Speed Density to what?????
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Speed Density to what?????
OK, I am running a plain jane except for exhaust mods 92 Bronco XLT w/ 302 and E4OD. I am having all the usual annoyances that come with 200K+ miles and am seriously thinking about scrapping the drivetrain and going with a Mass Air Flow setup and different transmission (prefer automatic). I am getting a 302 and transmission (not sure what kind) from an acquaintance for $25 and will either rebuild and modify it or trade it as a core for something else.
This is a daily driver and normally has three kids riding in the back seat so I do not need to lift it or go extreme on it, I just want good performance and fewer problems.
Suggestions please.......
Thanks, Tom
This is a daily driver and normally has three kids riding in the back seat so I do not need to lift it or go extreme on it, I just want good performance and fewer problems.
Suggestions please.......
Thanks, Tom
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,285
Likes: 12
From: Bend,OR
keep the speed density system and go with a 5.8 swap. its no more involved then droping in a 302. your gonna spend some coin getting that motor rebuilt anyway. whats wrong with the current setup, mass air isnt going to change much for you other then extreme expense because you have the E4OD tranny. get the codes read so we can help get you going. also read here www.fordfuelinjection.com
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Current Codes----
Khemical,
Current codes are: 654-Transmission selector not in PARK, 327, 328, 337-EGR feedback signal is/was low, EGR Valve Position (EVP) is/was low, EGR feedback signal is/was was high, and 452-Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) problem
Symptoms- intermittent- dies at stops, when starting the idle goes all over the place, idle calms when put into gear, going into reverse is like dropping your front into a ditch (jerky), check engine light comes on while driving (hence the codes) and you can make it go away by stomping on the gas a little
As far as the 5.8 swap goes- isn't the 92 5.8 non-EEC controlled? What is involved?
Tom
Current codes are: 654-Transmission selector not in PARK, 327, 328, 337-EGR feedback signal is/was low, EGR Valve Position (EVP) is/was low, EGR feedback signal is/was was high, and 452-Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) problem
Symptoms- intermittent- dies at stops, when starting the idle goes all over the place, idle calms when put into gear, going into reverse is like dropping your front into a ditch (jerky), check engine light comes on while driving (hence the codes) and you can make it go away by stomping on the gas a little
As far as the 5.8 swap goes- isn't the 92 5.8 non-EEC controlled? What is involved?
Tom
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,285
Likes: 12
From: Bend,OR
ok here it goes. have you replace the sensor on top of egr or the egr itself? the vss is located in your tcase so locate that and remove/clean and reconnect that. your selector deal might be related to the MLPsolenoid it controls shifting pulses of the tranny. might also take off your IAC valve clean it, also replace the TPS that will fix your idle issue. i also suggest a tune up with autolite copper plugs,cap/rotor, new plug wires and fuel filter change. also check the timing with spout connector removed it should be at 10*btdc.
the 92 5.8 is eec controlled. the first efi 5.8 was in 88-89 but was mated to a c6 then in 90 is when the E4OD came about which is electric controlled by the same eec just like your 302 now. so finding a wrecking yard complete 5.8 and dropping it in place of your 302, use your 302 engine harness and get an ecu from a 92 5.8/e4od combo and your set. i did this exactly as i explained to you but i have the AOD so there was a little more work involved. but i got a better motor , get better mpg then my 302 ever did and more grunt as well when i need it.
the 92 5.8 is eec controlled. the first efi 5.8 was in 88-89 but was mated to a c6 then in 90 is when the E4OD came about which is electric controlled by the same eec just like your 302 now. so finding a wrecking yard complete 5.8 and dropping it in place of your 302, use your 302 engine harness and get an ecu from a 92 5.8/e4od combo and your set. i did this exactly as i explained to you but i have the AOD so there was a little more work involved. but i got a better motor , get better mpg then my 302 ever did and more grunt as well when i need it.
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Checked Yesterday
Kemical,
Sorry I forgot to finish my previous reply- I meant to include what I checked yesterday. IAC checked and cleaned. EVP sensor- checked- good voltage. TPS voltage good. MAP voltage good.
Tranny was rebuilt two years ago, they probably did not set MLPS properly. Or I could have bumped it on the beach (oops!).
I did notice that these problems returned when I had to put a catalytic converter back on after moving to where I did not know the inspector. They put on a cheesie 2" generic cat right in the middle of my 3" pipe going to my flowmaster with dual outs.
Is it possible that all of this is being caused by back pressure from a crappy cat?
On the 5.8, I am assuming it is a Windsor and not a 351M. Will a 351M work (had one as a teenager in an 82 Bronco).
Tom
Sorry I forgot to finish my previous reply- I meant to include what I checked yesterday. IAC checked and cleaned. EVP sensor- checked- good voltage. TPS voltage good. MAP voltage good.
Tranny was rebuilt two years ago, they probably did not set MLPS properly. Or I could have bumped it on the beach (oops!).
I did notice that these problems returned when I had to put a catalytic converter back on after moving to where I did not know the inspector. They put on a cheesie 2" generic cat right in the middle of my 3" pipe going to my flowmaster with dual outs.
Is it possible that all of this is being caused by back pressure from a crappy cat?
On the 5.8, I am assuming it is a Windsor and not a 351M. Will a 351M work (had one as a teenager in an 82 Bronco).
