This isn't a debate between diesels and gassers, I'm just fact finding.

I've been throwing together some numbers on running a V10 and a diesel over a year's time figuring I will annually put 10,000 miles on the truck. At the present fuel costs here on Washington's Olympic Peninsula, diesel is selling for .51 cents above regular gas. Granted this is the highest differential I've seen all year but it has been at least .40 cents for along time. At the present cost of fuel and giving the diesel 4 mpg better than the V10, the yearly costs come out about the same. I know diesel fuel will probably go down this summer, but who knows what the future holds for prices with all the wheeling and dealing in the oil industry.

My question to some of you folks who have owned both the V10 and a diesel is what would you estimate the yearly difference in maintenance costs between the two trucks if one was to take good care of their vehicle?

Thanks.

 

I agree, this is Not Gas vs Diesel. It is Cost vs Cost.
I owned a '99 PSD for 6 years, just recently sold it with 81,000 miles on her. Great truck, Strong running & great mpg. After the '05s came out, I decided it was time for a new truck & ordered a F350V10. V10 this time for 2 reasons. #1- I don't have my truck camper anymore & I am not using the truck that much either. #2- overall cost, the Diesel upkeep vs the Gasoline truck. I figured it out & it would take 120,000 miles to break even with the Diesel option and I was figuring at 8+ better mpg,.25 cents higher pump prices, 14qt oil changes, higher oil filter cost for the 6.0L PSD & higher fuel filter cost too on the 6.0L, I was figuring oil/oil filter change every 3,000 miles & Fuel filters every 15,000 miles. This was my maintenance I did with my '99 7.3L PSD. The avg mpg on did with my PSD was 19mpg, 90% of the time running empty or pulling no-load. So the above figures are for my driving habits & maintenance.
I figured in the difference between the two, both the V10 vs the Diesel at oil changes/fuel filters. On the V10 I only figured in 4 fuel filters, one at every 30,000 miles. I figured in the difference for mpg with the price of Gas vs Diesel here where I live, which presently Diesel is 25 cents more per/gallon & hasbeen for some time. The biggest cost difference between the 2 is the Engine cost. The 6.0L is $4335 dealer cost, $510 for the V10, I then droppped the price on the 6.0L to $3825. Since I always buy my New trucks at Dealer cost, I used the Dealer price on the Option Engine cost.
Unless you tow allot or really tack on the miles per year, which I don't, then yes, the Diesel is your best bet.

 

when i ordered mine i asked a lot of ?'s, fredvon 4 came in and gave what i feel is the most solid advise anyone has ever said to me. figuring in the cost of a diesel ver gas. for me i would have to drive 280.000 miles to get my money back out of the diesel. i think we most also look at whats coming down the line shortly. a new diesel fuel. and that is going to push cost even higher to maintain and run one. if you don't do high miles a year a diesel is not the way to go.

 

Hi all. New to the site, great place BTW, and I've used alot of the posts in my fact finding about V10 vs diesel to replace my '95 PSD. I work for one of the majors in research and talked to a few folks in our fuels technology group about the pricing of diesel fuel in the future more specifically the introduction of low sulphur diesel. They had a memo showing the intro in mid '06 and prices expected to be $0.50 - $0.60/gal more than current pump prices. That plus my concerns about diesel egr made my decision easy, ordering my V10 next week.

 

rooster
welcome to our little world of v10's. do your self a favor and look at the guide lines for posting. don't be afraid to ask in here about anything v10 or super duty up in the super duty part. we will all try and help out. better hurry and place that order as ford has a cut off date and you will want to be as far in front of it as you can

 

This was the fairest comparison I could do without being biest to either one. I did this before purchacing my truck 7 months ago just to see the out come and which one made more sense for me. Now lets see if my excell file will transfer worth a hoot!!! Alright I have to post this as multiple posts as it is to long otherwise - PLEASE READ ALL OF THEM BEFORE COMMENTING so I don't have to repeat things please.

 

All Right where is yeti when you need him???? The file is a excell file and I can paste it but it comes up as to many charactors so can I email this file to somebody that can get it to post right????? Its a very good cost comparison that includes maintenece cost, fuel costs, retail costs along with resale value and a list of pros and cons of both I think many would be suprised at the comparison. I have of course followed my own maintenece shcedule on it which is very thourgh and often so that does skew the results a little bit but since its an ecel file every thing can be changed very easily to fit any given situation including miles driven per year and the amount of years of ownership except you then have to go refigure the resale values as needed. I'm really bummed I couldn't get it to work!!

