I recently brought my 90 EB 351 in to a shop who I recently started dealing with after I wasn't very happy with my previous mechanic. I was leaking coolant......it appeared to be comming from the block....which it was. They called me and told me the manifold gaskets should be replaced, and i had them do the valve cover gaskets naturally while it was appart. They called me this morning and this is what they said. "We finished the job and took it for a test drive....don't worry we have insurance for this"... I thought to myself...hmmm, must have got in an accident right? "The oil pressure guage dropped and the motor started rapping really bad" he says. They're explanation is at this point, they think that when they cleaned out the sludge in the rocker assemblies, that something must have fallen into the sump and plugged the check valve...... The guys said he was up all night and sick to his stomach about it...which I can understand, I work on small engines myself. They are going to have the insurance take care of it. Now I called the engine rebuilder in my area, who they deal with and my father has dealt with in the past....whom is the best around from word of mouth. His feeling is that the insurance is not going to pay to have a motor with 120k on it completely redone, reguardless of how well it was maintained(which was almost too often!!). He felt they would pay to fix "the problem". My ideas are that #1, There is no way I'm going to let them put a used motor in there, requardless of the number of miles on it. It is used and I have no idea the internal condition and how it was maintained. #2 If the problem is currently in my motot, that it spun a bearing because of lack of oil....that is the problem now but what else could be damaged ???? I feel that even with the motor being 10 years old, with 120k on it, It was running when it went it, I've never had any problems with it and they knew it was ok cause they drove it a few weeks ago when they worked on it. The people at the garage thus far have been very coopertive......they took reponsiblitly for it right off the bat....which I was impressed by. Most people I gather would say well it has 120k and it could have happened anytime, it's not our fault it happened when we had it. What does everyone think is the best way to go about it. At this point i'm hoping to settle this without involving my lawyer, but the fact is I am without a truck for what I'm guessing is a month, the truck was running fine untill this, and from talking to the engine shop, the insurance is gonna make every effort to screw me. What are you're thought.

 

It seems to me that since the shop immediately admitted the problem (which IS impressive, I must say), they should repair/replace whatever the problem is, whether or not their insurance pays for it. If nothing else, have the insurance pay for what they will, then the shop should cover the difference for whatever else needs to be done, new rebuild, or whatever. I think they should also provide you with a rental car (or drive you everywhere!). It could get tricky if lawyers get involved, and the shop decides that they DIDN'T admit the problem!

Godd luck with it!
Chuck

 

I think you're jumping to conclusions. Why get angry at the insurance company when they have yet to turn it down?

 

Depending on the damage to your engine , I dont think you will be w/o a truck for a month . Any competant mechanic can have you back in it within a day or two . Sounds like the owners of the shop are trying to do right by you . Ive seen insurance pay for bent rods and holes in the block from people that go pond diving in Toyotas . There is one thing about what you wrote that I wonder about ...If your engine was taken good care of , Where did all the sludge come from that clogged the pickup screen ? Im not implying anything , just seems strange to me . Good luck with it .
Paul

 

Don't go paranoid. Let the mechanic explain what they feel is the fix and don't expect to get a new engine when yours has 120K and a lot of sludge (probably time for a rebuild anyway). Be opened minded and expect what is fair and reasonable if you were on the other side of the engine!!

Also, if you took the truck in for a coolant leak, you're not going to fix that by changing gaskets unless it is a head gasket. Did they correct the original problem?

'82 F150 w/351W (orig 300 I6)
Slik

 

the build up under the valve covers.....not in the sump itself......the mechanic claims that he think somethng might have passed through and clogged the check valve which cropped the pressure. I bought the vehicle a year ago with 116k....alot of it was highway miles. The truck is clean a whisle and as mint as a 90' can get. I have it serviced once in the spring and once in the fall.....like I do with all my vehicles....

 

1st of all, I work on small engines and power equipment, so i am on the other side of the engine....i've had to eat a couple as lunch myself. The truck never skipped a beat and the reason why I brought it in for repair is to prevent further problems like overheating. The truck was running fine went it went in, now it has a blown motor.....I expect nothing less than the motor rebuilt....if it lost lubrication because of something they did......I am not responsible for the problem......whether or not there was 20k or 120k.....they messed up....they are responsible. What is fair is that my vehicle is returned to me they way i sent it in, minus the leak. I have been without a vehicle for a week, and expect to be for another 2 at least. I dont' expect a complete new engine, but if it lost oil pressure and lubrication, I expect nothing less that a rebuild of the top and bottom ends.....or a long block at best. If sure if you were in my shoes.....you would agree.

 

dude, your lucky they even offered to fix the problem, and they admitted it, i understand your mad, but just settle down a bit before these people change their mind and wont fix anything at all

 

Well, it does make a big difference whether it has 20k or 120k, just read the blue book values; I agree that they need to get you running at the least convenience, but I wouldn't expect a complete rebuild. I would expect that they would do a partial rebuild and fix the spun bearing, but I wouldn't expect that they would give me a ring job or valve job, but maybe work with you on a great discount to get a complete rebuild. But, it's whatever works out that is fair between the two of you. Just keep your mind open and don't get greedy. Many a mechanic would have put it back together and put STP or some other gunk in it or do a minimal repair job knowing that it would completely break down in a few thousand miles. Others would have just said that it gave out while they were testing it, so cut the guy some slack and expect to meet him half way.