Tom
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,285
Likes: 12
From: Bend,OR
no the M would not work and frankly is a pig of a motor. so yes its the 351w.
i doubt the cat is causing this unless its clogged already. best way to check that is to unbolt the Y pipe from the exhaust manifolds or unbolt the exhaust infront of the cat. when was this tuned up last, some times the simple answers are the correct ones. also disconnect your batter over night. then reconnect and drive so it relearns then recheck codes. also ive seen sensor be with in tolerances but still cause issue during actual driving which of course cant be tested going down the road you know
i doubt the cat is causing this unless its clogged already. best way to check that is to unbolt the Y pipe from the exhaust manifolds or unbolt the exhaust infront of the cat. when was this tuned up last, some times the simple answers are the correct ones. also disconnect your batter over night. then reconnect and drive so it relearns then recheck codes. also ive seen sensor be with in tolerances but still cause issue during actual driving which of course cant be tested going down the road you know
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Tune up
Been about 45K miles since tuned. Should I do cap, rotor, plugs, what else? Will do the battery thing tonight. As far as parts, what have you had the best luck with?
Last time I tried to check that TPS while driving, almost lost a few digits. That's why those belts say to stop motor before servicing, right.....
Tom
Last time I tried to check that TPS while driving, almost lost a few digits. That's why those belts say to stop motor before servicing, right.....
Tom
Trending Topics
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,285
Likes: 12
From: Bend,OR
lol, thats right. i to get an egr code but its not affecting my driving and shouldnt. thats why im thinking a tune would be a good starting point for you. I would get some good ford 9mm wires as well to complete the tune up and also check your timing. you might also do a compression test being the high mileage of that motor this to could cause some drive ability issues.
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
10 Things Every Truck Owner NEEDS (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
Rezvani's Latest Post-Apocalyptic Monster Is a Ford F-150 Raptor Underneath
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Most Expensive Ford Trucks Ever Sold on Bring a Trailer
Joe Kucinski
2027 Ford Super Duty Buyer's Guide (Every Model, Engine, & Package)
Brett Foote
Top 10 Ford Truck Tragedies
Joe Kucinski
AEV FXL Super Duty - the Super Duty Raptor Ford Doesn't Make
Brett Foote
Lobo Vs Lobo: Proof the F-150 Lobo Should Be Even Lower!
Michael S. Palmer
Ford's 2001 Explorer Sportsman Concept Looks For a New Home
Verdad Gallardo
10 Best Ford Truck Engines We Miss the Most!
Joe Kucinski
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
PCV Valve?
I will do this part too. On a side note, is there an option to et rid of that crankcase breather hose and small filter with a filter that just plugs right onto the valve covers? If so, I should probably replace the breather filter while at it (mine disintegrated).
As a bandaid until I rebuild this motor, since I do have a leak on the back of the engine and am losing coolant on a regular basis (think it is from the intake manifold)m do I just use Autozone or O'reilly parts?
Tom
As a bandaid until I rebuild this motor, since I do have a leak on the back of the engine and am losing coolant on a regular basis (think it is from the intake manifold)m do I just use Autozone or O'reilly parts?
Tom
Junior User
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
From: China Spring, TX (Waco)
Tom,
Ditch the 302 and go for the 351. I had a couple of coolant leaks on my '94 van that has 207K miles on it. One was between the block and timing chain cover and the other was the intake manifold. I found that the gaskets as about as pliable as ceramic. You probably have the same issue not only for the coolant leaks but possible air (vacuum leaks) as well which could contribute to the erratic idle etc. As for speed density, the 351 in my '94 van seems quicker and gets 15.5mpg as compared to my 351 mass air setup in my '96 bronco (also about 15.5mpg) but the van weighs about 1000lbs more. Both are E4OD's with 3.55 gears. The tranny went out in the van @ 155k miles and I had Ford put in a factory remanufactured replacement with a 36K/36 month warranty. Got 207k on it now and it shifts and runs perfect.
Save your 302 and put it in a Ranger. Giddy-up.
Ditch the 302 and go for the 351. I had a couple of coolant leaks on my '94 van that has 207K miles on it. One was between the block and timing chain cover and the other was the intake manifold. I found that the gaskets as about as pliable as ceramic. You probably have the same issue not only for the coolant leaks but possible air (vacuum leaks) as well which could contribute to the erratic idle etc. As for speed density, the 351 in my '94 van seems quicker and gets 15.5mpg as compared to my 351 mass air setup in my '96 bronco (also about 15.5mpg) but the van weighs about 1000lbs more. Both are E4OD's with 3.55 gears. The tranny went out in the van @ 155k miles and I had Ford put in a factory remanufactured replacement with a 36K/36 month warranty. Got 207k on it now and it shifts and runs perfect.
Save your 302 and put it in a Ranger. Giddy-up.
Thread Starter
|
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
302 swap to 351....... sounds appealing
OK Guys, that is probably the way I will go. What is involved?
I can probably get a 351 and computer off of an acquaintance that owns a junk yard.
I also have an 88 Ranger with a 2.9L 6-cyl. It has NO power and I would like to switch that engine out.
Let me know what I need to find to change out the motor on the Bronco and I will start that shopping list.
Tom
I can probably get a 351 and computer off of an acquaintance that owns a junk yard.
I also have an 88 Ranger with a 2.9L 6-cyl. It has NO power and I would like to switch that engine out.
Let me know what I need to find to change out the motor on the Bronco and I will start that shopping list.
Tom
Hotshot
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 14,285
Likes: 12
From: Bend,OR
find any 5.8 complete from oilpan to upper intake from 90-93 out of bronco/f150/f250. especially if its mated to an e4od tranny already this way you get the correct flexplate. other then that its pretty much drop in, hook up your 302 harness change ecu and your done