 

My new V10 has far exceeded my hopes in the fuel economy dept. It is getting under 2 MPG less than my 04 PSD did. 7 litres of oil on an oil change for V10 , 14 litres of oil for PSD. 9 bucks Can for Motorcraft oil filter , 38 bucks ripoff for Motorcraft cartridge for PSD , fuel filter for V10 not sure but need changing less than 85 dollar PSD fuel filter set. Psd air filter over 100 bucks not sure of V10 but will be less than half. Plus when I got into diesels 11 years ago diesel was almost 15 cents a litre cheaper than gas . Now it is 5 cents a litre more than gas. The PSD holds its value but you paid 5000 bucks more for it. Add 14% tax on that if you live in Canada like me. I believe you have to drive over 30000 miles a year and pull a trailer half of that to even consider a diesel. EGR and other pollution measures are changing diesel fuel economy and oil change intervals. EGR is putting soot back through your motor. If you want a new high tech EGR diesel to last as long as the old diesels you better figure on changing oil as often as you do on a gasser. Sure you can break the law, disconnect your EGR but at what cost? Void your warranty . Get fined for polluting the environment. Why bother, save 5 grand, buy a new quiet V10 with more power than most people will ever need, Take care, Wrench.

 

I really wish I could get that file posted. I think every body would be very suprised. I figured an average of 4mpg better than a V10. I love my V-10 and did this analysis before I made my purchace. I figured brand new trucks and the current value on equal trucks after five years and at 15000 miles per year. I also considered the cost of oil changes, fuel filters, Air filters, tires (wear quicker on the front of a diesel), Fuel and coolant additives, and batteries. I left out the extra financing and interest paid and tax is a very good point that I may want to add for the heck of it. when it was all said and done with deisel with being $0.15 more per gallon than gas the difference between the two was the V10 was cheaper to drive by $400-$500. I was pretty supprised. I figured oil changes on the diesel every 5k and every 3k on the gasser. and I figured fuel filter changes once a year or every 15k (2 for the diesel) and the same for air filters. tires were figured the same with the diesel front wearing out 1/3 quicker than the V10s. also a few bucks each year for the additives. It hard to gauge electricity for plugging them in so I left that out also but It was a good comparison non the less. I figured for my needs that they were comparable in overall cost but not having to deal with the extra maintenece, noise, smell, warm up and cool down times, Winter Fuel/ additives and the fact that I will never tow more than 12k that the V10 was a better choicce for me. As it turns out I'm only averaging 6k a year and sometimes weeks between start ups for a short trip so the V10 really did end up being the best option and is working out even better than I had anticipated. I think many of the diesel owners buy them thinking they are cheaper in the long run but in all actuallity it was nearly a wash. These calcs could be changed for different prices and miles per year and years and for different applications and the outcome may change a little one way or the other but unless you plan on running them 24/7 and putting on 300k It really wont matter so you might as well buy what YOU want. Also the only reason the diesel make more sense for extended life is due to resale value when they get into that 200k range as the acutal cost of running them is nearly the same because with more miles the oil changes and every thing else is also progressive (I had to try this to see If the diesel gains an edge) The only edge that it holds is resale after a whole lot of miles that and the fact that they are designed to run more miles than a gasser. how many is very subjective so I didn't go there. If any body would like the spred sheet I would be gald to email it to you. sorry for the long post but since I couldn't get my spred sheet to post Its take a lot more to write it and explain it and I'm sure I still left thing out.

 

From all the posts I've read. The V-10 far outways the POS in labor and parts. Ever see the list prive for a POS injector?

CN

 

From all the posts I've read. The V-10 far outways the POS in labor and parts. Ever see the list price for a POS injector?

CN

 

Rengaw

Of course you already know you posted in the V10 forum so many of us are biased..

That said, there are a whole lot of us that have owned most every Ford engine there has been. Me too.. I used to be a manual transmission purest.. not now! I used to be a very obnoxious Diesel snob ( I had a 7.3 on steroids).. not now!

I currently drive a 3 valve V10 mated to a 5R110 Torqueshift auto tranny. Other than total fuel effeciency this is a very capable machine and a whole lot of fun to drive.

Diesel ownership requires a certain degree of preventative maintenance that most long time gasoline owners are not used to. These differences are fairly significant and a lot of the time I get frustrated with our diesel brothers because they tend to gloss over these requirements.

Mostly because they have been living diesel so long they hardly recognize the additional care any more... just natural, things you gotta do to protect the investment.

Then there is the macho factor... we all have some degree of wanting to be recognized as having the biggest baddest truck around.

Power Stroke Diesel is a very cool monicer... but hell, so is Triton V10!... Brothers will always fight between them selves until the Dodge or Chevy neighbor kid gets in the middle then we are gonna kick some Mopar or GM ***.... all there is to it!

Bottom line is appreciating that BOTH are good choices and you have to factor your personal "but I want it" goals.

