i hope not any why to tell without buying one

 

they are new plugs? Still no good!!!

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 30-Dec-00 AT 01:14 AM (EST)[/font][p]>[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 30-Dec-00
>AT 00:49 AM (EST)[/font]
>
>Ahh new idea just popped into
>my head.
>
>The chilton manual states:
>
>Code 95: Fuel Pump Secondary Circuit
HotRod I may pose a question. I posted a Q regarding my truck dumping fuel in all cylinders. (You would have to read messages)but i finally got a code 212 (96 F-250 460/E4OD) That code reads IDM input to PCM Spout signal circuit grounded. My question is would this fault cause my situation?
>Failure - PCM to Ground.
>
>Code 96: Fuel Pump Secondary Circuit
>Failure - Battery to PCM
>
>
>
>Paul if you're around, could this
>be the Fuel pump relay?
I was told today by the dealer that a sticking FP relay would cause my situation??? I find that hard to believe when the the Fuel Pressure relay would not allow the extra fuel to be dumped into the cylinders. Isn't the Regulator's job is to keep pressure within parameters at all times in the fuel rail? Truck has sense been sent to the dealer. I've just been replacing items with no fix yet.

thx
Xaviar
>
>
>That is where these two codes
>would lead me.
>
>
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>
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>but when i take off the
>fuel pump line and turn
>the key it pumps gas
>would it still pump gas
>if it was the relay?
>its pumping gas when i
>turn key on?

When you say it pumps gas when you turn the key on with the fuel line off, does it pump for a second and quit or does it just keep going?



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How did this whole thing begin? Was the truck running and
suddenly quit, or was it progressively getting harder to start
or where you doing a tune up and the trouble started?

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 30-Dec-00 AT 01:32 AM (EST)[/font][p]well it doesn't start but when i cranked over the engein with the line off it pumped out gas all the way from frame to radiator in a stream well it started one day realy hard and some smoke blueish then ran like it was miss fireing and stalling i drove home then next morning nothing

does anyone know excacly what sensors or what would stop it from at least starting?

 

Take the battery cable off for a minute and put it back on.
Do the KOEO test again and see what codes come up. Ignore
the 21 and 24 since the engine is cold. If the 95 and 96
go away then I think somewhere along the way you fixed the
problem but fouled the plugs. If 95 and 96 are still there
my book says the computer thinks there is something wrong
with the fuel pump circuit. Apparently it monitors pin 19
on the ECA (computer) and the book says check all the wiring and as a last resort replace the ECA.

 

Both Codes 95 & 96 indicate a problem with the fuel pump relay & or the wiring to the pump . Carefully inspect the wiring to the relay . Also the Batt + curcuit to the relay may be the problem . Seems to me there have been a fair amount of problems with corrosion or loose pins at the wiring that connects to the fuel pump relay . Chech that the Inertia Switch wiring & tap it to simulate road shock . Have you replaced the relay ? Most of the ones Ive seen go bad the contacts stick causing the pump to run continuously ? But they will stick open too . You really need a good wiring diagram to help you sift thru all this .

 

I can hear the relay click and the fuel pump primes its self i get fuel up at the fuel rail i know the relay put juice to the injectors .but i have fuel so would this still be the relay do you know what grounds out the injectors because i know the relay keeps them hot with key on -------------------------------------------today i crimped off the return fuel line and still there was no pressure after i turned the key off in the fuel rail? I dont get it all the injectors cant go bad at once where is the fuel going and why are my plugs still wet i dont get it?

 

I think I am going to go with paul here. It sounds like the pmup is conitinuously running. That would explain why it ran like crap at one point. Your plugs being wet would say to me that you are getting too much fuel into the combustion chamber. that could also mean that your fuel pressure regulator is bad as well. I know you said you were going to put a new one on. But, if the pump relay circuit is messed up then it could mess the new one up as well. I think I heard someone on here not too long ago say that the relay was about $20, or close to it.

To me it would be cheap insurance. I know what you are going through. I had the same type of problems with a 300 in my truck, and spent nearly $1,000 in one year trying to make the truck run right. After all new sensors (every stinking one of them), and a complete exhaust system (engine back with new convertors), and the trips to the shops to have it tested (4 different shops said 4 different things), I finally gave up and pulled the 300. And I dropped a 302 in it's place. Now it runs better & gets better mileage. 14-16 compared to 11-13!

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I know someone asked before , but Ill ask again ... How did this problem first present itself ? Im about out of ideas ... This is one of those problems that requires a hands on approach . Try connecting one of those noid lights to the injectors & see it you are getting power to the injectors .

 

The fuel pump can run all the time and not hurt anything
except run the battery down. The fuel regulator takes care
of any excess fuel. Also, my book says that a ICM is a metal
box that contains relays for EEC power, fuel pump, cooling fan
air conditioning etc, depending on model. He said he replaced
the ICM, so he might have replaced the fuel pump relay doing
this. A buddy of mine had a 4.0 v6 with a bad fuel regulator and the truck still ran. It just ran rich. I think when he
tested the pressure on the system and it wouldn't hold, that
he should pursue this. The injectors are fed with 12v all
the time and the computer grounds the other side to fire it.
What if some wires were bare making the injectors come on
constant? The book says you can hook a tachometer to the
negative side of each injector and you should get a reading
when the engine is cranked. This is going to get involved
isn't it? If you need the truck I would take it to a shop.
Since this is not an intermitent problem, with no weird hard
to replicate symptoms, they should be able to fix it.

 

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON 31-Dec-00 AT 12:18 PM (EST)[/font][p]I just replaced the fuel pump relay and nothing changed but now with both the old one and new one the pump wont prime or come on so what feed the fuel pump relay power is it the brain orsomething else now i have another problem ? becAause of this i cant get it to give me ant K-O-E-Off test codes. please help with this one?

 

I believe you might have just narrowed it down. Is it just not giving any codes, or is it just dead in the water (the computer that is.

I think the computer could be what your problem is, I have heard of them just up and dying like that.


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just found out that the computer is sending the injectors a signal to fire so i dont think its the brain i think its the catalytic converter plugged? im cutting it tomorrow