He guys advise is just that and not gospel. I am new to this site and intregede by the passion and commitment all of you display in your input. It is for this reason I keep coming back. Some of the advise is great and other advise or comments questionable. Either way in a forum like this it is open and for that reason valuable.
Thank you.
On the matter of the subject "Towing" I appreciate the diverse and varied input. Some eased my mind and other scared me straight about towing with my truck, but the outcome is I have answers to my questions that allow me to make an informed/misinformed decision. The bottom line is the door tag, the manufacturs data, the law and when in doubt (a grey area) common sense.
I am shopping for a F 350 and have a real pretty F 150 for sale thanks to this site.
Keep smiling and contribuitng threads to us dopes who ask questions
Thanks again
Ric

 

rvpuller, please stop playing games and please don't misrepresent me. I did use the word "average" and other synonyms as seen in these posts taken from the thread you are talking about.

From the "other" thread:

And from this thread:

Maybe I might have used other language such as "usually averages between..." instead of "should be" in my original post in this thread, but it was certianly implied and later clarified by my subsequent posts.

I don't have to have the last word, post away if you like. I DO feel the need to defend myself when you post information about the content of my posts that is simply not true, as illustrated above.

 

When it comes to towing, some people just don't understand the difference between "can" and "should". Our trucks can tow lots of things. The real question is should we be towing those things with our truck? Vehicle weight ratings are there to answer that question.

Not sure I want to step into the 5th-wheel pin weight "should vs could vs might vs does vs average vs most" nomenclature debate between you guys; so I'll just say that the pin weight of my RV is 22% of the trailer's weight.

 

Alright guys, I think maybe we all need to just agree to disagree on some things ?

 

I'll let it go. I just get frustrated when people twist my words around and misquote me. My original intent was to share some concerns about some of the suggestions in this forum. Afterall, most of the people who post questions here have never towed before or are fairly inexperienced.

 

NoMo, I think you summed it up best with your comment about Can and Should .

 

John, I'm glad you made the original post, it was obviously your intent to help out and do something for the benefit of everyone and I'm sure it will help us all to remember those things. Thanks for bringing up the issue.

 

Opps, I'm sorry, us older guys don't know how to play, and I guess I should have looked and I would have seen that opinions can't be challenged here.

I'm gonna give you another one, I have over a million miles driven under my belt, and the kicker, I haven't killed anyone yet.

John

 

What started as a thread for towing tips/info has now deteriorated into lots of personal comments. Can we put it back on track - please?

Steve

 

Sure, opinions can be challenged, but it should be done in a mature manner. My initial post was to share some concerns and general information. Your response was harsh and violated the language guidelines of FTE. Somehow I didn't expect that behavior from a Moderator.

Feel free to disagree with me, but don't take our difference of opinion as a reason for WWIII.

 

I see,

John

 

Is there any reason that you can't respond in a mature manner? This topic of this thread is a serious one and certainly was not posted to start a war. If you want to debate, please post your side of things, but be mature about it and follow the FTE guidelines. I haven't seen that side of you thus far. When one side is argueing and the other is discussing, one of those people looks foolish. I'll give you a hint, I'm the one discussing. Please lead by example.

 

Let's stop baiting each other with personal comments.

This is a good topic and we should be able to discuss it at length without getting sidetracked by off topic issues.

Now back to the topic: What I see is it's unfortunate that GCWR combines both safety and power rating. IMHO, it would be better to rate them separately.

Example: Two Superduty F250's, one with a 5.4L engine and the other with a V-10. Both have the same 8800# GVWR. But the 5.4 (3.75 axle) has a GCWR of 13500#, whereas the V-10 is about 22500#. So obviously since it's the same chassis, the difference in weight rating is not a safety issue, it's an engineering (power) issue.

The problem is when folks turn it around and consider the engine/power first and base their percieved towing ability on power alone. For example if an F250 with a 460 engine had a GCWR of 18000#, then an F150 with the same engine should have the same rating, right? Wrong. The F150 has lighter brakes, axles and springs. So in this example it's more of a safety rating than a power rating.

 

Can do Scott, Take the first paragraph out of the original post and it takes on a different feel. Opinions are opinions and are not facts and should not be portraid as such.

I agree that F150s, 250s, 350s, and 350 duallys, all have different cababilities, no problems there. I understand rear axles, but a Dana 60 is a Dana 60 regardless what ratio is in the center. Brakes are the major factor in stopping any moving vehicle, and are being improved on all the time. Should you be driving a 04 F450 with a 4ft X 8ft empty trailer behind and something happens in another travel lane and it ends up five feet in front of you, guess what.....

The concerns that I have with several posts that I have read recently is even if it is a one shot deal, folks are discouraged from a tow because it could be outside of the rating guidelines of the truck. A poster wanted to bring a travel trailer home for a relative, but was told not to do it, wheather he listened is another issue.

The engine certianly has a lot to do with towing. The 460 is Ford's towing king of gas engines, and pulling power is a major part of towing. You can run many miles without touching the brake pedal. I just made a trip from Durham NC to Atlanta Ga with my son in his 04 F150 5.4 pulling a 12ft Uhaul. His truck with 4 wheel discs would stop the trailer much faster than my ol 66 that I put together, but my FE will out pull his 5.4. From Charlotte to Atlanta is one hill after another and his truck was dropping gears often. He may or may not ever hook another trailer to his truck but he had to go with what he had.

I offer an opinion, have a good idea what will work. I feel I know what FTE posting guidlines are and don't understand "I would have thought a moderator and someone with over 7000 posts would know that even masked profanity isn't allowed here."

I can't stand by and read all of the naysaying without speaking up, when it is masked as gospel.

Respectfully IMHO

John

 

There's nothing wrong with the first paragraph and it is completely within the guidelines of FTE. The first paragraph was simply there because I am concerned about the content of some of the posts. When newcomers ask for advice they assume they are getting "good" advice, and some of the advice I've seen posted here is questionable. I will concede 1 point you make, the one-time short tow. I agree that if someone needs to make a 1 time short tow it will probably be OK to do so if it's over their tow rating. I DON'T think it's OK to do so if it's going to be pulled on the bumper, because the bumper could cause problems. I see too many mangled bumpers every day from towing issues. I would also consider the V10 the king of Ford's gas engines, not the 460. It puts out a lot more HP and torque than the V10 ever did.

If you'll read back through the original post, there wasn't any naysaying, it was a plea for everyone here to use common sense before they recommend anything. That was the spirit of the whole thing.