I'm now very much not a fan of Fatman Fabrications. As you may know, they make dropped spindles for the Volare suspension, and they happen to cost almost $500 (when you add tax and shipping). Now when you get them you get a piece of paper that tells you you need to bash in part of your lower control arms, and grind off a hump of metal on the steering arms that bolt to the spindles in order to make everything fit! And I just found out (after everything is painted) that you may also need to grind your brake calipers so the bolt holes will line up! I'm all about custom stuff but when I pay almost $500 for a something that costs a company probably $40 to make, I think it's not unreasonable to expect that the part should fit in with no problems or stupid minor modifications to your stock parts!!!!!!!!! This is just ridiculous, all they had to do was grind a few small nooks into the metal and there would be no clearance issues!

Sorry.....I felt the need to rant. I just don't understand how Fatman Fab. can sell these pieces of unfinished crap.

 

I agree, that's rediculous! Makes me wonder how an outfit like Fatman Fab's got the reputation they have? That's absolutely assinine that they don't have the pieces drilled and/or slotted to fit the application they say it's supposed to marry up to. Did you ask them? I'd be curious to know how they tap-dance around your question.

Sorry they did you wrong like that Blitz... Keep your chin up; don't let the bums getcha down

DS

 

Your grief is expected and fair. As some of you guys know, I am building a test truck using only the aftermarket for parts marketed to and intended for this hobby and this truck in particular. I have ordered from most all the suppliers and sent back 75% due to lack of quality, lack of data/instructions,wrong parts, misrepresented value,lack of support,etc. The worst suppliers are the companies with the biggest, fanciest ads making claims such as " Bolt-in", "No mods req." and so on.
When you encounter issues like this it is good to share, by the same taken if you, ( we) find a supplier that provides good parts at a fair price and supporting data, please share that as well so we can help that supplier grow and stay in business so our kids can pick up whare we leave off.
Remember to ask your supplier if they are familiar with FTE. And remind them that you may post your perceptions of their product in a wide reaching forum. Build on and have fun no matter what.
PS: Call Bret at Fatman and tell him about this and I will send him a link .

 

This whole website is here because a few suppliers want to support the hobby and generate business. Word of mouth on FTE has massive amounts of power, both to reward the best suppliers and to encourage suppliers with problems to fix their game.

Hopefully Fatman will get the word here and do something, or people will avoid them.

I like to try and use the suppliers who fund this site, not because I work for them (I don't), but as a way of saying thank you. That being said, I would also expect that those suppliers can take the good news with the bad and wouldn't hesitate to criticize if one showed poor customer service.

This forum helps us build trucks, but it can also help suppliers build good businesses.

ROB

 

Specific to the complaints by Blitzkraig56: We do look at the various forums to see what's happening 'cuz , for some reason, some guys would rather complain in public than call us to ask a question. No slam on 'ya, Craig, just a strange fact in this business. We actually have a total of $432 invested in making these dropped spindles, and sell them for $525 now. We use top quality machine shops to CNC the critical parts and water jet cut (expensive) the 3/4" thick main plates to get superior metallurgy over cheaper flame cut parts. The hard truth is, we sell maybe 50 sets a year, so the product is as much as an attempt to help solve a common rodders problem as it is a way to get rich quick.

The advice in our instructions re rolling the lower control arm sheetmetal lip closer around the lower ball joint is done for a couple valid reasons. First, Chrysler didn't stamp the lower arms all exactly the same, and not all need this done. The other way around it would have been possible to design the spindle to put the rotor outboard a little further. But, when you are lowering a car, a wider track is the last thing you want. In my opinion, 30 seconds per side massaging the lower arm stamping is the better way.

The little grind we ask you to do on the caliper bracket is a similar deal. It was a boss they use to do the original caliper bracket machining and serves no purpose after manufacturing. Yea, I could have made the flange that retains the spindle spud a little smaller to clear it, but why compromise strength and security. I also could have machined a spot to clear that now useless caliper bracket boss, but that would only add to the price you already object to. Again, a couple minutes grinding an unneeded boss of a soft cast iron bracket seemed to me the better way.

Now that I've had my turn to vent, I hope you can better see why they are made as they are. We answer the phone 49 hours a week in order to be available for questions such as these. You may disagree with the choices I make as a designer and fabricator, but I cannot help but object to the tone of the comments. With 32 years as a fabricator, we try to do the job the way we see best. Frankly, we don't need the grief any more than you do. As on all good forums, the "rules" say that "mean spirited, derogatory, or demeaning" posts are unacceptable. Questions sure, but why the slams.

 

Hi

This is what I had to do to install mine.

Had to grind the caliper mounting bracket like they said but then we had to grind about 3/32 off of the outside surface next to the rotor so the rotor would turn.

Then we had to remove approx 1/4 off of the length of there spindle to steering arm bolts it was hitting the torsion bar mounts, preventing a full lock to lock turn.

Finally the brake hose had to be moved to miss the ball joint stud.

I don't remember them saying anything about modifing the lower control arm but I may be wrong, anyway when the guy did my front end alignment the rotors ended up rubbing the control arm and this person drove it off the rack to say he thought the driveshaft was rubbing. After he fixed the control arm and charged me $20,00 more and I was lucky enough to buy another set of rotors I have to say it set's good and rides pretty good for it's ride height.

They only cost $505.00 plus shipping. Why would I think they would bolt in with no problems?

