tightening lug nuts
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,148
Likes: 0
From: Seneca, SC
well it may not be imperative to torque them. My dad used to get on me for torquing mine, he never torqued his and hasn't had a problem. But the way that I see it is what are you risking by torquing them? Compared to the risk of not torquing them, it seems like a good idea. Hey, and if you want a torque wrench for cheap, look at harpor freight tools, they can get you a half inch that should get to around 150 ft lbs. for about 20 bucks. I know that the cheap ones are not the greatest but we are talking about wheels here not head gaskets, you should be fine using one of theirs.
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,303
Likes: 48
From: Lyndonville, Vermont
Originally Posted by jdadamsjr
99f350sd,
MANY of the newer sd's and excursion have had issues with rotor warping and MANY have come to the conclusion that improper torque setting is the problem....
MANY of the newer sd's and excursion have had issues with rotor warping and MANY have come to the conclusion that improper torque setting is the problem....
Dick
Freshman User
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
At the ripe old age of 42 I have learned never to say never. Although I beleive the risk is minimal I use sticks on my truck, it's too easy and not worth the risk.
I have seen lots of car rotors and wheels warp from improper torquing so I have been torquing lug nuts for a long time.
IMHO - I think puddles-on-hot-rotors are a bigger risk for us.
I have seen lots of car rotors and wheels warp from improper torquing so I have been torquing lug nuts for a long time.
IMHO - I think puddles-on-hot-rotors are a bigger risk for us.
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,148
Likes: 0
From: Seneca, SC
I don't disagree that the heavy duty design may not need to be torqued. But my argument is that it seems like a cheap safe habit to get into. If you don't torque the heavy duty rims that you are speaking of then you say nothing will happen. But if you get in the habit of not torquing them from not doing it for five to ten years and get another car, say a honda (God Forbid) and put 'em on with a breaker bar or something you'll have a real problem. The time it takes is minimal, and I think that it's a good habit to be in. I mean what damage are you doing by torquing them?
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,303
Likes: 48
From: Lyndonville, Vermont
I use an impact gun for everything so when I'm done they are all about the same. As far as non mechanic types yes torque em to be sure. My point was about rotors warping anyhow.
Dick
Dick
Elder User
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 775
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From: Northern Va
Originally Posted by 99f350sd
You guys make a big stink about torque and the lug nuts. On the super duty the design of the rotor and hub make it impossible to warp the rotors with loose or differently torqued nuts. some other designs where the studs are in the body of the rotor are definetly affected by different torques. All the wheel does is squeeze the thin rotor metal between it and the hub. All I'm saying is that its not that important on the Super Duty trucks..Now 2wd trucks with a rotor with the studs in it and you can warp that all to heck. The automotive industry gives those torques so the nuts will never fall off.
In the '80's this company had a great deal of problems with rotor warpage. They had a similar design to what we have on our SD's. In 1990, they changed the design to where you had to disassemble the hub to get the rotor off. Problems with braked vibration dramatically reduced.
Yes, it's true, pad deposits can be the cause of brake vibration, but in a "slip on" rotor design, uneven torque will with out a doubt cause rotors to warp.
Ten years in the service repair business proved that to me.
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,214
Likes: 0
From: All Over
Thanks to DCSpecial I recently found this out:
Sometime in 03 the pitch on the lugs changed to 14x1.5
Older trucks have 14x2.0
I know Ford increased the torque specs for the lugs, but I have been unsuccesful in getting an answer from them in relation to the two different pitches. In other words should the torque spec for a 14x2.0 be the same as the 14x1.5. Obviously finer threads can strip easier...and I was trying to find out what the impact was if any.
WELD Racing is pretty adament about the following torque
14x2.0 = 140 (I believe)
14x1.5 = 110
FWIW
Sometime in 03 the pitch on the lugs changed to 14x1.5
Older trucks have 14x2.0
I know Ford increased the torque specs for the lugs, but I have been unsuccesful in getting an answer from them in relation to the two different pitches. In other words should the torque spec for a 14x2.0 be the same as the 14x1.5. Obviously finer threads can strip easier...and I was trying to find out what the impact was if any.