I can make a case for either based on cost factors... I am a mechanic so I have a different attitude on maintence related costs...

Truth is
The Diesel cost more to buy.
The Diesel requires more expensive maintenance when things crap out.
The Diesel is noiser.
The Diesel is stinkier.
The Heavier Diesel motor wears out steer tires faster.
The Diesel requires more expendables during scheduled maintenance.
The Diesel is more fuel effecient at high altitudes than the gaser.
The Diesel will haul a heavier load longer. (debatable but what I mean is 100,000 miles and miles)
Compared to a 295HP or 310 Hp V10 version the Diesel will not loose as much mpg as either of the gassers. This is NOT true with the new 3Valve V10. Yes they both loose total mpg towing but the difference is not as dramatic percentage wise now.

Fuel costs for the future?... I go by history and will argue with the fellows who insist that Diesel oil will get cheaper after winter is over. In my area, Diesel has been 5c to 45c higher than regular for 13 months now.... that is accross two winters and one summer. I just don't ever see it being cheaper than regular 87 octane ever again...

Ford abandoned the serious Cummings killer the 7.3L PSD for the enemic 6.0L PSD... a bad move in my humble opinion... they are shifting yet again in 2007 to a new diesel motor.. I don't know the long term company idea but it seems to me they knew the 6.0L was a interim fix... not very inspiring for diesel owners from 2002 to now.

Ford pushes the PSD for one reason only---- 3% profit margin is always higher on a truck that costs $3800 more than it's $510 motored brother.

Ford has doen an excellent job of upgrading the V10 each time. Diesel folks whould be happy if the MAJOR problems areas on the 7.3 or 6.0 were just confined to two basic failures... The V10 is prone to foul the Idel Air Control (IAC) valve (an easy fix) and occasionaly (in fact quite rare) blow a plug.

On all my PSDs I had to fix or replace, Cam Position Sensors (CPS), Injection Preassure Regulator (IPR), safety wire my Turbo bolts, add gauges, replace blown glow plugs, replace a Manifold Absolute Pressure module (MAP). Lost one very expensive Fuel Injection Control Module (FICM) and same time the Glow Plug Control Module (GCPM) crapped out.

In fact I lived on the diesel stop and here:

http://dan.prxy.org/Truck/6L_bible_html/html/TOC.html

I say that unless you put more than 30,000 miles per year hauling heavy loads then the V10 is the best bang for the buck.

She gets the job done, she is quiet, requires about the same scheduled maintenance and costs as the average car and is a suprisingly powerful motor! My 7800-8100 lb 4x4 great big air dam truck sneaks down the highway at 75mpH all day long and gets 11.4 to 12.2 MPG doing it. Yes the PSD will get better. But I choose to relate this truck effeciency against my old 5600lb 460 powerd trucks that barely got 8mpg under same exact conditions. In my book the Triton 3Valve V10 is probably the best motor Ford ever made!

 

Terrific post Fred, I have owned all the motors in your post and I agree with you 100 %.
Yes my 88 F250 460 was 2000 pounds lighter than my 05 V10 and drank 30% more gas and had far less power. I want to thank you again for providing information that helped me to decide on the V10 motor. I have bought 8 new Ford pickups over the last 30 years. Four V8 gassers, three V8 diesels, and now my all time favorite, the incredible V10.
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery and this V10 is a thing of beauty. Wrench.

 

thanks again fred. you always seem to have the military way with words and are right on.
i to have owned many of fords gaser motors from a flat head 8 up to the 460 in a pick up.
when i talk to my psd loving freinds they all complain about the operating cost of filters and oil. and these guys buy shell by the 55 gal drum.
i to am very happy and thankfull about the time you took to explain the v10 to his burnt out old wrench who has spent to much time on german garbage cars. no flame intended they just stink.
i only have this v10 a short time but i'm in love with it. gas around here yesterday was 175 and diesel was 235 to 245 per gal. 2 or 3 more mpg is not in my mind going to out way my cost of operating my v10 at 11 and 12 mpg. even if the price goes up the 25 cents the news states i'm still cheaper. i think ford has done some home work on the new motor and hopefully we will not see any more spark plug blow outs.

 

I bought a V-10 because I wanted a gas truck that could pull whatever I wanted the few times I need to. Just don't like the smell of diesel exhaust, although it does seem that I spend a fair amount of time following diesel trucks and needing to close the vents. (The Dodge, for some reason is the worst).

So the price of maintenance or fuel was not part of the equation for me. When I got the truck, diesel was a lot less than reg gas here. Now diesel is 2.69 and gas is 2.07. I think a lot of folks get what they want based on things other than the fuel or maintenance comparison.