You are talking about laws that are not enforced in my area of Pa. The state and feds have more important things to do, than chase after a private car owner who pulls his EGR valve or converter off. We don't even have emissions testing yet, and when we do, it'll only be a visual, they're talking about it in a few years. If you live in Montana or Alaska, who the heck cares about emissions laws ??

Laws that are not enforced, mean nothing. If everyone could get away without paying income taxes every year, what dummy in his right mind, would go and pay them ?? It would be assinine to pay taxes if no one really required you to. See what I mean ?? Well, think of emissions as a "tax" placed on your engine's performance, that you don't really have to pay in some areas of the country. Of course if you are a major shop removing tons of emission stuff, you risk getting caught, but these recommendations are mostly for private owners, and their own cars.

My recommendation to anyone buying a new vehicle is this, for sure thing, disconnect the EGR valve. The knock sensor will immediately pick up any ping, and adjust for it. No problem with any gas used. The car will run MUCH better.

If you want to "hop up" a new vehicle, take the converter off, either replace it with a straight pipe, or knock the guts out of it and reinstall it, so it's an empty shell. I've done that on my Saturn. Then you can also buy a performance chip, and put that in. Run premium gas, and your spark computer and knock sensor will recognize it, and immediately advance the timing based on less ping it senses. See ?? Todays vehicles are "smart" and keyed to the octane you put in them, and compensate for any changes you make.

Finally, believe me guys, I've "been there, done that". Call the DER or EPA and tell them that I've removed my EGR from my car, see if they care...they don't. Most of them are on the take from big corporations anyway, that pollute a LOT MORE than our cars do. And you know it.

 

disconnect the EGR or eliminate cats and see how fast the annoying little "check engine" light comes on. the controls on these vehicles are so sensative, by gov't mandate, of course", that even just a little dirt between the gasket on your gas cap and the filler neck turns it on. i dont agree with the regs., but they are there.

 

You're still talking about vehicles over 10 years old which have 1st generation OBD not OBD II. There's a huge difference.

Even so, I for one have no desire to be running around with the "check engine" light on all the time because some guy from a computer message board told me it was OK to disconnect my EGR valve. If you spent 7 years learning about how emissions control systems and computerized engine management works then you should know what the ECM/PCM does in today's vehicles when the check engine light is on.

You should also know that computerized engine management can only adjust within certain limits and that base timing still has to be set at a specific "hard" level from which the computer can adjust. If that level is off it doesn't matter what chip you have in the ECM/PCM.

 

Try using HEET gas line antifreeze. When we had emissions testing in Minnesota I had some trouble getting a car to pass. They told me to install a new air filter and pour a couple of cans of HEET into the gas tank when it was below a halftank of gas and then have it tested. It passed.

 

Whoo Weee !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Just got great news. In the state of Georgia, As of January 1, 2004 1979 vehicles are exempt from emissions testing. Since I have not registered my newly aquired jewel, I will wait until Jan. 2 to register it. What a relief, now I am just going to take the cat off. Just for the principal of it. Now I just have to wait until after the 1st to fully enjoy my Bronco.

 

Ya, the car dies in just a matter of days (speaking from experience).


It's time for a hard boot.

 

How can the check engine light come on, on a 1970's model truck, they HAD NO CHECK ENGINE LIGHT.

I've driven (3) newer vehicles with EGR's disconnected, my own personal cars. I rolled up 100,000 on the first one, 83,000 miles on the second one, and 10,000 on the latest one, ALL WITH EGR'S DISCONNECTED. So what if the check engine light comes on, the computer still goes into closed loop, and the cars run much better. This all proves one thing, you're not man enough to admit, when you're wrong.

Are you afraid of that little light ?? Are you so stuck on factory stuff, and so afraid to modify your truck, that you won't touch anything on it ?? I'm afraid to say, you sound like you don't even work on your own vehicles, and are just hanging out on the net and posting. Is that true ??

Try it, you'll like it...and you won't regret it...

 

Bill, read my previous post. I put LOTS of miles on my vehicles with EGR off, believe me, they run better, and I'll stick to my guns on that. It makes no difference to me if you "believe" me or not. Take a good look at the heads on an EGR equipped engine one time, there is a passage in the head that goes from the exhaust valve bowl, to the intake manifold !! Now, what good is it to superheat the intake with exhaust and dilute the charge like that, except for dumb emissions laws ?? Any mechanic worth his salt will tell you, cool the mixture, make it denser, to make more power. That's why turbo cars use intercoolers. Take a good look at the heads, and you'll see. Remember, up until 1973, NO FORD TRUCK EVEN HAD AN EGR VALVE. And they ran like gangbusters...

Bottom line, if the laws were relaxed, the EGR's would not be installed, and this discussion would be a mute point.