'82 F150 w/351W (orig 300 I6)
Slik

 

I was just rereading all the post made to this . After I read what Steve wrote , it all just fell into place . Bottom line , engine goes in for what I gather is leaking head gaskets ... Sludge that has gathered in the valve cover area ... I know we have all seen the sludge mountains under the valve covers ... to me , that says very few oil changes .Im looking at this not only from an owner but also the guy doing the service work . I honestly think this repair should be split between the owner and the shop ... 50/50 ...and thats being very generous . To me , this is like a smoker asking why all the arteries are clogged . Regardless of why the engine got starved of oil , it was because of neglect . Ive seen 40K mile engines so caked with sludge and carbon its a wonder they even started . My Advice ... Take whatever you can get , Smile , and say thank you . I may seem harsh , but this is my opinion and I think its is based on some experience . I hope you get your truck running the same as it was before .
Paul

 

I don't want to get in a flame war, but that isn't what you said when you started. But, it makes more sense now that you've explained it more succinctly. Although it brings up a lot of questions, such as why were they changing the intake gasket when you brought it in for a coolant leak? And was the oil change an added item? Don't need to drop the oil to work on the top side. Now if he drove it for some distance with no oil, I would still say most of the damage is in the bottom end, but you are correct that you could possibly have top end damage also. I didn't read where anyone was blaming you for not servicing the vehicle. We understood that you bought the vehicle used, but if it's got sludge, it wasn't always maintained as meticulously as you. Oh, a couple of observations about the mechanic...it sounds as though he wants to do the right thing, but it also sounds like he is a little incompetent...and very expensive if he's charging 5-600 to change intake and valve cover gaskets.

By the by, I really do apologize for giving you the wrong impression, I just see too many people "slipping on a banana peel" to get rich quick. Once again the key is to come to an equitable solution between you and the mechanic, only you can determine what is fair. I really don't know what I would expect, but I get concerned with insurance companies, and I think there may be a possibility of them trying to "total" your vehicle and letting you buy it back real cheap, I've seen it done before (now I'm getting paranoid). I hope you recover your ride and everything works out for the best. It's a real bummer when bad things happen to good people and good vehicles.

'82 F150 w/351W (orig 300 I6)
Slik

 

i appologize as well for getting a little excited, i'm sure you would be paranoid if you were me as well. I'm not no get rich quick guy........i'm a mechanic myself, just in a different industry. I had them do some other things while it was in........like change the oil........it's been 2k!!!!! But since they are saying they are willing to tell their insurance they didn't put oil in it........i'm sure that is really what happened. These guys are a second generation family shop. My dad knew their dad and they have a reliable record. This is just one of those "##### happens" situation in which i fell short end of the stick. They seem very sincere........i felt sort of bad the day he told me............he said how he was up all night......sick to his stomach trying to figure out how to tell me what happened. I can understand.......i'm in the service buisness myself and at no point have i been hostile with him. We sort of chuckled about it today when i went in to check on it and they were working on their air compressor.........which ironically started wrapping.........i told him i better leave, i must have a black cloud over me!!!! I'm not sure exactly where it was leaking from to begin with,, it was on the block......i seen that much when i checked. i was busy at my shop when they called me and explained........i asked ball part price........was reasonable it it was out of my league, not enough experience in automotive to attack it myself, so i told them to go ahead and take care of it. I just wanted some feedback. My father said that because of pro-rating and the fact insurance companies are *****s.........If it comes down to it, I will put what in what the original bill was gonna be......and between them and the insurance should kick in the rest........but the "correct" way would be for them to take care of it 100%. They made a major mistake which they owned up to. I work on small engines myself(25 h.p. or less, small diesels)........and i run an honest buisness(not too many out there from my experience). I had a guy bring in a brand new snowblower to be assembled. It had a broken fill tube so i replaced it, set it up and started it up. Evidently at some point it was stored outside and the sump was filled with some water. The water boiled up and beat up the oil into a foam..........brand new motor ..............gone!!! It wasn't sold by me and he just asked me to set it up for him. The dipstick showed no sign of water.........so it would have happened to him, and naturally warrenty won't cover water, so because he is a good customer........I'm putting in a 200 bucks in parts and a couple hours of labor.......plus a no charge on the bottom of the invoice for the inconvenience. The customer kindly enough offered to pay for the parts. He said he knew if it didn't happen to us, it would have been him. Diffrence being is i didn't forget to put oil in it........the motor blew while i had it-yes, but it's not my fault......i didn't fill it with water!!! If a motor blows because they forgot to put oil back in.........they directly damaged it.......and i'm sure it's not just a spum bearing.......no oil and no pressure........no lubrcation........ I'll keep you posted if anyone is interested. I just can't wait to get my truck back.........and this situation over. I just found a pic of it i had on my computer.......i was sad.......hahahaha. I'll show you if you wanna see...........before and afters!!! You'd never think it was 10 years old, i'll tell you that much.

 

Yeah, I can appreciate that and I enjoy looking at the good oldies. Mine is approaching twenty years old and looks great; but I've got to get the rust off the rear fenders and give it a fresh paint job (hopefully this year). Last year I pulled my tired 300 and put the 351W in it and I love driving it. I've got it up on blocks now replacing the rotors and calipers (first time I've done that) and am anxious to get it back together and running again. Let us know how the insurance company treats you.

'82 F150 w/351W (orig 300 I6)
Slik