WELD Racing is pretty adament about the following torque
14x2.0 = 140 (I believe)
14x1.5 = 110
FWIW
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Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,005
Likes: 1
From: Cincinnati, Ohio
Finer thread has a less steep "ramp" so for a given torque there is more clamping force on the fine thread. I would bet the 1.4 pitch at 110 ft-lbs has the same clamping force as the 2.0 pitch at 140 ft-lbs.
Interesting torque discussion, eh?
"Tighten it till it strips then back off 1/4 turn"
Dave / Believer45
Interesting torque discussion, eh?
"Tighten it till it strips then back off 1/4 turn"
Dave / Believer45
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,931
Likes: 5
From: Allen, Tx
Originally Posted by believer45
"Tighten it till it strips then back off 1/4 turn"
Dave / Believer45
Dave / Believer45
I have a May 2003 truck with the M14x1.5's and it says on the nut: 150 ft lb and 200 Nm on them. Wouldn't that be what is recommended for torque? Or is Ford just trying to get me to purchase more studs and brake rotors?
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 790
Likes: 1
From: Fort. Lauderdale FL,
That Lugg sure speaks for itself. My local shop put on new wheels for me said check them in 50 miles. Got home they were all loose as a goose. Looked in my book. 2004 SD and it says 145-165./ so mine are all tourqed to 155. Seems to be good. Called my buddy at the shop back and said hey they were loose what should i tourque then to and he said 100ftlbs i said check the books your sending guys out on loose nuts...
always trust the book thats why they give it to you . that and well a lugg that has it writen right on the side is a good indication to i would think,
ryan
always trust the book thats why they give it to you . that and well a lugg that has it writen right on the side is a good indication to i would think,
ryan
Junior User
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Bottom line, the factory manual and repair manuals say to torque .. so you do it ...
Would you ignore a sign that says "Bridge Out" by continuing to the bridge?
I would hope not ... but then again, not everyone's elevator goes to the top ..
Would you ignore a sign that says "Bridge Out" by continuing to the bridge?
I would hope not ... but then again, not everyone's elevator goes to the top ..
Senior User
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 99f350sd
You guys make a big stink about torque and the lug nuts. On the super duty the design of the rotor and hub make it impossible to warp the rotors with loose or differently torqued nuts. some other designs where the studs are in the body of the rotor are definetly affected by different torques. All the wheel does is squeeze the thin rotor metal between it and the hub. All I'm saying is that its not that important on the Super Duty trucks..Now 2wd trucks with a rotor with the studs in it and you can warp that all to heck. The automotive industry gives those torques so the nuts will never fall off.
Senior User
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 99f350sd
I use an impact gun for everything so when I'm done they are all about the same. As far as non mechanic types yes torque em to be sure. My point was about rotors warping anyhow.
Dick
Dick
Posting Guru
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,005
Likes: 1
From: Cincinnati, Ohio
Originally Posted by beano
incorrect about the impact getting them close. how many times does the hammer hit after they spin up? and is the air pressure exactly the same everytime you spin em up. point is that an using an impact to get em close is what causes warping because the torque is inconsistant
As to the TorqueStix, we did a study at work on the TorqueStix and, as long as the air pressure on the gun was at their spec (100 lbs, no more no less), they seemed pretty close (within 10 lbs/ft +-). Let the air pressure to the impact gun vary 10 psi and the torque is way off. At 110 psi the 450# rated TorqueStix went to 450 - 625. I have no idea why this is true but it was in our sample (20 wheels, eight lugs per wheel, checked with a calibrated Mac torque wrench).
I had the lugs on my F250 done with TorqueStix and all 16 (rear tires only) were at 225 or more.
Dave / Believer45
Last edited by believer45; Mar 16, 2005 at 10:49 PM.