't allow it.
There is talk of a company granted permits for a new refinery in AZ, but the rumor is that there isn't enough investors to finance the construction.

Oh, btw, I expect Diesel prices to go up in 06 because every refinery in the US HAS to have thier Ultra Low Sulphur Diesel units on line by the end of 06. If they didn't build the new unit they won't be able to sell diesel to the public, only to another refinery that has a ULSD unit.

 

Making your own is the best and only boycott that will work. Likely in some sort of clandestine co-op.

My plan is to brew my own .. get the wife a Benz turbo diesel .. roll my F350 Diesel and trade our V10 Gasser excursion in on a diesel excursion.

My folks will readily get their next veh as a diesel, and I have several friends and biz owners that are diesel converts and apostles [thank you Edge, Diablo and Banks :-) ]

With 6 people collecting WVO, and a $3500 investment split 6 ways, and 80 gal of production capacity per day ... it'll work. 3 of the 6 units will be trucks with storage and collection capacity.

At $3 p/gal here in So Cal, the frustration combined with the costs make biodiesel very attractive

 

Folks, see my follow-on thread: Fuel Boycott: SECOND VERSE
posted today, 8/12 at 8:18 am.
Warren

 

3 of 7 has it right on the only way to go at this without alternative fuel is to boycott one company. but you need to go back to refinery supply for example down here the arco refinery supplies fuel to arco, bp, thrifty, most of the independants, flying j, and theres a couple others. i only buy fuel at shell but thats cause thats where the fuel card my company supplies me with comes from....the grim end is moderation in fuel use lower the demand to come closer to the supply is the only way to make fuel prices come down. our recent rear end rawing experience in so cal with diesel is the meltdown at the chevron refinery in longbeach which shut down 2 of there towers.
the boycotting of one particular company will help bring them back in check, and hopefully others will follow to be competitve with them. the oil companies posting record profits every quarter makes you wonder dosnt it??

the problem with the new no sulfer fuel (which arco and shell have been running for a couple years now) cost more to make due to the lubricity additives that have to be added to the fuel because removing the sulfer also removes some of the lubricity properties of diesel. sulfer itself is not a lubricant.

 

The really funny thing about the mandated low sulfar fuel is that it's totally based on bogus science. First thing to consider is that Mt St. Helens spewed more sulfar dioxide (the supposed greenhouse gas that is produced by burning high sulfar diesel) in one day (May, 18th 1980) than all the diesel trucks burning high sulfar fuel in the US in the entire decade of the 70s, yet another example of EPA not having a clue what they are talking about, or mandating stuff that will have virtually no effect whats so ever but rather will destroy the United States which is the goal of many of these people that are pushing most of the stuff (read thier comments on enviromental damage. "it's all caused by evil capitalism, and the American way of life" yet not one of them gets rid of the hummer they drive to the protests)
Also all the high sulfar diesel that is produced by US companies is sold to Japan, and China which then burn it in thier trucks at a reduced cost, so if it really is a global warming issue then burning it anywhere on the planet will have basically the same effect since it's a global problem and only has the effect we are seeing now, and that is to destroy the US, and doesn't do a thing for the enviroment.

 

One of the problems is so many people converting to diesel rigs that we will never have a surplus of that stuff and winter home heating oil takes all of the extra just when things are starting to slow down.
You have to change your driving habits to fight back. Walk when you can, ride a bicycle or motorcycle a few days a week or maybe buy an econo job for the long commute. If we all cut our fuel usage somehow even though the price is up we still save $.

 

The only way you can get the attention about the EPA is for the American people to do something that woul affect(disrupt) the economy. You know follow the $. When the economy suffers the it gets fat cats of all types concerned and they will put presure on the EPA to get their head on straight.