Sidelt,
Compliments to you.
I appreciate such a display of respect and civility.
You get

 

Sidelt, I totally agree with you on the many sides of a discussion and believe me I was a big NASCAR fan and am just venting my feelings about the way the sport is going. It's nice to have both sides being posted without anybody getting upset. There are things good and bad on the old and the new and we are all just putting in our thoughts.

By the way I really have enjoyed the conversation.

 

I no longer respect Nascar, so I do not have anything civil to say about them. They have their favorite drivers and they have their drivers they do not like. Accordingly, the same action that would get one driver fined, will not even get another called to the trailer. Just for the record, my favorite driver happens to be one that can do anything and not get called to the trailer.

 

Adding a side note on NASCAR (more to add to the money side) Jr. was just listed as #59 in the Forbes top 100 sports personalities. They put his income in the last year at 20 million. And yes people that is higher then Jeff Gordon and he dropped out of the top 100.

 

I am not so sure it is about favorites as much as it is about money. If you are a popular name, you are good for the circuit. There are occassions that the big names get the benefit of the doubt, but the same thing happens in every one of our businesses. If you have a salesman that has been your ace for years, but you catch him playing golf on company time ( or whatever violation), he will probably get a free pass or not get that severe of a penalty. The problem is that it is on a nationally televised broadcast and EVERYONE can see it.

 

Does anybody else besides me think that the new points system is a direct result of Matt Kenseth's title win last year?
*He's a good driver, but not one of NASCAR's "stars"...like Jr., Tony, Gordon, etc.
*He was quite, usually didn't qualify well, but always slowly moved to the front.
*He was driving a Ford...NASCAR seems to like the Chevy drivers best.

The #17 team played by the rules and won the cup title fair and square. But because there wasn't a lot of sparkle and flash, I guess NASCAR figured it wasn't enough like a WWF wrestling match, so they changed the rules.
Am I the only one that sees it this way?

MR

 

The reason they changed it is because Kenseth didn't win races, he just finished well consistently. By the end of the year, all he had to do was finish on the lead lap for the last 5-7 races and he would win the title. Lots of teams had a better win and top 5 record, but also had some bad finishes and they had no chance at the title.

 

The reasoms behind cars on the track not looking like cars in the showroom have to do with safety.
In the 70's, speeds became so dangerous in the stock cars, rules required more strict rollcage requirements. In order to add the required rollbar cage around the driver, cars literally had to be stripped to the frame in order to securely attach them in the right locations. When reinstalling the sheetmetal, panels had to be massaged to fit around the cages.
Fast forward to the early 80's and Nascar gave to OK to integrate the frames and cages to improve driver protection. By the late 80's car designes were so advanced that most teams were producing thier own panels, chassis, and rollcages. Nascar then decided to limit sheetmetal massaging to the sides of the vehicle. Hood, roof and decklid must retain OEM profile.
The Fords on the track represent to OEM counterpart in this aspect only and look like a 2 door model. Ford does not even produce a 2 door Taurus.

There wereMany other reasons behind the changes, soem had to do with factory sponsorship and such. Overall, Nascar has become more of an even playing field for drivers. Since the cars are all held to stricter tolerances, drivers rely on the the allowable changes (tires, air pressure, spring rates, etc) to determine how much right foot they can drop into a car.
I agree that we need a "stock car" series with required roll cages and safety equipment. Nascar has become all about the money anymore. Just look at the equipment needed to make it to the track: 18 wheeled cargo trailer, 60 ft luxury motorhome, trophy wife, etc. Not one of use on this board could ever hope to get into nascar without starting on a shop crew or having been a family member of a team owner.
I say watch it for the entertainment value only and there will not be any new technological developments in Nascar for at least another decade.

(just my opinion, don't beat me up too bad)

 

Krosati, While I agree and you were on the right track with your reasons that the cars don't look like showroom cars, they have gone past that now. The decklids do not match anymore and for the most part the hood and roof lines are gone. Example is the Monte Carlo, the deck lid was widened and added length. The nose has been extended also. The Dodge uses and was built to the Taurus templates. I know for safety reasons they had to make changes to the cars and this is understandable as well as expected, but when they start messing with the basic linse of the cars then they are only trying to make them equal which I think should not happen. If Ford does poorly then let them redesign their car to make it faster not NASCAR mandateing changes to other makes to slow them down or letting Ford change the lines to make theirs faster. All that should be left up to the manufacturer like it used to be. NASCAR has talked a lot about useing common templates for all their cars, so far the car companies have slowed that down with threats to pull all support. NASCAR tells all companis that there will be one set of heads made by the company used on all that companies cars (there are other items also) then why do they not do that with the body styles. A few years back when they mandated one style of head the Chevy entry was not nearly as good as the Ford but did they allow Chevy to make changes, no they said that is what you picked and that is what you will run. Later new designs were introduced and approved and they all had to run that design. I think they should also do that with the bodys. If a company makes a bad running body then tough you have to run it until a new design is made and approved.

 

Nascars point system is way to complicated. its the only motorsport org. that you can be the champion with out ever winning a race or finishing in 2nd or third place, WTF?? it should be kept simple like Formula 1. Points are based where you finish in the race, plain and simple.
First of all, they only award the top six drivers. For finishing first they award ten points. Second gets six points. The third place driver receives four points.Then it goes three, two and one point for fourth, fifth and sixth respectively. No "most laps led", no "who gets the pole" b.s.
If you dont win races, you dont become the champion!

 

A good discussion we are having here!
One thing that I failed to mention that I REALLY dislike is the multi-car "teams". The whole idea of one driver BLOCKING other drivers to assist his team mate is crazy in my book.
That's FOOTBALL for Pete's sake, not RACING !

 

I have to agree, this also going to play a big part in the championship points for the last ten races. A teammate that is outside the top ten and has no chance of winning the race may end up having one of those "racing deals" with a non team mate.

 

Who watches F1? Just kidding. I agree the rules are getting very complicated and should be simplified to favor 'racing'.

I'm surprised no one has brought up the finish at last Sunday's Michigan race. Last Lap, Leaders are in the 4th turn coming to the straight away for the finish, 1st and 2nd are running neck and neck, ............ AND THEY THROW A CAUTION!!!!!!!!!! The field is instantly frozen and the race is finished under caution. NASCAR effectively moved the finish line to the entrance of turn 4 at the end of the race.

Mentioning F1, don't they stop counting laps when the caution flag comes out?

 

I don't agree with NASCAR when they massage the shapes of the bodies just to make them competitive. Look at the truck series...Every new Ram I've seen on the street has a grille as big as my garage door, but the racing versions have this little-bitty thing that is a cartoon of the real grille. Hey, if the stock profile has too much drag too-bad! It's bad enough that you can't tell what brand a cup car is without the stick-on headlights, but now the trucks are getting that way. Grrrrrr.

MR

 

Oh please let's not get into the truck series. LOL I quit watching those when they let Toyota join in.