FACT- my nephew just bought a Honda engine from Japan, they pull them from wrecks over there, and sell them in the states. He put it in his Honda, guess what guy, THE ENGINE HAS NO EGR ON IT, right from the factory. Think about that.

 

Typical juvenile flame response from Missouri.

Does your 66 Mustang have an EGR valve ?? NO. Does it run ?? YES.

 

There's no need to get into some sort of personal flame war in this thread. The reality of the situation is that the vast majority of people live in areas where emissions checks are part of life. In order to drive your vehicle legally you can't disconnect the emissions controls and expect it to pass the test which means that you can't register it.

Evidently this doesn't apply to cantedvalveford which is fine. As I said before I personally don't think it's a good idea to drive around with the "check engine" light on and the ECM in closed loop mode all the time especially in a '96 or newer OBDII equipped vehicle. I don't think the additional performance if any is worth the potential headaches.

If you want to continue the discussion then please keep personal comments out of it or the thread will be locked. It's already pretty much 'off topic' anyway since there were no computer controlled 335 series vehicles.

 

Let's clear a few things up. The truck will run just as before, with exception the check engine light will come on with EGR disconnected- and then only if it's a newer truck with a computer. A 1970's truck has no computer or check engine light. A new truck starts in open loop when cold, and goes into closed loop when warmed up. Bill, even with the EGR hooked up, the truck goes into closed loop operation and stays there once warmed up. If it didn't stay in closed loop, then something would be wrong. I'm not getting personal here, but it is now obvious that you fellas are way behind the curve in computerized engine controls knowledge. Not a problem, not everyone is up on it. That doesn't change the basic facts about EGR's, that they are an emission control device that robs power, by forcing spent exhaust gas back into the engine, to reduce NOX emissions. You are mistaken to think "the majority" of people have emissions tests, they don't. Only a few states have state-wide emissions tests. THE MAJORITY OF STATES AND PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE MANDATORY EMISSIONS TESTS. My state is the third leading state in registered drivers and cars in the country- but emission tests are only required in 3 major cities here. Emission tests are a PITA, and can easily be fooled. Your engine will run better without emission controls than with them, regardless of age or year. I do not make posts without a LOT of hands-on experience to back it up. Nuff said.

To state the "truck will die in a few days", is simply a silly, immature statement. Mechanics have been disconnecting EGR's ever since they first one was installed on a car in 1973- it's common knowledge in most circles (and now it's known here...)

 

Just out of curiosity . . .

why are we ignoring the fact that regardless of the laws enforcement or not, we have a legal and moral obligation to cut back significantly on the garbage we are pumping into the lungs of our children and their children, and we are blowing it of as "stupid" and "who cares"??

I think this bothers me a little - no offense intended to anyone here. I guess I'm just weird.

. . I'll shut up again now.

 

I had an 84 Bronco II that started to run like crap while we were on vacation in Washington state (I'm from Minnesota) When ever I accelerated, it would buck and miss...we finally called back to Minnesota to tell them we would be delayed, and luckily, when I talked to my father-in-law his neighbor was at his house, and he told me to buy a small piece of galvanized tin about the size of a quarter and some silicone sealer and to bolt it under the EGR on the intake. "Seal it good with silicone." I did that, and it never ran better. I never replaced the EGR.

 

When the state of Minnesota decided to begin their boondoggle emissions testing they targeted cars built after 1976 (the beginning of required catalytic converters) That was in about 1990. By that time, the vehicle manufacturers were already going to way more fuel efficient engines and exhaust systems. The emissions levels in Minnesota had already fallen to acceptable levels by the time testing began. The whole testing thing was eliminated when the University of Minnesota proved the air quality had improved BEFORE the testing began. IMHO, emissions testing is a HUGE money making boondoggle for the government. Cars that have bad emissions equipment usually don't last long after the systems begin to go...poor maintenance being the main reason they die.

 

Thanks for your support rick90yj. I'm new to this forum, and it's obvious that the regulars here took liberty to flame me and dog my posts- with the exception of the moderator who was at least civil and mannerly about it. (thanks moderator)

As Rick's post shows, he blocked his EGR and his Bronco ran better. Guys, don't be BS'd into thinking keeping emissions on one lousy car or truck is cleaning the air. The politicians who passed those emission laws don't even know their wrench sizes, and look at mechanics like a dirty profession. Put a BRAND NEW truck in a closed garage, with all emissions hooked up and intact, and start it and see what you smell. Your eyes will burn, and you will die eventually if you stayed there. That's not a clean exhaust either, don't believe it.

What they need is, a cleaner burning FUEL. If you fellas want to drive around with all your emissions hooked up, go ahead. That's an open invitation for a well-tuned older truck to motor on by you, cuz he's making more power. Running EGR's if your local laws don't require it and enforce it, is just plain foolish. That would be like sending income tax in every year, when you are exempt from income tax.

And like I said, the Japs, Europeans, etc. don't have emissions controls at all, and still run leaded fuel.