I talked to someone (said he was the owner) at the Kalamazoo Nat's a few years ago about why they suggested using a GM brake hose with the dropped spindles for my 54 Merc car instead of a Ford unit. His answer was "Do you know how much we spent on engineering". Maybe one of us was just having a bad day.

Chuck

 

Fatiger do you work for FatMan just curious. I can understand both sides, make one spindle to fits a front end that I have seen several different variations of. An end user disappointed because there was some extra work involved to fit aftermarket components correctly. Craig it's unfortunate that you had to do more work than expected I've been there many times. Fatman could more proactive in warning customers when "some extra work may be required".

 

I am Brent VanDervort and I own Fatman, as well as do most of the engineering here. The items of interest to Craig re the Volare spindles are very much described in our instructions. The lower arm/rotor interference is solved by the "massaging" of the lip around the ball joint on the stamped lower control arms, and explained in the instruction for the spindles, but being guys, we often don't read them all the way thru. Maybe some of the unmet expectations some guys have with aftermarket parts could best be handled by getting hold of an instruction sheet set before a guy buys. I think any manufacturer will be glad to send a set ahead of time. We often do. In a way, it's hard for the customer to know what to ask, and hard for the vendor to answer questions that don't get asked. Having instructions before putting up your $$ lets a guy see what's really involved in the installation. The space available in print ads (at thousands of dollars per page) just doesn't allow vendors to say ALL that can be said. The website is a place we, and many other vendors, do use for the necessary space to say more. The more I think about it, the more I think this deal of getting instruction before the sale is the way to go.

RE the question at Kalamazoo, I'm sorry you didn't recieve a more courteous answer. On the 50's Ford dropped spindles (like I have on my own 56 Vicky daily driver) use a GM type banjo end brake hose to keep the lowered and out of the way of the upper ball joint. Lowering the car by raising the wheel on the suspension is the cause of that. When you use Granada stock spindles on the same suspension, the Ford straight in style hose works fine 'cuz the caliper is lower on the suspension, and thus clears the ball joint stud just fine. All of the above is explained in the instruction sheet for those parts.

I am leaving 8/17/07 to drive our show rig to Goodguys in Pleasanton, CA, so if this thread continues and I don't reply for a while, it's 'cuz I'm gone, not 'cuz of any attitudes.

In the meantime, the phone is open for guys to ask questions, get instructions, and answers. Thanks for listening to both sides.

 

i bought a set from fatmans a few years ago for a early 60s { a64 352 4speed long bed } effie and i didn't have one problem with them . i'm pretty sure it was them , but i am gettin' old and my wife has to dress me in the morning , and marvin martian and i are best of freinds ..............

 

Hey fattiger53/brent-

I see you're new here. Good to have a vendor join and respond to issues on FTE. Welcome.

 

Hi Brent - I think its great to have an owner explain the product. Not many would take the time to do that. Welcome to FTE - hope you have a good time at GG's

Craig, it sounds like you did what most of us have done....finished part of your truck too quickly and then had to go back and retro-fit some part. I've still got scuffs and scratches on my truck that didn't polish out. I can sympathize with your frustration over grinding something you took pains to paint, but in all honesty I think it's part of the charm of building our own trucks. Sounds like you've got a good one going there.

Just wait till you get to the wipers and turn signals..............

 

Brent,
Welcome to the board. Its always nice to hear from the vendors. So many times we cuss and moan and blame it all on the vendors (its easier to blame the vendoros than to admit we might have made a mistake....lol), its nice to hear the perspective from the other side.

Craig, I feel your pain. I've done the same kind of stuff before and its very frustrating. Glad you got to vent a bit, thats one of the best things about this site. Its a great place to blow off steam and commiserate with other truck guys.

Bobby

 

While I sympathize with your frustration I have learned after many years of backyard car building that it is futile to expect anything pertaining to hot rodding to be truly bolt-on...even those parts advertised as such. If you go into a project with that frame of mind then a little grinding here and there will not upset you. Oh, and never put a time limit on a job to be done on these old trucks. It will invariably take you twice as long...

 

Not to offend, but if you are building a show truck (i.e.) fancy custom painted frame, powdercoated/chromed parts, etc.) then do like the show car builders do: mock up the entire build then tear it down and finish the parts. If you are building a nice driver that is being modified along the way, you must expect to have to make changes/touchups. Ever watch American Hotrod or A Chopper? Those guys are supposed pros and they have to make mods and touchups during final assembly. Paint touchup is a minor issue IMHO. I use a of of rattlecan paint on chassis parts because it is easy to make touchups, and the chassis is going to stay pristine for about a milisecond once it hits the road.

 

Brent makes a valid point about instructions and not reading them, no disrespect to those who have problems. BUT in the 40 years that I have been in this business many ''engineers'' have come and gone, in their wake they left a reputation of incomplete instructions or no instructions at all and the eternal saying ''you can tell it's a hot rod part, it doesn't fit'' Both we and the manufacturers have had several years (decades) to get better at this and the fact that parts may only need to be ''massaged'' is a tremendous improvement. If you think those parts are expensive to buy you should see the bill for having a pro-shop do the massaging for you and then to install them. IMHO it is up to all of us to bite the bullet when you start a project, it's part of the price of hotrodding and it's probably going to cost 50% more than you thought anyway. Thanks for listening